TAMOXIFEN thread number 8 ********

[MaryAnnSingleton]

just in case we run out of space !

Quite understand about your MIL. The people I find trying are those who take on board your illness/troubles and kind of turn them round to focus on themselves - am sure your MIL is just showing concern for you as she's fond of you I didn't tell my aunt about mum (her sister) because she seems to be obsessed with other peoples illnesses. Think she quite likes knowing about these things and I couldn't face it- which is bad of me. She,my aunt-had a mastectomy about a year before my diagnosis and was apparently in full make up with her hair done fior the consultant the next day. She also baked him a cake as soon as she got home. My cousin is very protective of her mum and does everything for her and I always feel a bit of a slacker in comparison- mind you, my mum wouldn't want me to do everything.

Thanks for being so understanding MAS - both MIL and my mum are those kind of trying people!

Absolutely at full hair and make-up next day for the consultant!

Bet your mum is relieved you aren't over-bustling about, making her feel even more tired, and guilty (it does, watching other people doing things for you). You quite patently look after your parents very well and very lovingly

Meant to say MIL and mum are so alike they get on very well and phone each other quite a lot. MIL will have to be forbidden from talking about me to my mum. It will be very hard for her!

LJ I know exactly how you feel about mil and mum. I don't think I told you all that the day after I came out of hospital after the surgery, my mum was asking to come and help. I asked dh is ring her back and say, no thank you, we are coping at the moment perhaps next week. My dh did this, my mum burst into tears, completely over emotional response, she told my sister I didn't love her anymore, she disappeared to somewhere for four days, my sister had a big go at me and my dh, saying my dh was rude, was uncaring and ungrateful. I spent that week after my op feeling like the biggest piece of poo on earth for just once in my life saying what I wanted, which was just to be left quietly for a few days. I have had to apologise to my mum, things are still a bit strained with my sister, I am not sure I will ever truely forget this series of incidents. I know that much of it was born out of concern, but personally I feel let down and deeply hurt. I have had to re-evaluated these impprtant relationships, and now don't actually share my feelings with them at all. I feel alone, but at least in control. Sorry didn't mean to dump that all out on you all, but LJ just wanted you to understand that you are not alone in having to "manage other's emotions" when really you would just be coping with your own, and your dh and dc.

I think the dynamics of the family relationships are very hard But FWIW, I think you should not be afraid to say what you want LJ (and sparkles) - if they take it the wrong way, as an affront to them, however much they love you they are really not being helpful and you shouldn't be afraid to leave them out of the loop. Don't take on their burdens as well - not while your own is temporarily so heavy.

I noticed when I was going through treatment myself that, for some reason, everyone is fascinated and wants to know every detail. God knows why, if you had flu they wouldn't be remotely interested. Personally I found this seriously unhelpful and intrusive, and I ended up refusing to discuss it with anyone really, except dh. That may just be me - but my point is, don't be afraid to tell people to butt out if they get too in your face. This process really is about you, not them.

I think you are right cakes, to be honest have realsied that I can't cope with everything if I have to carry them too. I completely understand about other people's voyeurism feeling intrusive. For sis a large part of it was about whether it was going to happen to her, which I completely understand, but I wished she had just shared that with her own dh, not made me feel responsbile for her fear too.
Sorry will try to buck up.

Voyeurism is exactly the right term for it. Don't bother trying to buck up except on your own account, we all need a bit of angst time.

And I am quite buoyant now, having at last got through the project I was slaving away on. Just got the backlog that has built up behind it to eal with now

Sparkles - what happened after your op is shocking and sad. How awful to have had that 'guilt' dumped on you at such a time. I completely understand these emotional blackmail situations and

Yes I will have to be very firm with MIL - she will be the one wanting to know all the ins and outs of what has/will/could be happening to me, and I will not want to talk about it with her.

With my mum it's different. Basically, she is mentally ill, and has been for most of our lives. She can literally make herself ill over even quite minor things, so once she gets hit with a biggie like this....

She gets hold of a worry and goes over and over it, imagining the worst, and every negative angle possible, blowing everything out of proportion, worrying about what other people will think/say etc. Then she starts berating herself for having made herself ill and 'being a burden' on everyone and saying "why do I feel like this?". She doesn't sleep, doesn't eat, becomes physically weak and ill. She is also suffering quite badly at the moment with her osteoporosis (crumbling spine ) and is in a lot of pain with this. She will be 81 in June. Sis says mum is resisting going back on her morphine patches as she's afraid of becoming addicted to them, and doesn't like how 'out of it' they make her feel.

