This fear that social services will come and take your children...

[willsurvivethis]

...it worries me!

There seem to be so many women out there who are afraid to seek help for depression and other problems out of fear that they will lose their children.

I have just asked MNHQ if they would consider doing something with this. Because surely if so many of us fear to lose our children something is going wrong somewhere! Surely we should all be albe to seek help with confidence?

What are your thoughts on this? I struggle with PTSD and even told my doctor that I tended to keep emotional distance from my ds when he's ill without even considering the possibility of that having repercussions.

[TotalChaos]

Leonie - completely agree about it all being about complying. though my experience was of HV rather than SW. I was bullied by HV into weaning DS at 5 months (the local baby health "experts") didn't believe in the revised guidelines for 6 months.

[twistedhazel]

I want to write about a very positive outcome.

A while ago, I had a fairly severe spell of depression and the GP referred me to the local Mental Health team. Through lots of councelling, practical advice and a strong back-up, the CPN helped not just me but my entire family.
I had opted out from taking ADs but spoke freely with my CPN and we had trust. I often told her how terrified I was of SW removing my children and he put me in touch with the Mental Health SW who reassured me that my children were well looked after and fine, that there was no reason at all for their removal.

The irony of the whole situation was born from the non MH SWs treatment of our family when we were carers to my parent who had dementia.
I won't go into detail about it but will say that they were very heavy handed and not always truthful, yet it was their word against ours.

I do feel that I can trust my CPN should I need help again and he and his team also have a big say in Child Protection meetings but tend to protect their patient whilst justifying what help they have offered the families IMO.

[Reallytired]

"Well, apart from risking having SS breathing down my neck, i would never want 'depression' on my medical records simply because GPs tend to never ever take you seriously about anything in future, they blame it all on your depression!!"

That is not true. One in three people have a mental health problem at some point in their lives and at any time 1 in 10 people are depressed at any given time.

If you want your GP and HV to take you seriously then seek help and be sensible. Social services aren't going to put your children in care. There simply aren't enough foster carers for children who do need to be taken into care. 1 in 10 mums have postnatal depression and many Jolly can tell if I am right, but I think 1 in 100 have postnatal depression badly enough to need a secondary referal. If you think about it that a lot of mums and children across the UK.

If all the children of mums with postnatal depression were taken into care then the system would collapse. Putting a child into care costs an absolute bomb. Even if a baby gets adopted social services aren't actually allowed to sell beautiful babies.

[willsurvivethis]

Leonie I'm sorry that's your experience. It's not mine and not my dh's so maybe we can leave it at your opinion/experience rather than fact? Because it obviously does not apply to everyone.

[wubblybubbly]

It's a very interesting topic and also some very sad stories.

I suffered from depression prior to DS and also after his birth.

I did seek help on both occasions, although I actually found it much harder to ask for help the first time around, it was a new experience and very terrifying. I think that quite possibly most people suffering from depression for the first time struggle to ask for help.

Whilst I was pregnant and visited by midwives, we talked about my earlier depression and they mentioned I might be more prone to PND. It wasn't done in a threatening way, but just highlighted for me and they also mentioned that, because I'd suffered before, I was more likely to spot the signs earlier.

When DS was born by ECS he was whisked away into SCBU, followed by loads of health issues, BF difficulties etc. I felt a complete failure as a mother, struggled to bond with DS and the depression came back.

Perhpas because I'd had a good experience the first time around, it was easier for me to seek help again? I had great support from my GP and a NHS CBT counsellor, no critical judgements about me or my abilities as a mother and certainly no threats of SS involvement.

I can see know how lucky I was. I had the benefit of having already been through the system succesfully, I had enough experience to be able to identify that my feelings didn't mean I was a bad person/mother but that I was suffering from depression.

I think that seeking help for MH issues is extraordinarliy difficult the first time you face it. To seek help again after a bad experience must be terrifying and, add to that mix, the threat that SS might get involved must put many people off finding help all together.

I don't have the answers, I just wanted to add a positive experience to the mix.

[Nymphadora]

Sorry starlight have read your case before and the treatment does seem to have been crap but I just answered your question for a Neglect situation. Ididnt specify timesof meals etc, just regular.

Regarding 'comply' it's a matter of convincing SS you can manage/ improve. If you disagree on health grounds etc ensure you can back it up or your GP/HV will.

As I said before the majority of SW are ok but there are some crap/thick/lazy ones and they unfortunatly are the ones people o here have met. I also have a problem with Sws without life experience as the young new ones seem to be working in CP as the older experienced ones have had enough.

[willsurvivethis]

Leonie, I believe you. Still think it's more helpful if we just discuss our own experiences rather than those of hypothetical others.

[ImSoNotTelling]

Hello all!
Just to add my bit.
People are scared of SS, of course they are, because they have the power to remove your children. yes yes the courts blah but the fact is that the SW are the ones who come and JUDGE you, and they are the ones who recommend removal. That is the nost scary thing in the world. Naturally people are scared.

What happened to me.
During the course of my life I have had excellent experience with GP, hospitals, HCPs. I suffered from perinatal anxiety with DD2 and sought help with no qualms, as at the point I knew that HCPs are there to help you. The support I received was wonderful.

After DD2 I decided that I was drinking too much. I had always liked a drink more than is healthy, and I decided that now I had children I should stop. I was drinking in the evenings, when the children had gone to bed, with my DH in the house, who would only ever have one glass of wine to keep me company (he has never been much of a drinker).

