DD wants to do a law degree

[blondebarbie2001]

So my DD is currently in year 12 and is sitting her mocks. She has decided her career path of law and I think her grades will be okay but a personal statement isn't just grades. I was wondering whether anyone knew how to make her personal statement stand out? Whether any volunteering will benefit her and work experience and where are the best places to find work experience? Also whether there are any good books to read to further her knowledge associated to degrees which will make it stand out?

Unfortunately so far she has done no work experience because she is unsure on where to find them. She has been rejected by the majority of her local law firms. She has 6 weeks work experience at her local primary school helping people read and also participated in a programme where she ran a business and competed nationally. Her business came first in their county final and won best company report, presentation and interview. She was responsible for the presentation. She is also doing EPQ but has not started yet. If anyone can give any advice that I could maybe put forward to her on what to do her EPQ on and how to get high would be brilliant?

[blondebarbie2001]

@EmmaC78 did you have any work experience before you got your degree?

[KERALA1]

Also summer was a time they needed temps as thats was when the secretaries went on holiday ie when I was available. Think law firms less dependent on secretaries now this was late 90s.

[NC4Now]

In terms of visiting the courts, she’s best to look for a sentence hearing, as that wraps up the entire case in one sitting.
If she goes to the front counter and explains why she is there they should be able to advise her on which court room is worth sitting in.

[EmmaC78]

No i didn't. I did try to but never managed to get anything. We did take on work experience students in my old job so it is worth asking around.

[MrsSquiggler]

Of the top of my head, I can't think of any introduction to law type books which focus on individual cases. But the Helena Kennedy one is very readable. She could also try looking through the Supreme Court website for cases that catch her eye, and watch the hearings. Go to the section on decided cases. The videos of the hearings and the decisions are all available. Not a substitute for actually going to a court, but the standard of argument is obviously a step above her local county court etc.

My interview was for Oxford but over a decade ago, I'm sure things have moved on! I would hate to read my personal statement now. I do remember it included some stupid annecdote about a horse riding accident which, cringeworthy as it was, apparently stuck in their mind. So maybe include one little detail which is a bit different and will be memorable, not just work experience etc which everyone will have.

I should include the caveat that I'm not a practicing lawyer. But, law is always a good degree and stands you in good stead for a lot of other careers.

CAB = citizens advice bureau, by the way. Great volunteering experience but they do normally require a commitment of a day a week. Something to look into for the holidays, maybe?

[BubblesBuddy]

I would say you don’t need a law degree to be a lawyer but don’t study a “lesser” subject and expect to get a training contract and, at the moment, there are only 430
Pupillage vacancies available each year after you have trained to be a barrister. It’s well know that some BPTC courses never get anyone into pupillage! Be ultra careful about what degree and where she does it. Oxbridge and RG top tier are still the best places to study.

My DD did over a year at the CAB during her law conversion course. At university she can join law advice centres. It’s really difficult to get something relevant pre degree. Plenty of barristers won’t offer mini pupillages until you are in the final year of a degree. Therefore going into court is a good idea. They produce daily court lists so you can see who is hearing what. Family courts should not be open to the public for child cases.

I think she should be able to talk about what interests her about Law and reading as much as possible is a good idea. Read Law reports in The Times and in the law journals. Have an informed view on the legal debates of the day. DD also spent time with a social services dept and a local authority legal team as she wanted family law. She didn’t read Law so can’t help with the PS but advice above sounds good to me.

[LARLARLAND]

Where (roughly) in the Uk are you OP

[blondebarbie2001]

@BubblesBuddly DD is looking to study at the univeristy of Kent with a back up of Canterbury Christ Church, she does not particularly want to move away from home. I know that Kent is ranked 18th for law but is not a RG as far as im aware. Should i be concerned that she would find it quite hard to get a pupilage if she was to study at either of these universities, even if she does receive the highest degree possible.

[blondebarbie2001]

@LARLARLAND I am located in Kent. Particularly the Medway?Maidstone area

[LARLARLAND]

There are some chambers in London who have barristers who work mainly in Kent. 6 Pump Court are one example so if she is looking for a mini-pupillage she should try them.

[Bluntness100]

My daughter has just completed her law degree, waiting for her results, hopefully Friday, she has done her degree at a top RG uni.

She'd never worked a day In her life before she got accepted. 🤣The unis want the grades, it's that simple. So as and gcse. They will give conditional offers. She was even offered an unconditional from reading, but rejected it (after much angst) for the higher ranked uni with the conditional offer that she wanted and got.

Tell her to focus on her results. The school will help her with her personal statement. Job experience is not what they focus offers on, it's all about thr grades.

