how to choose books to challenge, with, erm, suitable content?

[siiiiiiiiigh]

Bookworm 10 year old girl - reading at 14 year old level, comprehension matches.

Anyone have resource which "screens" books for content? I really don't need her having any more information about sex, drugs or rock'n'roll than she already has.

She's 2 years behind in maths, so, she's a funny mix.

She could try Agatha Christie - nice clean murders and a pure puzzle approach with quite challenging vocab and grammar. The great thing about these is that if she gets hooked, there are loads and libraries always carry lots of them.

At that age I was on a sci-fi and fantasy kick. The hobbit and lord of the rings. The pawn of prophecy and it's sequels by David Eddings. The lensmen books by ee Doc Smith. Any of Azimov's short stories. I read Dune when I was 10 but you may want to check that one before letting your DC read it. Anne mcCaffrey's pern books, starting with Dragonsong.

Agatha Christie is a great call.

Times are a changin' folks.

The three Hunger Games books are now in AR's top 20 favourites for 'high-achieving' readers in Y6 and that will largely be the girls. This is a recent change that's worth contemplating.

My 10yo is summer-born Y6 and asked to read HG last summer. I talked her out of that but she read them eventually, it caused no harm whatsoever and afterwards she informed me HG is now her second favourite after Warrior Cats (decent enough team-written series fiction)

She likes her maths and read "Curious Incident.." prior to her 10th birthday, we talked about this and that and again there was no damage. With a small nudge that led to a voracious (original) Sherlock Holmes phase and a recent request to read The Woman In White: "Do you think I'm old enough to read that now?" after school used an extract for comprehension. She can try and we'll find out.

On another track she has enjoyed lots of Garth Nix where the Abhorsen series has Sabriel and Lirael despatching the demonic dead. Ditto for Pullman's 'His Dark Materials' with it's potentially child-troubling elements, '13 Treasures' with bad fairies etc.

I wasn't there, but perhaps times are a changin' back because some of this stuff isn't a million miles away from Grimm's.

We've had safer children's classics too and I used to fret about the above kind of reading material, but I've learnt to trust her with it. We still have filters for the obvious sex & drugs and also anything that might encourage her to become become some premature preening teenage girl obsessed with looking beautiful (HG intially worried me a little for the angst re. boys as well as the violence). Lovesick vampire books will never be invited to enter this home.

I wouldn't be comfortable with DD reading the second half of Mockingjay until she is at least 11, if not older.

Graphic descriptions of war atrocities and planning of methods of suicide are not really primary school material, in my opinion.

YY to Anne McCaffrey. I still enjoy them now, and can't wait to introduce DD (and DS2) to those.

wow, this is great stuff! Thanks, folks.

Yep, I'm fine with her reading a bit of eyebrow raising stuff - just not the graphic sex, really.

It's more the use of language and clever plot lines I'd like her to try. Mainly because she gets a kick out of it - though, goes to show how much I know, she's already read a heap of those listed on here.

That's a good point about Grimm, which, naturally, she's read. Not a million miles away from Hunger Games.

Anyhoo, we're just ordering a long-awaited kindle. She's been saving up and finally has enough, so, this list is just brilliant. thanks.

keep em coming if you have any more suggestions!

"I wouldn't be comfortable with DD reading the second half of Mockingjay until she is at least 11"

I understand that perfectly, nevertheless at DD's school it is some quite inoffensive, decent Y6 girls taking that in their stride. I suspect part of the reason is because they simply haven't got the experience to bring the same things to the words that we might.

Phillip Pullman's dark materials trilogy is fab.

Oh, please don't waste Philip Pulman on a 9 year old! There is absolutely no reason for a 9 year old to read books intended for older children just because they can!

How about Hilary MacKay? And Agatha Christie's a good suggestion. Eva Ibbotson, Karen McKombie for light relief. Noel Streatfield, Some Ann Fine, some Jaqueline Wilson if she must. Try Anne McCaffery. Louisa M Alcott. Anne of Green Gables. There are loads of suitable! age appropriate books..........

