Social services remove kids , mental health

[Trappedx]

I need some advice on what to do..

partner stopped taking her medicine in may r and has been relapsing since may

Childrens social services have been involved and due to partners recent manic episodes have said kids not allowed to stay at home.

she is on a section 2 , but due to bed shortages has been left at home with me
She has now restarted her medicine
home treatment team have increased her medicine and come every day to do assessment and keep saying to get pcr test so they can move her to hospital out of area. She is refusing pcr test and I’m stuck at home with her and no kids

any advice???

[EllieLucy]

Children’s Service DO have a duty to ensure your children are accommodated but NOT you, because you have somewhere to live. So don’t make yourself intentionally homeless.

If that was aimed at my post, you've totally misunderstood. I never meant for OP to make themselves homeless that's why I said it's a complicated situation. My advice to OP was to find somewhere they can all live. Because otherwise OPs homeless DC will be taken into care for the purpose of safely housing them. If OP appears to children services to have shrugged their shoulders, chosen to remain with DP and let it happen, then good luck getting them back.

[NynaeveSedai]

@EllieLucy

Children’s Service DO have a duty to ensure your children are accommodated but NOT you, because you have somewhere to live. So don’t make yourself intentionally homeless.

If that was aimed at my post, you've totally misunderstood. I never meant for OP to make themselves homeless that's why I said it's a complicated situation. My advice to OP was to find somewhere they can all live. Because otherwise OPs homeless DC will be taken into care for the purpose of safely housing them. If OP appears to children services to have shrugged their shoulders, chosen to remain with DP and let it happen, then good luck getting them back.

They can't take the children into care without either parental consent or a court order.
If the father doesn't consent then they would have to go to court. If the only reason the father can't care is lack of accommodation they will not get a court order. They will be told to provide them with accommodation. I doubt any local authority would even reach the point of making an application under those circumstances.
Of course if there are other obstacles in the way of the father caring that's a different matter.

[EllieLucy]

People saying write to here email there endless phone calls etc not bad advice as such. But OP has only 6 days to change this situation or they lose their DC. I wouldn't take the risk of chasing services up not working, I'd be focusing all my energy on finding somewhere else to live that's available right now and organising loan or credit card to pay for it. Then start hassling people for a bed for DP so OP and DC can return home ASAP.

OP can you take time off work to sort this out? Unless you can all 100% definitely move in with that relative who offered it, this weekend.

[NynaeveSedai]

@EllieLucy

People saying write to here email there endless phone calls etc not bad advice as such. But OP has only 6 days to change this situation or they lose their DC. I wouldn't take the risk of chasing services up not working, I'd be focusing all my energy on finding somewhere else to live that's available right now and organising loan or credit card to pay for it. Then start hassling people for a bed for DP so OP and DC can return home ASAP.

OP can you take time off work to sort this out? Unless you can all 100% definitely move in with that relative who offered it, this weekend.

That's not true. They do NOT have 6 days 'or they lose their DC'. That's not what a PLO meeting means. It's pre legal proceedings. They will decide what they need to do to avoid care proceedings. The OP will have the opportunity to have legal representation and express what they need to be able to care for the children.

[EllieLucy]

If the father doesn't consent then they would have to go to court. If the only reason the father can't care is lack of accommodation they will not get a court order

OP has been told they're going to court if nothing changes by Wednesday. SS seem to think they would get a court order or why are they going to court? Sure they've got better things to do than waste their own money on a wild goose chase. They must be pretty sure of their success 🤷 Maybe they're lying to avoid having to organise housing for OP and DC instead of just putting DC into care, but if you was OP would you hang around to find out if they're lying or not and see what a judge says? I wouldn't take the risk if I was me.

[NynaeveSedai]

@EllieLucy

If the father doesn't consent then they would have to go to court. If the only reason the father can't care is lack of accommodation they will not get a court order

OP has been told they're going to court if nothing changes by Wednesday. SS seem to think they would get a court order or why are they going to court? Sure they've got better things to do than waste their own money on a wild goose chase. They must be pretty sure of their success 🤷 Maybe they're lying to avoid having to organise housing for OP and DC instead of just putting DC into care, but if you was OP would you hang around to find out if they're lying or not and see what a judge says? I wouldn't take the risk if I was me.

No he hasn't. He's been told there is a PLO meeting. You're being alarmist and misunderstanding what is happening.

[EllieLucy]

Cross posted with you. Hopefully your information is what the OP needs then

[EllieLucy]

No he hasn't. He's been told there is a PLO meeting. You're being alarmist and misunderstanding what is happening.

I can only go by what the OP said and the OP doesn't understand the situation which is why they posted. The OP said they were being took to court to put the DC into care. I generally take OPs at face value. Yes the situation is alarming. For OP. Not my problem. I don't know them.

[girlfrombackthen]

Hi OP

Sorry you are in this position. From what you have written it sounds like your partner was assessed under the Mental Health Act - two doctors and an approved mental health professional agreed she needed to be admitted to hospital for assessment under Section 2 of the Mental Health Act but there were no beds available. Therefore treatment at home is being provided by the crisis team but to be clear she is not currently legally detained! The approved mental health professional can only make an application for detention once a hospital is named/identified.

It sounds like an out of area bed has been found but the refusal to do a PCR is the issue?