This news of mine is really, truly going to affect her badly, physically and emotionally. There is nothing we can do to soften the blow. I can feel positive about things, always find 'the bright side', but she is just physically incapable. It's how she's made. We have been putting off telling her for as long as possible. I was hoping if I wasn't to have chemo we could possibly have kept it all a secret from her, but I would have a hard time explaining away a bald head.

Oh god sorry Cakes - just dumped a big sad post, and then read yours. Well done you! Have tonight?

In fact sorry everyone for being such a downer today. It's just that having the chemo brought forward a whole month brings telling my mum forward too.

Don't apologise LJ, it was only a throwaway remark and this is much more important. Your poor Mum. But don't let that stop you dealing with this in whatever way you need to.

I will be thinking of you tomorrow and until we hear from you. it will be OK I am sure of it. x

I may well have wine tonight - if I were you, I definitely would

Oh LJ that is so hard to manage. Can you do your best to make sure that no-one else gives your mum information about you (like your mil) so you can at least control the info you have to share? Is it definite yet that you will lose you hair? Am clutching at straws here for you.......sorry. Big hugs

Cakes have a from me tonight.

I shall be having a large [wine, or maybe , as feeling low low low today. I know I know it won't help in the long run, but by 'eck I will feel better in the short run.

PS feel free to big very with my sis as haven't told you the half of it, including what she said about my ds.....I am stopping myself from being as angry as I should be, as I am the peacemaker of the family, hate confrontation etc, but she pushed me close this time. Would feel slightly less peeved if I know you are cross on ds' behalf. plus another sparkle slinks off embarrassed by her impending alcoholism

hugs to everyone xxxx
Dad says that some assistant bloke was very rude to my mum when she asked to be moved (from her chair) -dad wasn't there- mum told him- bastard- he also upset the woman opposite (she was in tears) by telling her she must have a bath because she'll smell- told dad he should report it as that is terrible. There is a very nice person though who moved mum very gently and carefully- dad says she looks pale and is very frail- I forget as I see her all the time but friends who haven;t will be very shocked. I want to buy her lots of nice tempting things like the M&S fruit salads and nice snippety things to snack on. Dad bought an enormous bag of jelly babies and 2 new nightdresses - he says he's having a meal for one tonight - I could weep if I let myself.

Oh dear. , Sparkles - have a few. And try not to dwell.

MAS. More Is this git at the main hospital or the local one? What a total tit. I hope she does not have to see him again: she will start to look much better as she gets more mobility and gets nearer coming home. Try not to fret. I am sure your Dad will be OK: they do sometimes seem very frail and small.

DH's Mum is seriously spooked - some of you may remember that DH's Dad died last autumn so she is new to being on her own. She feels there have been a number of odd happenings recently that suggest he is around - for me, that would be quite comforting (well, not if I thought it was him, because we didn't get on, but you know what I mean generally) but she is scared rigid. Odd, really, as he would never have hurt a hair on her head when alive, so he's not likely to start now.

Oh MAS I am so how can someone behave like that...where were the nurses? It is dreadful.

xposted cakes....what has been happening to your dh's mum then?

I'm sorry you are feeling a bit down LJ - and Sparkles too. How to deal with family is so hard, and is really a stress you can do without. How much you reveal or want to talk about is entirely up to you, and I think you often do have to employ the 'let's talk about something else instead' tactic. Otherwise the illness takes over every conversation and that's exhausting.

I don't know what to suggest about telling your mum LJ - it sounds a terribly hard situation, I'm so sorry - It might be something you could talk to BC nurse about, they can be very helpful in helping with the emotional stuff.

MAS - am really on your mum's behalf. What a horrible person - how can people behave like that? It is very upsetting when your loved ones are vulnerable and you people not treating them with respect.

Well done on finishing the project Cakes have a and a .

Dh and I are going to a (rather belated)New Years lunch tomorrow, - will have to scrabble about in my wardrobe trying to find something to wear that is a) respectable and b) fits my big bottom. - quite a challenge

sorry -'you see people not treating them with respect'

Meant to say Cakes - sorry about your MIL, I hope things settle down for her. I don't personally believe in ghosts and spirits, but I think it's natural when you've lost someone very close, to be thinking about them all the time and connecting happenings to them.

forgot to say well done for finishing the work Cakes ! Haven't made a start on my second book-did a baby card for my hairdresser who has just given birth,nice and relaxing - I love doing the painty bits.

