Any corporate parents out there? Apprenticeships.

[bgmum]

DD has decided on apprenticeship route into corporate career instead of Uni. She’s done incredibly well in getting offers from a number of areas. We’ve got no idea on how to guide her (media/teaching) apart from go with your heart - she’s going round in circles.

1. JP Morgan - 4 years leading to a degree in Applied Finance from Exeter Uni. JPM will not allocate areas of business until A Level grades come in. Bournemouth, away from home.
2. KPMG - 5 years leading to chartered accountancy. Manchester based - home.
3. PWC - 2 years Consulting leading to L4 Certificate from (new as I understand) Chartered MC Institute. Then on to join Grad Scheme for Consulting for 3 years leading to L7 Cert. Manchester based.
4. (Not on table as yet, but just in case that comes through too) Lloyds Banking Audit leading to Chartered Internal Audit L7 qualification. Bristol.

Her instinct is saying PWC because she likes the firm (did work experience there) and because it is client facing. What are your thoughts, corporate gurus? What route makes her a peg in a certain area? What route leads to corporate choice? I have to assume they’re all well respected routes because of status of firms, but am I right? Thank you!

I don’t disagree with anyone above that the accounting qualification is useful - IF you’re happy to do the slog and want that type of job at the end of it.

This is very true. The ACA is definitely a long slog of exams and the necessary work experience. I have a son who's looking at consultancy and I've steered him away from audit/ACA jobs as it's a different career entirely.

Probably worth making the accountancy v consultancy choice first and the second decision becomes easier.

The latter 3 are all going towards a certain career area. Bear in mind the JPM apprenticeship whilst its finance based there is a lot of internal mobility and the Bournemouth site covers a lot of technology groups as well as corporate groups so there are lots of opportunities to see and potentially try more varied skill sets and roles that they may not have considered. I joined as a graduate many moons ago moving down from the North and still here albeit not with JPM anymore and the ongoing programmes seem to improve every year and are exceptionally popular

An accountancy degree doesn't necessarily have to lead to an accountancy or finance job, although admittedly my DH is now a CFO! But I'm an accountant who works in a think tank these days. I meet lots of other accountants in a variety of professions (politicians, journalists, law enforcement, other think tanks!, academia)

All the roles described have 'clients', it will just that some clients will be internal (either same office or another UK office or an overseas office). Client relationship skills will still be required for all of these.

Rather than ask whether roles are likely to be client facing or otherwise, perhaps focus on what the working day will look like.

JPM FS: Based in the complex in the Bournemouth suburbs; you, your peers and bosses may be in the office all or only part of the time (PP can offer insight). Study is block release residentials at U of Exeter, I think (happy to be corrected).

KPMG Audit: If audit, likely to be some physical visits, some time in Manchester city centre office, some home working (mix can vary by client size, sector and location). Study mostly at home with some intensive off-site pre-exam prep sessions.

PwC junior consultant: Pre-covid this was a mix of office (Manchester city centre in this case) and client site providing admin support to the team. Not sure what it would still be the case now. The Manchester office consultancy area might be fairly quiet if a fair proportion of consultants at client or homeworking, but that will vary according to office culture. Study mostly remotely delivered, I think, for this one.

Lloyds internal audit: Based at Bristol office in harbour area but you, peers and seniors may not be in the office for a fair portion of the week, depending on culture and expectations. Study set up similar to KPMG pathway.

For PP who are ACA and extoll its virtues, bear in mind that KPMG school leaver audit is AAT and then ACA; there are exemptions but there will still be more than the 15 exams you had to pass! So you need to be engaged and committed to that route and all that goes with it.

So I’m hearing a resounding no against consultancy. Thanks @blue345 and others.

I'd also avoid the internal audit route - one can become a chartered internal auditor even with the chartered accountancy qualification. Internal auditors tend to get pigeonholed finding it harder to move areas compared to the other.

Regarding KPMG Vs JPM - I'd ask myself what is her personality?

I faced this exact same choice funnily enough less than a decade ago as a graduate. A chartered accountancy vs investment bank operations/tech graduate scheme!

Chartered accountancy is the more stable and well known route. Her future is secure once she becomes chartered. Ex-big4 people can earn a lot moving to financial department roles in industry. And everything else others mentioned. If she decides she wants a degree she can do a top-up at universities like Oxford Brookes but the full chartered qualification is L7 so at Master's level technically.

The JPM grad scheme is more fluid - she'll have to build her own career. Especially if she gets put into something like technology where there are no set qualifications, new things come out daily and she'll have to learn constantly until the day she retires. If she's in an operations role that might tie her to working for banks/financial services, she can move to something else of course but it'll be a more circuitous route. I know someone who started in operations and is now in investment banking which is extremely difficult to enter for graduates and is the pinnacle of highly paid graduate roles for finance.

All those years ago I was burnt out from university and couldn't face the thought of working + sitting more exams so went for the latter, although I'd wanted to be an accountant since I was a teenager. I started as a project management analyst and am now a software developer. It does suit my personality more - I love having completely different challenges to solve each day. But I do worry a bit about my future career thanks to AI. Luckily I have good people skills so I can always transition to a more managementy role 😏

Also bear in mind that a degree is more transferable internationally but so is the chartered accountancy (I'm guessing ACA or ACCA). The internal audit probably not.

Best of luck to your daughter!

@WaitingForMojo - ha! That's why I clicked on here too, excited that people were promoting apprenticeships for care leavers! 😊

Thanks for the balance @pongy . I think it’s really hard for them to know what they want at 18 - especially when interviews are often remote, or in KPMG’s case at a hotel. She has decided to discount JPM @Oblomov24 because they cannot say where they’re going to place apprentices. She’s lucky to have the dilemma.

Thanks @dollahsains for your detailed response. I think she’s going to go KPMG thanks to all the mums’ advice. Interesting about the degree top up, but I think she’s past wanting that if she has CCA. Fab post.

Yes, sorry about that @WaitingForMojo - this is for the more self-centred! I think masters degrees should be given to those who excel in care sector 🤩

Can I just say, Wowsers again. I didn’t expect to get a single response when I posted initial message - you have all been incredibly kind. I think she’ll be fine out there in big wide world if she seeks out women like you 💪

Thanks @PerpetualOptimist , not sure I replied. Very good of you to do your research - helped DD to see clearly.