I'd second Anne McCaffrey - specifically the Dragonsinger trilogy which were written specifically for the YA market and are ideal for a 10 y/o girl, especially as they have such a great heroine (I'd say some of the Pern books aren't so suitable myself).

Another author I'd really recommend for fabulous use of language and imagery is Frances Hardinge - A Face Like Glass is excellent, and perfect for a 10 y/o advanced reader.

I haven't read it myself, but dd really liked The Girl who Circumnavigated Fairyland in a Ship of her own Making & sequels.

BTW if you want clever plot lines, try Frances Hardinge's Fly by Night. Mad fantasy/alternate history mix, kind of Wolves of Willougby Chase meets steampunk (and I think Eponymous Clent has one of my favourite character names).

Also I assume she's read Diana Wynne Jones (Chrestomanci series, Howl's moving castle series etc etc)?

Nothing wrong with Phillip Pullman for a 10 yr old. Had some y6 children read it in the past who thoroughly enjoyed them & had some fantastic insight into characters, plot etc. Don't underestimate them.

Q: If you were recommending your books to a child, what would you tell him or her?

Philip Pullman: I'd say: "You are forbidden to read these books. They're too old for you, and they're full of things you shouldn't experience yet, like sex and violence and dangerous ideas about religion. I'm putting them up here, on this shelf, and I'm going out for an hour or so. You're not to touch them."

Sharing my experience in the hope it's helpful.

Firstly I don't think the 10yrs chronological age, 14yrs reading age is a particularly difficult or uncommon situation. The lower maths age is interesting though.

My 3 never had reading books censored in any way. I did (and still do for the 14yr old) stick pretty closely to age guides on films/DVDs.

It was clear early on that if something was too old/ not right for them they tended to " self censor" - not read the book any more ( so never do the stupid school thing - " you must finish that"!) .

I think kids read and see stuff at a level they can imagine. So murders will be clean things etc.

My only concern perhaps is Jacqueline Wilson - so close to kids experiences maybe? Mind you again maybe it's my adult head looking at them. The suitcase kid made me howl, but didn't affect dd1 and I couldn't read the cat mummy but she did!

Absolutely the older books noël street field etc but be aware they are much more " wordy" (and all the better for it) than today's kids books.

It'll only be a year or so before they have the run of a secondary school library anyway lol

Like all precocious readers though I was reading all sorts at my grans in the summer from that age - a very odd mix from very adult books to Arthur ransome ( do try swallows and amazons!) and I turned out ok.....I think lol ( I'm sure jaws and Dennis Wheatley just went whoosh over my head!)

HolidayC Curious incident of the dog has a recommended reading age of 13 from the Booktrust and won a prize for teen lit so while I see OP did say no more sex otherwise I don't think it's an unreasonable suggestion. The adultery etc is looked at through the teen's eyes not a graphic portrayal.

Well, obviously I'm not suggesting banning them! Just not putting them in front of her and saying here, you might like this until she's a bit older. If she finds them for herself, then so be it- but the OP is asking for suggestions, presumably to buy or borrow.

My 11 year old is really engrossed in Ender's Game, she read it last year because she could but didn't like then. She told me she understands it better now and it's really good.

That's interesting. I liked Ender's Game, but it hasn't crossed my mind that it would work for DD now or in the near future. I haven't thought this through, but she's a little bit that (Ender's) way and wonder what she might take from the book.

Do let us know if your DD suddenly becomes rationally, strategically ruthless.

Nothing wrong with a 9 year old reading Phillip Pullman! If the 9 year old has the maturity to appreciate the books. There are better books to read though.

Of course ther's nothing wrong with a 9 year old reading Philip Pulman- but why?

I just don't understand this push for kids to read books that are wildly outside their age range- there's nothing wrong with waiting. Reading doesn't have to be challenging, you know!