So natuarally I sought help, as I had when I quit smoking. I assumed that some help would be available. I stopped drinking and went to see my GP and he gave me a phone number. I rang it, they said I was not drinking enough for them to be interested and they would refer me on.

Anotehr organisation called, I had a 5 min chat and they asked a few questions. I said that I had stopped drinking and was happy that I had done it (it had been a few weeks and it was fine) but that I would contact them if I needed support. It was a cheerful upbeat conversation.

An hour later the woman called back to say that they had reported me to SS because they had serious concerns about the safety of my children, and that they would have to come and assess me. I said couldn't they wait to repoty until they had met me? No. Would SS take the children? She said yes if they have cause for concern.

Anyway I rang SS (on advice of MNers) to try and explain that the charity had been hasty but she obviously didn't believe me.

The SW came to see us. She was OK. There were obviously things sje didn't like, I think she thought we were lying. Because we are normal and happy etc and maybe they aren't used to dealing with people with no problems? So people who say they have no problems must be liars?

Anyway she said she would call GP and DD1 nursery to ask about us, and it would be best if I warned them. So I had to talk to nursery manager and tell her all about it and call GP and obviously it is now on my GP records. And she NEVER BLOODY RANG THEM. So now my GP and nursery know that SS have been involved with us, when they didn't need to.

Anyway. I lost a stone in 2 or 3 days when we were first reported, I couldn't eat.

We had to wait 2.5 MONTHS for a letter from SS which was really stressful, hearing what would happen next. When it came it said no further action "as discussed when I met you". She did not bloody tell us no further action when she met us she looked worried and said she would 1. phone us with details of who to contact for support with giving up drinking and 2. write to us. She never rang and left us hanging for 2.5 months.

No-one at any point really tried to give me any support with stopping drinking. Apart from that I should contact the woman who reported in the first place. Yes like that's going to be a big help. No alternatives were offered and no-one has asked how it's going or anything.

What I have learned:

Once you have children all eyes are on them. Before, it is all about you, afterwards, it is all about them. If you have any problems, the first thought will be how does it impact on the children.

If I ever have another problem, i will deal with it myself or through anonymous help. Internet/phonelines etc. until teh children are much bigger anyway.

I think we will have to cancel 3rd child as with the perinatal anxiety, it could trigger a report (even though all that happens is I won't go out) and I don't think I could do it without the support I received last time from the perinatal team. We had said that for 3rd child I could have ADs, but obviously that is not the way to go, I know that now.

Also the fact I had a loving sober husband with no issues with anything was seen as largely irrelevant. It is all down to YOU the MUMMY. If you are judged to be lacking, well who knows what will happen.

It is a valuable lesson that I feel I have learned, through a truly shitty experience.

[ImSoNotTelling]

Oh shit sorry for monster post this is all quite raw the letter came a couple of weeks ago. Sorry.

[feistyfire]

yeah social services are involved with my unborn baby cos i have apparantly got anger issues
i spend every minute of everyday worrying my unborn and my 2 year old will be taken
my son is in nursery hes well loved and looked after.yet my life is a constant worry cos i have to watch how i speak or act in case its taken out of terms,i cry a lot with worry and im a nervous wreck i feel i cant do anything right
im getting depressed.cos of it

[willsurvivethis]

ImSo - don't apologise if it at all helped to get it out. It's fine

[willsurvivethis]

By the way ImSo - on the schools admissions thread you sweetly asked if I was ok because of my nickname - well I guess now you know - PTSD due to child abuse....

[ImSoNotTelling]

feisty that sounds so stressful I'm not surprised you're a mess.

[ImSoNotTelling]

Oh willsurvivethis I'm sorry.

So many sad and awful stories.

feisty are you getting any support - do you feel there is anyone on your side in all of this?

[StarExpat]

So, the answer then, is to not tell too much or be too open about how you feel if you're feeling anything less than happy if you have young children?

[willsurvivethis]

Well no StarExpact, that's not my answer at all. I opened up and got the help I needed and all everyone ever did was counter my constant comments about being a bad mother.

At one point this summer I decided I should disappear so Dh could remarry and ds have a better mummy. I walked out of the house but was able to reach out to a friend who knew what was going on and they talked it out of my head. If I had not gone to doc, been referred for therapy and had support from the people around me I honestly don't know where I would have been now.

I was not depressed (!) but PTSD did not help me think clearly as I was sleep deprived and going round in circles in my head all the time. My ds was only 18months but not stupid. He knew something was wrong and we have grown a lot closer now I'm doing better. I feel I was just in time in pulling back and pulling closer to my child.

I despair at the thought of women keeping such serious feelings for themselves out of fear - that's why I started this thread.

[twistedhazel]

Some of these threads are so terribly sad.

What do we want in the way of help when we become depressed? I'm trying to look at it from a 'we would like help in this area but not for the threat of the removal of our children' type of practical help.

I would like to be able to actually begin a course of ADs but with practical help the first couple of weeks if they make you feel a bit woozy and unable to drive.

I want to be able to sleep in the knowledge that my children are being properly cared for while I sleep. (In their own home.)

I want GPs to look past the mental part and more at the illness.

I want to be completely open about how I feel to a professional without the fear of my vulnerability being misconstrued.