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Time to scrap the £150 fee for victims of domestic abuse

85 replies

MumsnetGuestPosts · 13/01/2021 16:08

Two women are killed each week by a current or former partner and one in four will experience domestic violence in their lifetime.

Legal Aid is a lifeline for women fleeing domestic abuse. It helps them to protect themselves, their children and secures their financial situation. One of the accepted forms of evidence is a letter from a GP.

Since 2016 I have been raising in the House of Lords the outrageous situation whereby GPs can charge the victims of domestic abuse up to £150 for legal aid referral letters that confirm their injuries are a result of abuse thereby enabling the victim to apply for legal aid.

Successive Ministers from the Despatch Box have expressed support for the charges to be waived, but have not taken the opportunity to end this practice. Some GP practices have voluntarily rewritten their charging policies when light has been shone on this little-known fact.

It is true that the majority of GPs do not charge for these letters, but the fact is that a significant minority do and despite all the calls for this to stop, expressions of support for victims, and even the British Medical Association having a policy that no victim of domestic abuse should be charged a fee for a legal aid referral letter. The practise continues to this day.

It was Wythenshawe Safespots, a campaigning organisation based in Manchester, that first alerted people to this dreadful situation and started the campaign to Scrap the Fee.

The Domestic Abuse Bill has recently started its passage through the House of Lords, and I am hopeful that the Bill will be improved during its passage through the Lords with many changes agreed before returning to the House of Commons.

On Monday I tabled a new clause to the Bill which will stop GPs who have a contract with the NHS from charging victims of abuse for legal aid referral letters.

To get this amendment passed in the House of Lords and to be accepted in the House of Commons we need a campaign both inside and outside Parliament to highlight how wrong these charges are, calling on members of both Houses to finally deal with this issue and commit to scrapping the fee once and for all.

It is everyone’s responsibility to play their part to stop domestic violence and abuse and this is the right thing to do on an issue that has been ignored for far too long. There just needs to be the will in Government and Parliament to do it.

OP posts:
Bagamoyo1 · 13/01/2021 23:11

Why do they need legal aid? Shouldn’t solicitors act on their behalf for free? Or is it only doctors who are expected to work for nothing?

VeniVidiWeeWee · 13/01/2021 23:33

@Bagamoyo1

Well said.

NiceandCalm · 14/01/2021 01:22

Agree wholeheartedly but maybe change the title of this thread as I thought, oh god, another scrap the TV licence fee!
You may get more responses?

Torvean32 · 14/01/2021 03:07

@Babyroobs

Hospital Drs used to be able to charge for signing death certificates years ago, not sure whether they still can. i worked on a ward where there were a lot of deaths and there would be one Dr who was always there early on a monday to cash in on the weekend deaths. In my job now I have to deal with forms that go to the DWP to say someone is terminally ill and some Drs still try to claim for signing those. Seems so wrong to me. The Nurses sign the same forms and either aren't allowed to claim the fee or wouldn't dream of doing so.
You're not being accurate here. Drs get a fee if they sign to say the person who has died can be cremated. The reason is that the dr has to be 100% sure that the death is natural. It's a big responsibility. It's not a huge amount of money. And most of the doctors i know donate the money to charity.
ColdCottage · 14/01/2021 04:42

Shame on those who charge. That's so immoral.

Namechangebuttercup · 14/01/2021 06:23

I totally agree with cutting any fee to the patient.

Also agree it should be included in the NHS contract, because one letter once probably isn't going to be an issue but some doctors will have, sadly, a fair few to do as GP practices have so many patients. They absolutely shouldn't be working for free.

It's funny how caring professions are always seen as horrible if they don't do something for free. My lawyer charged me £60 for replying to a short email. I'm not sure doctors' time is any less important?

What's worse is that anybody requiring any letter, other than a fit to fly for a holiday letter, should be charged. It doesn't take much to figure out a great many will be people whose health problems are directly or indirectly related to poverty.

highame · 14/01/2021 08:33

namechange Doctors are paid for by the Tax payer, lawyers are not.

RowanMumsnet · 14/01/2021 09:08

@NiceandCalm

Agree wholeheartedly but maybe change the title of this thread as I thought, oh god, another scrap the TV licence fee! You may get more responses?
We've done this now - thank you
FinallyHere · 14/01/2021 09:16

anybody requiring any letter, other than a fit to fly for a holiday letter, should be charged.

Surely it is reasonable for tax funded GPS to charge for referrals to specialists funded by private insurance

RowanMumsnet · 14/01/2021 09:25

@Thelnebriati

Will this thread be stickied on other boards?
Hello - it's stickied in a few (Active, AIBU, Chat, In The News, Politics, Legal Matters, Mumsnet Campaigns, Relationships, Feminism Chat) - let us know if you think we've missed some
Theunamedcat · 14/01/2021 09:49

@Bagamoyo1

Why do they need legal aid? Shouldn’t solicitors act on their behalf for free? Or is it only doctors who are expected to work for nothing?
Divorce? Child access cases? They need proof that you have been abused not just take your word for it
dappledsky · 14/01/2021 10:00

Totally agree that the patient shouldn't pay themselves in this situation.

If legal aid solicitors get paid for their time and professional expertise working on the case, surely doctors should be paid for their time and professional expertise too?