Well, one could ask why anyone wanted to read him (I'm not particularly a fan, not a hater either, I think they are good, but I just think he's been overpraised and it has gone to his head somewhat) - because they might want to, is the usual answer. There isn't actually an age before which you cannot read a book (or after which you should not. Natch. ;) ). There may be an age before which most people cannot appreciate a book, and similarly after which the dead inside fail to appreciate a book - but that is very much an individual thing. There are books which are decidedly unsuitable for precocious young readers - I remember one book going round my class when I was about 12, 'Devil's coach horse' it was called, it was VILE (and barely literate, as it happens) but we all read it. Yukky. I wish I hadn't. I did refuse to read The Omen when that went round because I'd realised I had limits. Similarly with the Jacquie Collins horrors and that incest in the attic thing (which I saw in the Young Adult section the other day). But Phillip Pullman's works don't remotely fall under that heading (actually, DD1 found the mortal engines books more disturbing than the his dark materials ones - didn't stop her reading them though). I don't think that the Pullman books are challenging, incidentally. Boring books are challenging. Badly written books are challenging. Interesting books (whether well written or not, to be honest) are a joy.

I didn't push DD1 to read them when she was 8 - her teacher at school did. She loved them. But not as much as DWJ so there's that to be thankful for.

DD2 is currently agitating like MAD to read GoT. Obviously she can't. But only because of the rude bits - she knows the story inside out because it's been the most frequent topic of conversation in our house for many years. The books have now (somewhat late in the day for us) been imbued with mystical properties since they have transformed dyslexic reading refuser DS (14) into a complete book addict (he's read more than 2500 pages in the last 3 weeks). Essentially, they're either magic or crack. Or both.

I don't think it matters really what you read if you come across it for yourself- but the OP specifically asked for books to "challenge", and I feel very strongly that treating reading like the high jump- you've jumped that so we'll put the bar up a notch- is wrong. Which is why I'm saying that giving Philip Pulman (to use him as an example) to a 9 year old because you think it will be good for them is not a good thing to do. If they find them, read a page and want to read more- fine. Reading should be a personal thing- searching through the family bookshelves, or the library or Amazon for yourself. On another thread I've acceded to ds's request to find him some more books- but I will just give him the list of titles and let him get on with it.

Ah, I see what you mean...yes, to a large extent I agree. It does seem silly not to point the kids in the direction of amazing books we already own rather than buying new ones because the cover is shiny...but I completely agree that reading shouldn't be about point scoring. DD1 and I are currently in a war of attrition over a whole load of history books I bought myself (OK, I thought they might be interesting to her too, from an A level perspective, but I bought them for me because I wanted them so there was no risk in the purchase -they were wanted, they would be read). She keeps half inching them from my room, I keep stealing them back. My kids so, on the whole, place a lot of faith in my book knowledge though, mainly because I made them in my own image and they all think that while I'm crap at a lot of things, I'm very good at the important stuff (recommending books, films, telly, music and plays).

Ok, OP here to stand up for myself and my parenting choices...

I did say "challenge" - because, erm, that's what I meant - but, not because I want to croon "oh, has your child not finished Biff and Chip yet?"

Having a chronically ill brother means that you are continually overshadowed. That can't be helped, I do my absolute best, and, it's never going to be enough until I can get the day to be 36 hours long.

I'm looking for ways for her to have an ego massage, and to be "famous for reading" (I haven't given her Ms J's Prime) because her peers will value that, and, the child needs every bit of confidence she can get. Just like anyone.

She's not the sporty one, she's not the smart one, she's not the pretty one, or the funny one, she's the reading one - and, there's not a damn thing wrong in me noticing that, indulging it and celebrating it. And, of course, part of me wants to stretch the "lead" she has on the #2 Reader in the class, because, once she's "overtaken" she'll lose her fame and, she needs it for the time being.

No, of course reading does not need to be challenging. But, if you get a kick out of being seen with Big Books and your teacher notices that you're reading classics, and your vocabulary is stretched because of the breadth of your reading - and, importantly, you learn that you are GOOD at something, what's wrong with it?

In my mind it might make up for all the tearful struggles with her x4 table. AND, I can reward her for good or thoughtful behaviour with "oh, here's a book you can get your teeth into", which is like catnip for her.