Chemist tested me for diabetes - sent me to the Dr TODAY urgently...please come and talk to me...

[MyHeadWasInTheSandNowNot]

These are my questions

1: The reading the chemist got was 20 - can anyone tell me what this means (ie how 'serious' it is) and if they think it could be controlled and/or preferably gotten rid of through diet and exercise.

2: What will the Dr do today.

The rest is whittering background.

Also, I just wanted to say that I'll have to go in about an hour and wont be able to get back on line until tomorrow afternoon, but I haven't done a runner and will be grateful for any help/advice.

[I'm a regular - I've namechanged because I'm not sure yet if I want to tell anyone or not and I have a few RL friends on MN. It's not that I mind people knowing as such it's just that I don't want it to turn into A Big Deal]

I have been wondering for quite some time if I might have diabetes. A few things have made me wonder about it such as

• Excessive thirst (always having to have a bottle of water on me)

• Eyes a bit blurry at night (been blaming the overhead light and the small tv screen with tivo bright red background and only a problem at night and spending too much time looking at screens)

• Occasional 'shakes'

• I am overweight and struggle with feeling like my 'blood sugars' aren't right

...but what made me 'man up' to getting tested was that last week & yesterday I had a couple of episodes of light headedness/feeling faint when doing things such as changing a lightbulb, I had also been having them in the shower, but put that down to it being hot/steamy etc

I called the chemist about a year ago to see if they did the tests, but ended up not going

I also went to my Dr about 3-4 years ago with constant tiredness and no real reason for it.... he put it down to my weight (which although I'm overweight was not stopping me doing anything, being reasonably fit etc), he really wasn't interested in looking further. I haven't been back, but am and have been pretty much constantly tired since before then. I know I should have seen another Dr but it's hard when you are overweight and they don't seem interested in seeing past that and accept their might be something other excess weight causing the problem.

I wonder now how long I might have had it for and thus how much damage I might have done already to my body, especially my eyes, that's pretty scary.

I was already overweight, but I was pretty fit - then something quite lifechanging happened and I've put on more weight, stopped exercising and I am not unfit. I'm certainly not can't move off the couch unfit - I could still easily walk 4 miles, run for the bus (i'd be panting but I could do it and would recover pretty quickly) - but something else I've noticed (just yesterday I really 'thought' about it) is that I have been putting off doing stuff like walking places (now I take the car), running up the stairs (now only ever walk), kicking the ball about with the kids etc and I realised yesterday it's because when I do I feel awful - not just tired/worn out but light headed and a bit pukey - it's been a gradual thing.

I am totally committed to exercising - a minimum of 30 minutes every day without fail (have just been for an hours walk - about 3 miles) and to improving my diet (which I fully accept hasn't been great for a while, since this 'thing' happened and for a wee bit before then).

I'm not looking for any magic cure - I just want to know if I can get rid of the diabetes through diet and exercise.

Thank you if you made it this far - or even if you didn't wade through it all but can help.

I agree, keep up the walking as even gentle activity helps lower blood sugar.

Drastically changing diet often leaves people feeling awful for a few days as the body adapts - headache, tiredness, flu like symptoms are common.

BIWI I guess I'll just have to test and see wont I :)

I just want to stress, it was not BIWI - absolutely NOT BIWI - who 'told me off' for not being committed to low-carbing. BIWI has been totally and unconditionally supportive :)

Tazzle thank you for your long and lovely post. I've read it several times and have taken on board everything you said and I will keep reading it! You are very patient waiting for your Doc to come back off of his/her holidays... I'm an impatient pants and would have seen someone else! You will let me know when you get them back wont you!

MrsHP my Hba1c was 9.3 and my fasting was 10.9. I'm feeling quite good today actually - thank you for asking! :) As I said, I skipped dinner last night (just wasn't hungry or hungry enough to cook - not sure which really?) but I spoke to a friend on the phone for a couple of hours (she lives overseas) and faffed around a bit and ended up feeling hungry quite late (midnightish I think) but I was still wide awake and a bit Friday-night-ish so I had some cheese, avocado & seeds - it felt very naughty, but very nice :) and put me in a better frame of mind about what I can & can't eat (sadly that's been knocked on the head a bit today, but last night I was happy about it).

I was still in two minds whether to get the package this morning or not before work but the postman knocked the door (when I was in the shower, dashed out in just a towel poor man!) and he had a package for me which was just the next batch of lancets and test strips, so I knew the other package was the meter, so I raced around and collected it before work - no time to look at it or try it though.

