Is it usual for G&T children to get little recognition at school?

[Singlemum1985]

My DS is a summer born child, infact a week later and he wouldn't have made it into this year group. He is 5 and in year one, I have been told that he's G&T and various tests put him in the 99.8th percentile for Reading, Literacy and Mathematics. That being said, it hasn't made a blind bit of difference at school! He's either bored or frustrated most of the time at school, although he always does what he's asked he's stopped volunteering any extra. Since the 'tests' and me, poking my nose in as she seems to view it she only ever points out the negative. I'm kind of at the point where I'm just wishing away the rest of this year and hoping for an amazing teacher who he can connect with in Year 2!

Over the last few weeks DS has mentioned a few different things regarding awards and I'm starting to get just as frustrated as he seems to be! Firstly he said that he isn't allowed to know how many stars he has left to earn on his reward chart, but don't worry about it mum as I'll have loads to get! Why's that I asked, he said his teacher never lets him answer a question as he already knows the answer! My point is, how is he ever going to be able to earn these rewards if he isn't given the same chance as everyone else! Secondly he came home (and this is entirely my fault) with a message to say his teacher had said to tell his mum its no good always getting all your spellings correct if you don't know what they mean! As he rarely has to learn his spellings (even though they are differentiated) I forgot to check he knew what compose meant (the phone rang and we never re-visited it) - never mind he could define and spell onomatopoeia! And finally, DS told me last night they have a new teddy in his class they can bring home when they have done excellent work. (Suzie) got it today for remembering Capital Letters, Finger Spaces and Full Stops without being told, that's great I said maybe you'll get a turn next week. His response broke my heart, I won't Mummy - I always remember my punctuation and nobody ever says anything - yesterday I did two pages of writing and used lots of adjectives and (Zane) got a stamp for writing three sentences. Now I'm not saying that both of these children didn't deserve a reward, of course I'm sure they did but despite him being bright he still is just a five year old little boy who craves some attention and recognition of his own!!

Am I expecting too much or being over sensitive? Sorry for rambling away I've storing it up!

WandaFuca thanks so much for your articulate response. Summed up many of my own thoughts and worries - especially the coasting through school! I'm worried when he final hits a level that isn't easy and requires some extra thought and effort he struggle as he hasn't learnt how to cope with failure and keep trying!

Some lovely helpful responses from lots of people thanks for taking the time.

I do think you brought class into the conversation in the first instance BrandNewandImproved.

The tone of your response was why I took offence, but you keep on digging - your doing a really good job 👏🏻!

As for my DS being my PFB, I don't know about you but I would certainly hope that you would treat all your children equally regardless of their order of birth 😜.

As previously stated, although you seemed to skip that sentence too - I have spoken to my child's teacher!

And silly silly me, I just can't seem to find the line where I said my DS deserves constant daily recognition - maybe I've skipping lines like you 😀

You could read the Alfie Kohn books (eg Unconditional Parenting) & all AK's ideas about intrinsic motivation. Might be easier than trying to change what school staff do.

Thanks lljkk I'll definitely look them up! I think I may have to bite tongue and hope that a different teacher in year 2 will make all the difference.

Its a very well known phenomenon that some bright kids, when not challenged, will not respond by continually doing their best, but by disengaging. Its more common in boys. Its also common for girls to seek praise/be praised for efforts like 'tidying the classroom' 'neat handwriting' instead of 'good maths'. Teachers are supposed to learn about this kind of thing so they are aware and prevent it happening (it doesnt work. Boys are still allowed to dominate class discussions. Coasting and disengaging still happens). My kids were sometimes challenged and sometimes ignored (and a bit despised) depending on teacher. Their secondary is much better because it is one of their ofsted criticisms so they try very hard with the g/t cohort.

Clever kids also tend to prefer intrinsic motivation so the sticker chart thing will just amuse him pretty soon i would think

Many low achievers also disengage. Because they know no matter how hard they try they still don't do that well or know what's going on. They're bored stiff.

But some low achievers don't disengage. They bumbled along good natured & never excelling or really understanding, but still trying. Some high achievers don't disengage and maybe even revel in the competition with others. I've seen all types in single classes so I don't think it's the teaching usually, it's the personality of the child that determines whether they disengage.

