BSD and Fast800 support thread #17

[thenewaveragebear1983]

Here’s the new thread for the BSD followers, plus those following the Fast800 plan. Everyone is welcome to join us. Here’s a quick recap!

The BSD/fast 800 is a low carb, Mediterranean style way of eating, with the primary aim of stabilising your insulin response when you eat. You achieve this by: eating fewer carbs, cutting out sugar and sweet tasting foods including most fruit, and by following a low calorie plan that reduces your visceral fat meaning that everything functions more effectively. Less insulin means less fat storage (in a nutshell, although more info can be found on this online). The diet was designed to reduce T2 diabetes symptoms (or even reverse it entirely) but can also be used for weightloss.

Eat:
Meats and fish
Oils
Eggs
Full fat dairy products
Nuts, seeds
Pulses/ beans
Veg that grows above ground
Limit fruit: apples, pears, berries- in moderation, with meals, with fats

Occasional alcoholic drinks allowed (spirits, red wine are preferable to beer, lager, etc)
Tea and coffee, herbal tea etc.
And water- drink lots of water!

Avoid
sugar, sweets, and ‘naturally occurring sugars’ such as fructose, maltose, honey, agave, puréed dates etc....

Potatoes of any variety
Pasta
Rice
Breakfast cereals (occasional steel cut oats are ok)
Breads/ flour based products

Exercise:
Michael Moseley recommends HIIT workouts to increase calorie burn and help to tone up, and recommends walking more (increasing your steps weekly until you hit around 10000 a day)

Mindfulness
MM also suggests a programme of mindfulness, meditation, practised for a few minutes each day.

How to follow the plan:
Fast800: follow the plan above, sticking to 800 calories every day for 2 weeks. Ideal to give your weightloss a real kick start, plus improve your insulin function and reduce your sugar cravings.
8 weeks BSD- 8 weeks, follow the guidelines above- 800 calories a day. You don’t need to count carbs grams because the diet is naturally self limiting.
BSD 5:2- for a more leisurely weightloss journey, or as maintenance, or once you’ve done an 8 week stint or 2 weeks of Fast800, you can play around with a combination of increased calorie count, ‘free eating’ and fasting days (800 cals) until you achieve your goals. Many of our long standing members now follow this approach.

You can stop 800 calorie days at any time once you achieve your goal. It’s advised to limit yourself to 12 weeks maximum at 800 calorie days, but you should get excellent results in 8 weeks. Depending on your weightloss goals, you can do further ‘rounds’ of either the 8 week BSD or the Fast800.

Time restricted eating/TRE :
In addition to the fast800/ BSD plan you can incorporate a strategy of time restricted eating. Put simply, this means only eating between certain times each day to maximise your fasting time. TRE has shown to have positive results for weightloss, even if there is no calorie restriction, and increases insulin sensitivity/reduces insulin resistance. At first, try for a clear 12 hours without food each 24 hours, increasing to 16:8 as you get more adept at fasting.


Some useful links:

previous thread

Meal planning ideas thread
Blood sugar diet recipe thread and menu planner meal planning thread


<a class="break-all" href="http://go.mumsnet.com/?xs=1&id=470X1554755&url=healthyeater.com/important-tool-weight-loss" rel="nofollow noindex" target="_blank">TDEE calculator to calculate your daily calorie requirement

information about the ‘whoosh’ phenomenon

[CaptainBrickbeard]

I feel hungry today! Am at 900 calories already though - boiled eggs and asparagus for breakfast, tuna and butter bean salad for lunch and meatballs with cauliflower rice for dinner. Have been for a swim and ate an apple afterwards as I felt starving! Now I would really like a slice of Christmas cake and a glass of wine but I’m so keen to get to my first stone off that I won’t.

[thenewaveragebear1983]

I've had a good day today, first real test of dry January too as it's Friday night. I didn't eat until about 1.30 and then had 4 mini falafel and mayo. During the afternoon I had a few nuts and a bit of chicken, then tonight we'll be having steak and salad once the dc go to bed. I ran 8km this morning too. So feeling positive.