[TolkiensFallow]

@girlfrombackthen finally someone else who gets the law!

[Embracelife]

@LemonSwan

The NHS aren't going to bother finding a space if they dont have to.

As harsh as it is you need to get her out the house and not let her back in. Call the police and the crisis team. Once the police have her they will have to take her to a place of safety/ hospital. They will find space.

You need to get your children back now. Its going to be fucking horrific and I am so sorry but she will thank you eventually when she gets better and realises it was that or losing the children.

Goodluck

This
Get her out
Refuse to have her back

[girlfrombackthen]

I understand that safeguarding the children's wellbeing is absolutely paramount...but I found so much of the advice/comments here really stigmatising. So much for parity between physical and mental health!

OP, I really hope you, your children and your partner can get the help you all need. The professionals supporting you are best placed to advise on your specific circumstances. Take care.

[OverTheRubicon]

@girlfrombackthen

I understand that safeguarding the children's wellbeing is absolutely paramount...but I found so much of the advice/comments here really stigmatising. So much for parity between physical and mental health!

OP, I really hope you, your children and your partner can get the help you all need. The professionals supporting you are best placed to advise on your specific circumstances. Take care.

There is an undeniable difference between physical and mental health, in that the vast majority of physically ill people in urgent need of hospital care would do a PCR test and into hospital before having their children left homeless and about to be taken into care. Someone who was mentally well but refusing to do this would be considered to be abusive - on the basis that neglect absolutely is abuse.

When someone is following the same course through mental illness then children are still neglected, the behaviour is still abuse. And while an ill person should not ever have to be left in A&E or 'kicked out', there are not many paths left that get them treatment and the children to stay with a parent.

Finally - I'd also argue that someone physically ill who stopped taking their medication multiple times despite knowing the enormous impact it had on their family was abusive also. I appreciate that this can itself be a symptom of mental ill health. But it's still horrendous.

[Trappedx]

Update: Partner has been taking her meds now and working with MH crisis team..at the last assessment they said although she’s not well she doesn’t need to be hospitalised

They wanted to speak to social worker on Friday but she only work 2.5 days a week and wasn’t available

They will do another assessment today or tomorrow and I have meeting with solicitors today in an hour

[StarCourt]

Very best of luck OP

[TolkiensFallow]

Thanks for the update op

[Elieza]

Good result for the time being OP.

I imagine there will be some serious discussions in due course between you and her regarding her behaviour (if you choose to stay with her) and how you nearly lost the most important thing you will ever have in your life, your children, because she was being selfish.

She was ‘with it’ and capable of making decisions when she chose to stop medicating. After that she may have been too far gone, however if she pulls that stunt again I imagine she has to be made aware that it’s over between you.

If she feels bad on the meds the gp may be able to tweak them for better results, but she can’t just stop taking them.

[Rustnot]

@Elieza are you aware that stopping medication is a symptom of some mental illnesses? Everyone is for mental health awareness and understanding, until it becomes a tiny bit uncomfortable, and goes beyond the scope of anxiety and depression. I feel for OP, but she is not 'pulling a stunt.' She is unwell and needs treatment. Your judgement is so unkind.

[Elieza]

@Rustnot.

I don’t know if that’s correct or not tbh. I don’t know enough about mental illness, only the sheer hell I went through with a bipolar partner who was off meds. Total nightmare. I was practically suicidal myself as I couldn’t cope. Never again.

I’d see your point if she was alone but she has a loving partner whom she presumably trusts and who can help her. She chose to hide her deduction from her.

She deliberately made a choice when she was (presumably) stable on meds to bin them. It affected a lot of people negatively. It’s not alright.

Presumably if she has the capacity to remain in the community she has the capacity to make decisions. She made a bad one. Actions have consequences. She should know that for the future.

If that’s asking too much should she be trusted to take her meds by herself? Perhaps she needs medicated by someone.

[OverTheRubicon]

[quote Rustnot]@Elieza are you aware that stopping medication is a symptom of some mental illnesses? Everyone is for mental health awareness and understanding, until it becomes a tiny bit uncomfortable, and goes beyond the scope of anxiety and depression. I feel for OP, but she is not 'pulling a stunt.' She is unwell and needs treatment. Your judgement is so unkind.[/quote]
It's not a 'tiny bit uncomfortable', there were two children homeless and about to be taken into care. And now they are about to be brought back into a neglectful household - because it doesn't matter if neglect is due to mental ill health, it's still neglect.

I think it's often the opposite. Between the 'be kind' brigade and the stretched resources of the NHS and SS, there are many thousands of drastically undersupported children of mentally ill parents in the UK. Yes, their parents need support and care. But they are being shaped by this. It took me far too long to see for my own, wish someone could help this op to see too.

[Rustnot]

The children have a parent with capacity, and family members with whom they could stay. They would not have been taken into care, certainly not in the local authority where I work - it just doesn't happen like that.

The stretched resources here are to blame. If OPs wife had the support she needed, or had been sectioned when needed, this situation wouldn't happen. Of course it is awful for the children involved, but I think the judgment and comments on this thread from people who essentially think this woman should be shunned because she is unwell are horrible. And I stand by what I said - people get uncomfortable when they are discussing mental health problems beyond anxiety and depression. The stigma and lack of understanding is very much still there.