The uni you study at for law is important for many employers.

[LARLARLAND]

6 Pump Court have an ‘outpost’ in Maidstone.

www.chambersstudent.co.uk/six-pump-court/true-picture/10516/2

[LuMarie]

For watching court cases - yes there are public galleries and she can go in and watch (quietly and appropriately dressed).

However she/you should be very careful about the cases she sits in on. Criminal cases can be blaze about violent details that are disturbing, civil cases can be a person's personal tragedy that she is intruding on and this does disturb people involved. So it's a good idea as in a personal statement she can say she has attended court and watch cases, this shows interest, but do so very carefully. Also be aware, most lawyers don't actually work in courtrooms.

I strongly second the practicing solicitor saying getting experience to make sure expectation matches reality. It is an unpleasant world, the drama of movies and indeed courtroom is rare and justice equally rare. I've also seen many people leave the profession or change their degree as they realise the reality.

Im concerned by "she struggles to read things that are quite dry if they are quite long" - that is literally law school and legal work! Endless dry long reading.

Maybe find a judgement for a case for something average, like a property dispute or contract, not something rare and glamour, and have a read. Or try to. It is like another language that could well be named "dry and long".

[blondebarbie2001]

@LuMarie by long and dry I'm not too sure what I mean if I'm honest lol. Like she has read books by philosophers explaining their philosophy but could not finish a series of 12 books so I'm not too sure

[blondebarbie2001]

Could someone explain to me what a mini pupil she is please?

[daisypond]

I know quite a few lawyers - solicitors and barristers. None has a law degree. But they all had good degrees in other subjects from top RG universities, but all solid academic subjects.

[blondebarbie2001]

@Bluntness100 good luck to your DD! Hope she gets everything that she was expecting and more!

[Fridakahlofan]

I would second doing a different degree and then converting to law. I did philosophy and felt it helped me stand out when applying for jobs - I ended up at a magic circle firm. I ended up absolutely detesting being a lawyer - the hours made me ill! And I left after 4 years. I'm so glad I did a different degree to broaden my horizons

[Thesearepearls]

Agree with the advice about going in to watch some cases - it can be absolutely fascinating and we did that with DD

You could also apply to public sector departments for some unpaid work experience. I am aware of work experience being provided by the law teams in certain City Councils.

Keep trying the law firms. Offer to do a week unpaid shadowing.

[coastalchick]

I’d agree with some of the PP - she needs to make sure it’s REALLY what she wants, otherwise she’d be better off doing a degree in another subject then converting, as this will give more future options.

I was a litigation partner in private practice and recently left the profession as the stress started seriously affecting my health. It is really a very competitive profession filled with some quite ruthless and nasty types.

If she struggles reading dry long things then maybe think twice about law - a lot of time is spent reading judgments (at least in litigation) or long boring documents (in corporate). It’s not glamorous at all.

If it’s what she really really wants then agree the statement should be more about why she’s suited to the academic study of law. But she ought to get Work ex under her belt ASAP and consistently each year throughout her degree as competition for training contracts is severe, and good grades aren’t enough any more as they are simply expected.

Hope whatever she goes for it works out for her x

[ASqueakingInTheShrubbery]

A mini-pupillage is work experience in a barrister's chambers. Can be anywhere from a day to a week. Get her to look at the websites of any local or commutable chambers; if there's no instruction in how to apply, she can contact the clerks. They'll be very used to similar requests.

[Fridakahlofan]

Also, I don't think she should commit to the barrister path this early (as opposed to solicitor). Until she has studied law she will have no idea what kind of law she likes and/or what kind of lawyer she wants to be. Being a barrister, especially in an area that is well paid,is horrendously competitive. I wouldn't have entered that arena with an oxbridge degree

[Thesearepearls]

Oh I meant to add - the way DD ended up getting work experience was to apply for roles in the summer vacation that were in law firms as an administrative assistant. She got rejected when she applied for work experience as many of the firms do just routinely reject people. But once she got a role over the summer vacation as an admin assistant they let her do bits and pieces of law work and then she became a legal assistant and now they've promised her a job every summer vacation. So broaden out to looking at admin roles in law firms over the summer as well as legal ones.

[MrsSquiggler]

With her predicted grades (especially if A*AA) I do think she needs to be looking at better uni's. If she goes to a local uni just because she wants to stay close to home, it may well harm her future prospects and I think she will come to regret it later. Whether she chooses law or another subject.

The comment about not liking dry and long documents concerned me too!

[JontyDoggle37]

I emailed a number of local judges and got permission from one of them to sit with him and shadow him during his cases for a fortnight. Interesting and horrific in equal measure...