Tomorrow I am going to bootcamp in the morning, then going to my parents for lunch (probably a roast dinner and stodgy pudding and custard!), dinner will be something light.

[FluffyEarMuffs]

Evening all.

I had an avocado for lunch, and then cauliflower and Dahl for dinner. Just within 800 and definitely within 16:8, as I have been for the last 9 days

I am not being active enough though 😔 I need to be walking much, much, much more than I am. I am feeling depressed looking at my steps this week. I haven't once hit 10,000.

I am proud of myself for resisting sugar and carbs and especially alcohol in the last 9 days. No cheating yet. But @thenewaveragebear1983 even MM says in his book that he cheated a few times, even twice during the first 14 days... so I think when dough is required, even MM will understand.

DH is claiming my herbal tea and expensive black coffee costs more than wine 😆 He is possibly right there. I am going through bags and bags of the tea, and discovered a great coffee called Grumpy Mule, which sums me up on a morning.

[PhoenixMama]

Such great goals! Is it weird that I get more excited about other people's goals than my own?

@thenewaveragebear1983 I'm kind of hoping I do what you did and drop, and then change my shape through exercise. I'm finding a lot of exercise on 800cals too difficult right now!

I made a FAB discovery today that I wanted to share - Linda McCarney sausages. I was starving and couldn't wait till DD was home so searched the freezer & found these I bought for veggie friends.

2 Sausages are 128cals, fat 5.2g, carbs 2g, protein 15.5. Really filling & cooks in less than 15mins!

[thenewaveragebear1983]

@PhoenixMama yes love the LM sausages!
The first time I did this I did no exercise, but then did regain some of what I lost. The second round I did start running at the same time, started only doing 10 mins a day but quickly built it up and was doing 100-150km a month by the end of the year. I'm pretty convinced that it was running that kept me on track and kept the weightloss last year.

[Maccalenny]

Phoenix and Bear - I’ve been pondering exercise too, or in my case the lack of it! Over Christmas I had four days where I ate more than usual - nuts, cheese, red wine, no carbs or sugar still - and I put on 6lb. I’m still a couple of lb up, despite having an ok and a very good week since. This has made it clear to me that I am at risk of putting the weight back on very very easily if I let things slip.

I have barely exercised during this process, despite lots of good intentions and failed attempts to get into a routine. So I am resolved that this year HAS to be the year that I get a bit more active, for all the usual health reasons but also to build more muscle to safeguard my weight loss a bit. I’m loving the 30 days of yoga, and want to carry on a regular yoga practice. I’m also joining a walking group - off tomorrow for my first walk with them. 2019 was the year of weight loss for me, hopefully 2020 will be the year of fitness!

[tasmaniandevilchaser]

Hi everyone! I’ve just started the 800 and could do with some support. 🙏

I’ve been going since Jan 1st and have been feeling great, not hungry at all but yesterday......I was screaming hungry all day and by 9pm knew I wasn’t going to be able to sleep so had a extra couple of seeded crackers (recipe from the book) and feta. I’ve been drinking herbal teas in the evening but if anyone has any tips to deal with the hunger I’m all ears!!

I wanted to lose 2 stone and it is falling off me, 7 lbs so far, and I don’t usually feel too hungry but yesterday....I can’t be that hungry, it’s not going to work like that!

Any tips? Please?!

[thenewaveragebear1983]

@Maccalenny I think the key is to find something that you enjoy enough to prioritise it. When I first ran, I hated^^ it, I was so unfit, but something made me love it. The same with my circuits/bootcamp. It's grim, muddy, cold - but I love it, love the people I've met there, and it keeps me going when I don't really feel like it (like this morning).

I do think exercise is overrated as a method of calorie consumption though. Reading 'the obesity code', it basically says that our bodies are designed to maintain and you will naturally either reduce output elsewhere or increase input (food) to compensate for the actual calories burned during exercise. But what a long term, regular exercise program does is reduce your body's set weight by reducing insulin, increasing metabolism, and increasing your base metabolic rate (you need more fuel to exist as you're more muscular)- so overall your body will pull you to a naturally lower weight, and you can maintain there.