Hope MIL isn't too spooked - I feel that people probably leave bits (as in an essence-some kind of shadow or something) when they die,part of their spirit maybe-and that might be what she's picking up up- or just plain missing him and feeling his presence because she wants him there.
A friend stayed at my old house in spare room and woke up to find a ghost dog on her bed - not unfriendly or fierce,just a dog-was always hoping we might see it.

'eck, I leave you lot for a day and there's reams to get through.

Cakes, congrats on finishing the work project. Am impressed. How was the PTA meet though?! Curt exchanges, or artificial smiles.

MIL, sounds curious. Is she scared? I think I'd be unnerved by it too, though thinking back we had a ghost of an old man in a house I lived in as a student. We all found him strangely comforting.

MAS am so on your behalf. I think watching parents age is impossible - so hard to switch roles, as you've done. Your poor mum though. Definitely get your dad to complain, as at the very least it might make that prat think twice before doing it again. G'ah.

LJ sounds very hard with your mum. How rational is she with her depression?? Macmillan are brilliant and will talk to family members and I think arrange counselling/ help if necessary. They would definitely be worth calling if your BC Nurse hasn't got any ideas.

On hair loss, I didn't lose all of mine, as I used something called a Cold Cap. Can fill you in if you want. You too Figgy if you're reading.

Sparkles, you deserve a good year, you really do. Funny how you see people in different ways through this bloody process. I know it's shifted quite a few things for me too. Time does help, though, as does

Kurri, hope the wardrobe meets the challenge, though I bet you're exaggerating

Am wiped out by typing all this.. off to the fridge. DH has been away with work all week, and I can't be arsed to cook. So much for the healthy post cancer diet then.

A few of us having a bad day then. Am feeling a bit better now (despite only one glass left in bottle!)

MAS that is awful about that bastard helper - I hope your dad is going to report him. Would your dad be up to it? Poor lady opposite as well - what an awful thing to say to her. Jellybeans and new nightdresses would certainly make me feel better - hope it works for your mum!

Sparkles I am indeed VERY on you and your DS's behalf! If she annoys/upsets you again, let me at her - I may not be much to be afraid of, but she doesn't know that!

Cakes - What happened at the PTA meeting? It was tonight wasn't it? Did you keep your cool? And for your poor MIL. First all on her own, now scared. What has been happening? Does she believe in spirits generally? My mum absolutely hates being on her own in the house at night, it's a large part of how bad she is at the moment.

Kurri - this is very late indeed for New Year's lunch - or are we talking Chinese New Year? Hope you find something comfy to wear - as it's lunch, can you just stay sitting down? cheeky

Smee - that could be a really good idea re Macmillan, thanks for that. Mum is not very rational when she's bad I'm afraid. Also her English, understanding and hearing are not perfect, which doesn't help! She is always getting the wrong end of the stick about things. Have heard about the cold cap, was all for it, but now have read mixed reports which have me wavering. How partial was your hair loss?

Thank you all for being here for me today. Don't know what I would have done without you. Goodness it's late - and an early start for me tomorrow. Night night, love to all xxx

Er, first line of my last post means DH & I only got to drink one glass as the bottle was nearly empty x

at LJ - thinking of you today and everyone who is feeling low. I was ok about mum until I heard about horrible man -now I just feel sad. And for the lady opposite.

Hugs for LJ today.

KK - I bet you are exaggerating about your bum. I am about to iron my size 14 black trousers so I have something decent to wear to see Flawless tonight: the 12s won't cut it.

MIL's feelings about her DH vary - several time she has heard someone/thing in the shed jiggling the watering cans about (he was obsessed with doing the watering) and she swears blind that his walking stick, which she had put away in a cupboard, moved itself to leaning against the outside wall under the car port. No visible manifestations as yet. Personally I don't know what to think, but I do believe that, the say after my Dad died, he visited me (I could hear him talking in my head, and then the phone rang. Could've been anyone but his voice said 'I'm going now, that's Helen' - and when I answered it, it was). I also heard him (actually, not in my head) call me a couple of times.

Feel free to ignore, I know it's a bit Woo.

MAS I hope your Mum and Dad look a bit less vulnerable today, and are treated with the love and respect they deserve. Likewise sparkles' ds. In fact I wish you all - and your loved ones - a lovely day, we could all do with one.

I have just sent dd into school dressed as Minerva for Roamn Day. I have to say she is going to be freezing - the outfit is all floaty white tulle and gold bits, courtesy of ur local fancy dress shop, as I am too hamfisted to sew.
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