The issue should be who pays the GPs (who pays the solicitors?) rather than expecting GPs to do this in their free time at evenings or weekends as mentioned above.

WhichOneOfUsIsCaving2 · 14/01/2021 11:05

Need to name and shame these bad doctors.

ErrolTheDragon · 14/01/2021 11:25

Or is it only doctors who are expected to work for nothing?

Doctors don't 'work for nothing' though. This sort of thing should be part of their baseline work, paid for by the taxpayers out of NHS budget. By all means let them charge for extras eg anything travel related.

Legal aid is a means whereby people can employ lawyers, who aren't directly state funded.

Swiftjogger · 14/01/2021 15:30

What’s jumped out at me on this thread are people (presumably posters who are GPs) either justifying it or introducing a straw man argument.
It’s pretty disgusting.

stumbledin · 14/01/2021 15:34

Obviously its wrong that what is efffectively evidence for a legal procedure is charged for. And wonder whether for instance if police had been involved they could provide the evidence needed for the legal aid process to begin.

Part of the problem is that GPs were pushed (or did they jump?) into operating as businesses. Like so much post Thatcher there isn't core funding. It is all contractual and negotiated with local Health Trusts etc.. Dont forget that it is this business model that means most Surgeries no longer provide out of hours service. This will be contracted to some other group of doctors (with very uneven results).

But you would like to think that as Doctors they would run an ethical business and agree amongst themselves that they would do some pro bono work and for instance agree that a letter like this would always be free to those requesting it irrespective of the time taken to do it.

Also, without saying anyone is lying about the cost being £150, from other forums including Money Saving Expert GPs seem to be charging for £15 to £50. So not only should there be an agreement that some letters should also be free, there should be an agreement that a letter from a GP should not be any old amount someone thinks they can get away with!

You would like to think if

stumbledin · 14/01/2021 15:38

Have just seen this on the Government web site and it looks like any number of people could provide the evidence letter to enabel legal aid.

You can ask for evidence from:
the courts
the police
a multi-agency risk assessment conference (MARAC)
social services
a health professional, for example a doctor, nurse, midwife, psychologist or health visitor
a refuge manager
a domestic violence support service
your bank, for example credit card accounts, loan documents and statements
your employer, or education or training provider
the provider of any benefits you’ve received

So maybe legal aid solicitors need to make this clearer to clients.

Link for above advice www.gov.uk/legal-aid/domestic-abuse-or-violence

Swiftjogger · 14/01/2021 15:50

If you dig a little deeper and it’s for medical evidence and you can’t remember who treated you (and who would know the names of the Dr/nurse/paramedic in most circumstances) then the GP needs to do the letter.

Obviously a bank would not be relevant at all unless for financial abuse.

Time to scrap the £150 fee for victims of domestic abuse
BLToutanowhere · 14/01/2021 16:18

If they are injured, then it's medical and any referral to or letter for a third party is exactly the same as a referral to a consultant/clinic/whatever.

A letter saying fit to fly? Fine, charge. But this? No, absolutely not and anyone who's sworn the Hippocratic Oath really needs to take a look in the mirror if they do charge for such a letter.

Endvawg · 14/01/2021 16:21

I had a chat with a woman today who this charge impacted. It impacted her because she didnt get legal representation to fight her abusive ex in court around access to their children, she didnt get a non molestation order to help keep her and her children safe, because she couldnt afford it. This woman had to face her abuser in court with no legal support at all.

This woman at the time was not attached to a dv service she had only disclosed abuse to her dr and subsequently a solicitor once she had left. The only place she could get that letter from was her doctor, her doctor wanted her to pay for it.

Doctors shouldn't be doing work for free, nobody should however the cost for this service should not be picked up by a vulnerable woman who needs the service in order to protect herself. A victim of abuse should never be faced with making a choice whether to feed her family or pay this fee in order to keep them safe.

Sethy38 · 14/01/2021 16:27

@Endvawg

Why didn’t she get legal aid?

Doc note not only evidence required.

What counts as evidence
You’ll usually need to show that you or your children were at risk of harm from an ex-partner.

You can ask for evidence from:

the courts
the police
a multi-agency risk assessment conference (MARAC)
social services
a health professional, for example a doctor, nurse, midwife, psychologist or health visitor
a refuge manager
a domestic violence support service
your bank, for example credit card accounts, loan documents and statements
your employer, or education or training provider
the provider of any benefits you’ve received

Awwlookatmybabyspider · 14/01/2021 16:28

You've definitely got my support and back up on this Lord Kennedy.

Bagamoyo1 · 14/01/2021 16:50

@highame

namechange Doctors are paid for by the Tax payer, lawyers are not.
I assume legal aid lawyers are. Otherwise where does the money come from?
ErrolTheDragon · 14/01/2021 17:16

I assume legal aid lawyers are. Otherwise where does the money come from?

They get paid using public money in the form of legal aid which is precisely why people such as DV victims need legal aid.

highame · 14/01/2021 17:25

In the middle of DV issues, the simplest way is to get a GP letter, initially it may be stop orders or other restrailt orders, or protections. The victim may not have been near a hospital or social services. Low level DV might have been livable with and then escalate. Why are there quibbles about this. These are women suffering domestic violence. Get a f*&%ing grip.

Just written to my MP