I'm not explaining this well at all, but I really do recommend that book, it's fascinating. Especially the bits about your 'body set weight' and why we naturally maintain or plateau at a certain weight (we're not imagining it, we do) and how you can reduce the weight that your body naturally settles at (and yes, that's insulin related!! )

[Kimlek]

Weirdly I lost 0.8lb by going back to bed.... I weight myself daily in stones & pounds when I wake up and after I’ve had a wee. Today I did the same and weight was static. Went back to bed for half an hour and realised it was weigh day for MFP in kg so popped back on the scales to find I’d lost 0.8lb since 20 mins ago!

maccalenny thank for the LM sausage recommendation! Group walking will be great. I have a dog so walk everyday but it’s very boring...

[thenewaveragebear1983]

@tasmaniandevilchaser welcome! You've had a good start, well done.

My tips for the hunger are: drink plenty of water early in the day. For me it doesn't work if I drink when I feel hungry later, I have to preempt it by drinking early on. It must take a while to work through?
And fat- eat fat, plenty of it, early in the day. I've been making shakes and adding a tbsp olive oil (sounds rank but you can't taste it) as I don't eat dairy so don't get enough fat in, but if you can eat full fat dairy, cream in your morning coffee, avocado, butter, cheese - get this at lunchtime. Use half (at least) your calorie allowance at lunch, get a good serving of fat in, then have your evening meal as lighter and more veg (this can help if you struggle to sleep too as you get more carb later in the day)
If you are ravenous, and feeling miserable- allow yourself extra calories. It won't hurt- but aim for calories of fat (eg cheese/ yogurt rather than carbs)

[Kimlek]

@tasmaniandevilchaser are you eating enough fat? The day’s I’m hungry I realise that I’ve not had much good fats. I was starving last night too and although I only had 88 cals left before 800 I had an apple and a couple of dollops of peanut butter... over the 88 cals but very satiating! Make sure you’re not having anything low fat as that makes a difference too.

[Kimlek]

Thanks bear I’m going to try the early preempt ideas too. I also like the idea of half calories & high fat lunch then lighter veggie dinner. My tummy is already rumbling this morning. It never does that. I easily go to midday usually.

[PhoenixMama]

I'm finding that if my lunches don't have enough protein then I'm ravenous later. Also agree with @thenewaveragebear1983 that water is the key - the days I don't drink more than 2L i'm starving.

Down another half a pound this morning (which has really surprised me! but I've broken the 180 barrier and hit 179.

I know we've discussed this before but I need help with my 10yo DD. She's put on a lot of weight in the last 4ish months. I think she's starting puberty and her metabolism has changed. She's really conscious of it too. The daily yoga is definitely helping but her snacking is out of control. I've never really limited food (because my mum did with me and it created a disastrous relationship with food) but I'm trying to talk to her about nutrition but she doesn't really get it. The moment she feels hungry she acts like she's about to die of starvation! I have no idea how to address it positively. Any ideas? Anything you wish someone has said to you when you were younger?

[Doubleyouexwhyandzed]

HELPPPPPP
Why am I not losing?!?!?!?
I’m day 10 today, 800 cal/day, no visible carbs, drinking lots of water, walking plenty, initially lost 5lb by day 5, but have stayed the same weight since. How is that possible? I’m starting to lose the faith 😭

[TheForgetfulCat]

Good appointment with the scales this morning. 12st 3.5 on day 11 which if the initial 12 st 11 wasn't a post Christmas pre period blip (which I think it was a bit), is half a stone off.

Advice on how I now don't sabotage the whole thing by deciding I'm doing really well and can stop now? That's what happened last time I tried. Happy Scale (thank you for the tip) says I might get under 12 stone for my brothers wedding on 25th January and I would love to do that. His fiancée is the opposite of a bridezilla but she's also tiny and very, very fit and generally it would be so nice not to look like the family hippotamus in the photos!

[Maccalenny]

A happy Saturday weigh-in for me this morning...I’ve lost 3lb this week, bringing me back to a pre-Christmas 11st10.2.

My two mini-targets are:
11st8.6 - this marks exactly five stone lost.
11st5 - at which point my bmi will be healthy.