I don't have too much planned this weekend, quiet night in today and probably mostly stuff around the house and some jobs tomorrow - thrilling life I lead I was going to see a friend tomorrow but she has a hidious cold and I really don't want it just now.

What are you up to?

Sazpops :) Thank you for popping by. I'm counting on your menu updates you know!! (details re postman & monitor in post above!) Thank you so much for your kind posts x

Mirry thank you too and you SCOTCH

I was feeling that way before SCOTCH - I have been for a few years (that sounds awful written down, but I kept putting it down to stress, bereavement, redundancy, other stresses, not sleeping etc). If anything, I've felt much better since I changed my WOE. Other than the headache the other day, which I think was probably caffine withdrawl!

God, caffeine withdrawal is hideous! I sympathise massively with you

Breaking News

Well, not really but... I have taken my first reading, it was all quite exciting really [I'm a bit geeky, I quite like testing, recording, doing averages etc] and it didn't hurt too much (my finger is a bit sore now, but I think that was more me squeezing it!). The accu-check nano doesn't seem to need much blood and the fastclix lancet does seem pretty gentle (nothing like the horrible one they use to test you before you give blood, I'm going to take my lancet when I'm allowed to give blood again!!)

Anyway, I took it 1.5 hours after eating. I ate about 120g of red cabbage, 3 mushrooms, 2 small-medium carrots and about 75g of Homous. (3 hours earlier I'd had about 120g of Total (full fat) yogurt.

.... and it was 7.4 NICE says under 8.5 for T2's and under 7.8 for non diabetics, so that seems pretty good to me.

Ooh, well done myhead, that's a reassuring reading. Hopefully you can finally start working out what you can and can't eat.

No more exciting recipes at the moment - I'll keep you posted! I think I mentioned the sugar free jelly ? I find the sweetener in it a bit 'after-tasty' but DH doesn't mind it and it gives him a bit of a sweet treat. I put a few frozen berries in it, it's nice with some greek yogurt as well. In face my DD gave me some individual jelly moulds for Christmas, so you can make quite a fancy looking pud with minimal carbs.

in fact, not in face!

Sazpops that sounds interesting. At this stage I'm not too keen on using artificial sweetners, I've always stayed away from them, but to lower carbs and yet be able to drink vodka & (slim) tonic I may have to sacrifice that principle!... and may do so in desserts/cooking later on. Right now I'd settle for a few berried in my yogurt being OK as I really don't like Total without something in it. I have a soy yogurt that has the same carbs and 'from sugars' as the Total stuff, but as soy milk isn't sweet like cow milk & cream it has beet sugar added to it. I'm curious to see if they both have the same affect on my bsl.

BIWI - yes, it's 'orrid! But I like lattes - not black with cream and I was concerned they might be slowing down my weight loss. It seems to have picked up since I stopped drinking them, but it could be co-incidental as I've changed other things as well.

Op that BG reading must make you happy! Maybe you 'll feel less stressed as well.

I don't really like using sweeteners, but if it means DH can have an occasional dessert or sweet treat, it's worth it. There's not really an alternative I don't think.

I just thank goodness I don't have to spoil my gin with slimline tonic . Speaking of which, it's Saturday, it's quarter past six ......

Coffee is an interesting one. Dr Atkins, in his first edition of The Diet Revolution, said that coffee was not to be drunk if you were low carbing because it provoked an insulin release. Dr Charles Clark (The New High Protein Diet) says the same thing. But by the time Atkins book was re-released, in the 90s/early 2000s, he had changed his mind!

On top of the coffee, of course, is the amount of milk that you might have in it - which makes it very carby as well - and a latte is basically just milk! So it's probably just as well you've cut them out.

And re the vodka - how about drinking it with sparkling water and a chunk/squeeze of fresh lime? Then you're not drinking anything artificially sweetened.

Good news with your readings!

Myhead that looks like a good start 7.4, under 8.5 after two hours is the aim according to NICE guidelines (2008) as you say. I might suggest testing before meals too initially? Only because I think that will give you an idea of the change in your levels - if you start higher, then you'll end up higher even without eating carbs if that makes sense. Testing before and then two hours afterwards I find helpful as it allows me to see how different things have affected me. Of course, annoyingly, there is no simple formula that will tell me how much something will affect me and same amounts of same carbs sometimes affect me differently on different days (as a maths teacher, this is the most frustrating thing ever, give me a formula and I'd be sorted!!!).

I have been out at the farm this afternoon for a party with DD which lovely, if chilly! Tomorrow we are going for a walk in the morning followed by a pub lunch with some friends so looking forward to that.