Thank you BombandierFritz - that's really helpful - especially the bit about boys - sounds very similar to my DS.

And although it shouldn't happen, it's good to know it's not only happening to my DS.

It certainly doesnt just affect high achievers, thats true. But moving the blame to individual personality of student is a cop out.

Its not all about 'blame the teacher' either of course, but it is part of the job to try to engage the students. 5 and 6 year olds we are talking about here - just babies still really :(

Let's face it, some are teaching, because it was an easy option to do so. I'm not saying it's an easy job, but they're not always picked from the intelligent tree are they? Some are very bright but not all are tipping past 120 IQ.

I do hope you home educate to ensure these thickos aren't teaching your children.

I always thought the stickers/reward chart thing was aimed at progress rather than ability. So a child who struggles with spelling but put loads of effort in and manages to get all their spellings right one week will get a sticker as this was a huge achievement for them, but the child who gets them all right every week won't necessarily get a sticker as there is no progress.

DS1 (bright and well behaved) never ever got star pupil, whereas DS2 (G&A but challenging behaviour) frequently did if he had behaved well that week. DS1 quickly twigged that this wasn't because DS2 was better behaved, but because DS1 was consistently well behaved and so there was no progress. He just shrugged and got on with it. Incidentally DS2 used to be asked not to answer all the questions in Reception and Y1 as he had a tendency to take over and not let anyone get a word in edgeways! DD (G&A and well behaved) just ignores the whole system and takes pleasure from knowing that she has done a good job. She is a little older than your DS though, so this attitude may develop in him with time.

Exactly, I completely understand that engaging a whole class of 30 5&6 year olds who range from low ability to G&T is a very difficult job!

I am also well aware my child is far from perfect and I'm sure can cause her a headache as much as all the other children!

I don't expect him to earn rewards for being or doing the best or for being G&T - but some recognition for himself and motivation to go above and beyond is what's needed. I'm worried he'll loose his love of learning and become disengaged.

I'm just really sad, that at five he's already acutely aware how the classroom works and that no matter how or what he does nobody seems to give a damn - unless he makes a small error - then the whole world and his dog knows about it!

The problem there jemima is the kids who always get their spellings right would never get a sticker as it is impossible to progress beyond 100%. Some schools do that.

We have turned the school reward chart into a bit of a joke in our house as it doesn't seem to matter how hard DS tries he never seems to get anywhere near a reward. Things like the outstanding worker award which is given out every week seems to just work its way round the class without much bias towards the kids who do do outstanding work. DS has won it once, he is competitive so he would like to win it every week but he does think it's fair.
I suspect that the teacher thinks that because DS is G&T he doesn't work very hard, doesn't have to. In reality DS is G&T because he works very hard indeed (it helps that he is bright) he never stops thinking about literacy and maths, it takes up most of his time but because he crouses through year 1 work it looks like it has all come with no effort.
The next problem is that because he finishes the work early he doesn't have a lt to do for most of the time. He gets paired with the less able kids but he is only 6yo and not equipped to teach them so they do end up just messing about.
The best thing his teacher did for him this year was Ven reading which seems to be just sending him into another class for literacy, DS loves it.

moving the blame to individual personality of student is a cop out

Cop out or opportunity?

It's an opportunity to learn skills. They are small & do have plenty to learn, like how to deal with boredom, waiting their turn, not taking the limelight every time just because you can, letting others have a go even if you can do better, having a go even if you aren't the best, finding intrinsic rather than extrinsic motivation if possible, recognising own achievements rather than basing self-esteem on comparisons with others, encouraging your friends to do their best, etc. Clever-clogs kids need to learn to be patient with others & try not to gloat or boast; they will have a LOT of this challenge if they have years in school with other people.

But tbh, I always think that if kids are demotivated then they don't enjoy the social life. I'd put the social life as top of the list factor for whether kids do well in school.