Then I’m on maintenance.....after nearly 30 years of always wanting to lose weight, it will be a whole new experience for me.

[TheForgetfulCat]

Doubleyou I've just tried the Happy Scale app which is recommended by pps. It does smooth out the daily fluctuations and give you a trend line. Also people talk about a 'whoosh' effect where you stay still and then lose a load of weight all at once?

Phoenix I have the same thing with my 11 year old DD. She's always been tiny and slight but has definitely started to put a bit on round the middle. I suspect puberty looming but also have noted that when not doing the gymnastics classes she loves, a lot of sedentary time is spent FaceTiming friends/ colouring/ listening to audiobooks etc. And don't even ask about her preferred diet! So I am going to try and subtly limit the snacks and encourage more movement. But I also remember my lovely mum telling me at a similar age that my body was just changing shape and the weight round my middle would move into different places soon. Which it duly did, and that advice got me through some very puppy-fat teenage years without massive hangups. Will always be grateful!

[tasmaniandevilchaser]

Thanks so much!! That’s really helpful. I definitely didn’t drink enough water yesterday, I’ll make a bigger effort today.

I don’t do any low fat food, don’t believe in it! I stopped Slimming World because of all the low fat crap. I had Greek yoghurt for breakfast, avocado and some cheese at lunch and the aubergine lasagna for dinner so a fair amount of fat but often I’ll have oily fish so I need to think more about fats.

So I’ve got smoked salmon and scrambled eggs for breakfast and 2 giant mugs of herbal tea. That should be a good start!

Anyway I lost a pound yesterday so still going in the right direction...

Is anyone doing the HIIT that MM recommends?

[Maccalenny]

Bear thank you for the exercise thoughts. I will dig out the book again and reread that bit....I’ve also got his fast exercise book somewhere so I will look at that too. I do love yoga....the mental/spiritual part as much as the physical.....so my only excuse for not keeping it up is, to be blunt with myself, bone idleness! And I love to walk, but I’m not adventurous enough to head out in the car if it’s just me, and walking the same route in the same village I’ve lived In for 20 years gets a bit samey! So hopefully the group will inspire me to try out some new routes.

[Maccalenny]

Doubleyou - you are losing, you’ve lost 5lb in 10 days. If you had lost it more steadily over the 10 days, you might have been really happy with that! But as we all moan about a lot, weight loss doesn’t work like that. Hormones, amount of food and liquid in transit, and other random stuff - like I’m sure I read once that sore muscles from exercise, which is inflammation effectively, cause a bit of water retention.

Can you set yourself a longer goal - like you will do this for a month, no matter what your daily losses are? To try to stop that daily impact if the scales haven’t moved. I would bet that by this time next week you will be feeling happier.

[Doubleyouexwhyandzed]

Thank you, it’s true, had I not been hopping on the scales so often I wouldn’t have been disappointed so often. I’ve just eaten six grapes and a bit of sandwich through pure annoyance. I think I can pull it back from that though 😂
It’s so frustrating though, to be having so few cals and not see loss. Like, physically I must be burning stored energy?!?!?

[MozzchopsThirty]

Spectacular fall from the wagon last nite (dry January and fast 800)
Had lost almost 2kg this week
Last night had 3 pints of lager and 2 glasses of red, whole meal pasta and lots of bread & oil
Back on it today, not going out or seeing anyone other than the kids so should be easier

[FluffyEarMuffs]

@Kimlek that often happens to me too! I lost half a pound just by going back to bed for half an hour and drinking a cup of mint tea 😁

I wonder if it is just waking up the metabolism by getting up the first time?

[MooPointCowsOpinion]

Half a stone down in 9 days! Amazing!
I’m not finding this too hard so far, though we had two mince pies left over from Christmas and their use by date was yesterday so me and hubby ate them last night... hopefully the mince pie doesn’t come back to ruin me later!
I’m going to start taking a multi vitamin, any recommendations?

[FluffyEarMuffs]

@MooPointCowsOpinion I also want to take a multi vitamin. I rummaged around at hone and found some Vit B plus other vits "for fatigue" that are still in date in the cupboard, so I'll use them up first. I just need to remember to take one with dinner!