I would also say, like you did yesterday, try to listen to your body (I am rubbish at this - see food and want it even if not hungry often!). When I really focus on this, I am happier with smaller portions more often which keeps my blood sugars a bit more stable. Otherwise if I miss a meal, I am starving by the next on, then eat too much too quickly etc etc ec.

I have ben avoiding all fruit, including berries recently as I am trying to be super strict with blood levels (ttc) and have been using vanilla powder in my greek yoghurt. It is delish, it seems really expensive in the shop (£3.50 or something) for what looks like a tiny point, but it has last me for a month so far and is only half used! No carbs in that and is tasty...

Have a lovely evening!

Some interesting reading towards the bottom about coffee, caffeine and decaffinated and effect on insulin and diabetes here

Biwi, yes, sadly latte seems to be hideous stuff as far as bs spike are concerned - and anything else milky, seems to put up bg much much more than you'd think from the carb content. Americano black, or with a splash of milk is the rather unsatisfactory solution when I go to a cafe. At home I use double cream!

Headinthesand, don't be scared to add in more fat to your diet.
Fat does not make you fat! Carbs make you fat - no need to avoid natural fats on your meat, butter, cheese, cold pressed olive oil and raw coconut oil. However, do avoid anything hydrogenated, and any other vegetable/seed oils and margarine - all full of chemical residue from manufacture processes and very omega 6 heavy (not good). And you do need to eat something - few carbs means more protein and fat!

Great news about your bs reading being in a reasonable place , something you should be looking at is your 3 hrs after eating bs reading, you want that to be around baseline so if fasting bs is around 4.8 to 5.2, you want it to be at that level or very close to it 3 hrs after eating - it may take a wee while to get there but I think with low carb you will get there as you are already responding - really important to avoid carb creep for a while - I know it's very tempting to add on a little more if the numbers start to look better but try not to do that for a few months get things stable first and you may then find you can add in a bit more carb (because your weight loss will change you insulin resistance too, with a little luck!).

Head, obviously I was meaning others don't need to avoid the fat on their meat as that won't apply to you!

Mirry - I was a lot like this

I really don't know how much it means in the scheme of things!

Sazpops - No, I don't think there is an alternative really. I wasn't saying I don't think anyone should use them, I just don't like them... but hey ho, that might have to change!! Enjoy your Gin unsullied

BIWI - Yeah - I think it's more the milk than the coffee/caffine for weight loss, but having read Think Like A Pancreas today, I'm even more confused about what I should or shouldn't be eating He's all about balancing carbs & going low fat... I can't do completely low carb and low fat. I need to have another read and a bit of a think. He also has a bit to say about ketones and not having a ketone reading (ie being in ketosis). It was quite a lot to take in and I need to read it again to decide what to do. I'm loving the weight loss - but can't afford to do any damage or completely halt the production of insulin or its reception. I'll have another read tomorrow.

I thought about sparling water with vodka (I drink sparkling water a lot - not sure if it's good or not, but I've also cut back on that a lot just in case - though I have one on the go now :) ) I debated the point in my head while standing in the supermarket last night, but at the time decided that I needed a fall back in case it was horrible

MrsHP - Yes, I fully intend to test before meals too, but I was at work and hadn't had time to open it up, have a look, set it up etc before I went to work - I did the after test when I got home. I'm totally with you on the 'give me a formula and I'd be sorted' this adding in variables messes with my brain It sounds like a lovely weekend you have planned!! When you say you are happier with smaller portions more often - how often would you say you eat? Most of the things I've read say it's best to go 3 hours (at least) between food to give your body time to 'settle' before 'asking' for more insulin. Which isn't a problem for me at all - if the food on offer is 'boring' I can go without easily - I'm more 'hungry' when 'nice' things are on offer/an option. Good Luck with the TTC!! Were your diabetic when you had your DD? Are you still on metformin/what dose? (sorry if you have said, as you can imagine, my brain is a tad overloaded!!). The vanilla powder sounds good - doesn't it raise your levels at all?? (If not, where should I go to get some? - I've never seen it?!). I'll have a look at your link in a minute - thanks!

SCOTCH - I have a coffee machine at home - I will try just the coffee with double cream if I get desperate for a 'fix' but I much prefer latte - of course!!

Fat doesn't make you fat, but fat & carbs together make you fat and if I'm not going to stay completely low-carb then too much fat will surely make me fatter??

Why are things like avocdo oil high in manufacturing chemicals when olive oil isn't?

(I've never eaten margarine (well, not at home, obviously I have when I've been out/bought sandwiches etc) and do try to avoid hydrogenated/palm.