I know this is not much help but all your experiences, plus some, are why we moved our G&T DD from state to private at Year 5 instead of joining in Year 7. Wishing we had done it sooner! I also realise that this is not an option for many people.
She was almost dismissed by the teachers as bright enough that no extra effort was required. She spent a lot of time helping others and was never praised or encouraged, we often felt that she was learning to feel she had to hide her intelligence. Obviously we would never have wanted her to think she was above anybody else but recognising her talent is important. At private school she flourished, encouraged to compete and improve herself. She no longer found all her work easy because they were challenging her. She blossomed and we have never regretted it. As a former teacher myself I know that everything the private school does for her is perfectly possible in a state school, it just isn't part of the culture there. We are lucky that private was a choice for us.

I am really disappointed lljkk. Of course, it is an opportunity to learn the skill of dealing with intense boredom and the dislike of those (not just fellow pupils) who notice their abilities. That is precisely why some children disengage! It is the job of the teacher to try to make the task interesting and to encourage an attitude of achievement being a good thing, not something to hide because of mockery. Entire government papers have been written offering guidance to teachers on how to ensure high achievers do not underachieve. They do not have chapters entitled 'underachieving and why it is a good thing really for learning soft skills' or 'dont worry teachers it just comes down to persomality really so its their problem not yours'

Op you might be interested in the website
www.crushingtallpoppies.com

If its of any interest, OP, I have two boys who are both G&T and have experienced what you are describing continually throughout primary school and now at secondary.

I can't even begin to estimate how many different people have taught them now, but I can only think one teacher who actually seemed pleased that my child learned easily. By coincidence, it was a Y1 teacher (who was coming up for retirement).

When the lack of reward became a big issue, I'd speak to the teacher concerned. I've had various responses from "I'll look out for it" to the outstanding teacher who said "TBH your DS is well behaved, understands everything and does exactly what i ask, so he's easy to forget".

Ds2, is quite sharp sometimes in his observations of how adults work. I think he was about 9 when he told me with a big smile how he plays the teacher at her own game. he said that when he gets fed up always being ignored, he puts up his hand every chance he gets until she finally asks him. Then he deliberately gives the wrong answer. He said that after that the teacher would look surprised, but interested and she'd choose him the next few times, until she got fed up getting the correct answer again.

So, as I said in my last post, its normal. It happens all the time and there's nothing that can be done to change it (and yes, it upsets the children because they know its unfair).

Thanks for he link BombadierFritz - was a very interesting read!

var123 - it's interesting you say that as my 5 year old DS has already started doing just the same. He told me the other day that he put his hand up to ask how to spell 'quiet' not because he didn't know how to spell it but because it meant his teacher would have to come over to see what he wanted and he'd get to show her hid work! Bless him, I think for all the comments it's something we're just going to have yo ride out. I'm sure with age he'll learn to let it wash over him!

Bombadier I think the point is that the work should be differentiated sufficiently that it presents enough of a challenge to warrant the effort to get a sticker. Likewise with behaviour/conduct in class - if a very well behaved child goes above and beyond, eg supporting a peer or helping a new child settle then they should be awarded a sticker. Ultimately though the sticker system is a carrot for children not doing quite as well as the school would like and not much is going to change that.

Well put jemima , agree with every word. If the brightest aren't being stretched enough to be able to earn stickers that is a failure of the teacher. If the most well behaved aren't getting recognition because they are always quietly well behaved that is also a failure of the system.

When I visited my sons school
the thing his teacher was doing well was ignoring him when she was asking normal questions then asking a particularly tricky question and letting him answer that. That is the kind of differentiated teaching all children deserve.

When DS2 was in Y5, the teacher took it a step further: she used DS to boost other children. e.g. they'd be playing a quick recall arithmetic game.
Two children at a time would be asked a question and the one who called out the answer first, went onto the next round. DS would win easily and all the children knew it, but they didn't seem to mind losing to him. However, sometimes someone would come close and the teacher would feign deafness to DS's answer and declare the other child the winner. Even when the other child would tell the teacher that Ds said it first, she'd insist that she was right.
It gave the other child a boost. I often had one of them come up to me glowing with pride and tell me that they beat DS that day. However, DS hated the injustice, because after all he was just a child too.