Omega 6 is bad now? When did that happen??

OK - will add 3 hrs to my testing as well. I'm going to look like Polly Pincushion aren't I

Is it just a little or a lot weird that I'm quite excited about checking my fasting bloods tomorrow morning!?

... and tomorrow I will do the 3 hrs after test too. Probably not tonight as I would like to be asleep by then, but if I'm not, I will.

Re the low carbing - have you read Gary Scheiner's 'Think Like A Pancreas' ? He has me a bit worried about low carbing.

Head, obviously I was meaning others don't need to avoid the fat on their meat as that won't apply to you!

myhead I was diagnosed in 2004 and had DD end of 2009. Pregnancy though and lack of carefulness on my part in the year after her birth have led me to have much more difficulty with control now. I take 850g twice a day of metformin.

With the testing. my diabetes team suggest testing sometimes after one hour and sometimes after two. Interestingly they haven't suggested after three hours but instead before meals which I guess might give similar readings, as in 'normal' in between readings?

With the meals I don't think I explained it well tbh, sorry. I mean I try to eat more slowly and stop when full as opposed to eat the 'portion' that has been made. That way I tend to eat my three meals but less at each one rather than getting stuffed at breakfast, skipping lunch then be starving and likely to eat too much or the wrong things before or at dinner. Clear as mud?

No, be excited about fasting test tomorrow. Do you mind me asking if you decided to take metformin or not? I promise not to judge, just wondering...

6.3 before eating. Will be back! Dinner looks good, not sure it's meeting anyone's criteria though

What is it?

One vegetarian sausage - 6g protein, 3g carbs
Mushrooms fried in butter
Cauli, brocolli, courgette & spinach steamed in 1tsp of oil & water, then large spoon of philiadelphia and about 50g of cheddar cheese and a gloop of double cream to loosen it. I weighed everything then realised it the scales had been knocked onto ml instead of gm - bugger, but hey ho. Not sweating the small stuff.

Right so first test in an hour?

MrsHP - I imagine it was hard in the year after you had DD to prioritise eating 'properly' and not indulging in coffee shop meet ups with other mums with coffee & cake!

Does it worry you how you will control it during your next pregnancy or the affect that will have on your diabetes?

I see what you mean about meals, that makes sense. I need to start cooking earlier - I tend to leave it until I'm hungry which wasn't a problem when I was eating 'easy' stuff but it is when I'm cooking (rather than making a sandwich or toast), I ate it like I'd never been fed!! LOL Though I didn't eat it all - which is unusual for me, this low carbing is certainly helping!

Do you test one hour after you start eating or one hour after you stop eating? I've read both (not that I suppose it makes that much difference).

Do you mind me asking if you decided to take metformin or not? I promise not to judge, just wondering...

You can ask anything - I'm a completely open book :) I am still undecided. I have listened to everyone on here, the bloke at the eye test, I've read 'Think like a pancreas' and a million pages on line. I'm basically thinking - why not? I can always stop taking it later and it might help now. I have two days out on the 20th and the 23rd which would be very difficult and embarrassing if I'm suffering with the side effects (which is likely as I have a bit of a delicate stomach with meds) so I thought I would leave it until after then and use this time to test my levels without it. It's only a couple of weeks.

For low carb info, read robb wolf paleo solution - his blog is free, has lots of science if you want to read into it, and the diet doctor blog, he is very big on self testing of bs even in "normal" people. Both blogs are free and both have a lot of info about metabolic syndrome and full diabetes... Only you can decide which direction you want to go diet wise, but read up lots of stuff, to help you decide.

Fat is fine unless carbs and especially grain carbs are not excessive. For normal, slim people, moderately active, that would be about 150g per day, anyone overweight, metabolically screwed up in anyway, 50g would probably be a good figure if you didn't want to go very very low. A fairly typical modern diet might be 300g or more of carb!
Really, only serious athletes need that level of carb.

An interesting recent mouse study found mice fed a high fat, high carb diet all got fat, but only the mice eating carbs from gluten containing grains got very fat and ill... That fits in with both paleo and the very similar lchf food movements stance that grain foods should be cut out altogether (and other starchy carbs limited).

Veg oils processed industrially are dissolved in chemicals to extract the oils, have more chemicals added to remove the other chemicals, are often subjected to high temps. These oils are high omega 6 and that is bad because we need less a lot less omega 6 and a lot more omega 3 in our diets.

Olive oils which says Virgin and cold pressed are good, and coconut oil which says raw on it is even better (you may have to buy it by mail order, I have certainly never seen it in an actual shop).