Child & Mum in France, Dad in England

[LadyandGent]

My friend's ex wife lives in France. Their ds is 12 and lives with the Mum (Mum is French and ds is French I think). My friend lives here in England and is English. He doesn't have any formal access arrangements, but generally, the ds comes over for a couple of weeks over the holidays. How is this now going to work out for him post Brexit?

Is he dual national? Might be worth having both passports

I live in France; Shouldn’t make any difference.
Thé ds won’t need a visa.
However, maybe the child should consider applying for a British passport, more for the future, just in case he ever wants to live in England.
A lot of the French parents I know are desperate for their kids to speak English.

X post

No, I think he's just French. My friend moved back here when they divorced.

The DS won’t need a visa if traveling on a French passport at least in the short terms and for periods of less than 90 days. I’d suggest getting him a British passport to avoid the faff in the future though if things change.

the hague convention about children is nothing to do with EU and will still apply, as both France and UK are signed up to it despite the scare mongering apart from at worst a couple of days disruption maybe flights and travel will continue costs and procedures may change but everyone travelled just fine by plane boat etc before EU and will continue to do so afterwards

He probably does have a right to British citizenship even if he doesn't currently have a UK passport, but that's not relevant here as he can travel on his French ID.

Note that he will need to get a French passport if he doesn't already have one - most French people don't because they can travel on their ID cards throughout the EEA. After Brexit the UK probably won't accept ID cards.

Main issue will be healthcare - post Brexit he will require travel insurance that covers healthcare in the UK as this will no longer be covered by his EHIC.

And remember that if he's not a Brit and there is a hard Brexit, he'll no longer be eligible to enrol in a UK state school
(under the UK's current visa regime)

If his father is British, he is probably entitled to a British passport for his DS, which will make his visits much easier and solve all problems with healthcare, potential schooling and university etc, if relevant.

TBH this is by far the easiest way forward.

solve all problems with healthcare

Not if he isn't resident.

When my British kids stay with their British grandma in the U.K., they require an EHIC for any healthcare (after Brexit they will require insurance).

Access to the NHS is based on residence not nationality.

I think nationality is a red herring.

The real difference Brexit makes is that your friend's DS won't be able to stay in the UK for more than 90 days at a time (if travelling as a tourist) and the parents will jointly have to work out what to do about health insurance.

solve all problems with healthcare ......and university
Mistigri is right, a British passport is no use for healthcare if you're not resident - we had a £800 bill when British non-resident DD needed emergency hospital care during a visit to UK and we didn't have a EHIC. We got it refunded by the French government, but after Brexit that would no longer be the case.
Also British citizens (meaning children of Brits abroad, but also those who were born, educated and paid years of taxes in the UK) will be on overseas students rates for fees after 2019 if they don't fulfil recent residency requirements.
No idea about schools.

Non EU children CANNOT be enrolled in state schools.
After a hard Brexit, NO foreign resident or national children will be eligible for UK state schools
(except citizens of certain territories like the Falklands - whose kids all come to Peter Symonds for 6th form)
www.gov.uk/child-study-visa

I didn't realise that about healthcare - my dual national but non resident (at the time) DC definitely had free NHS treatment when we were visiting family in the UK without an EHIC, but that may have changed.

But for travelling between France and the UK , a passport would certainly make things easier post brexit. If his father was born in Britain of British parents, his French-born son will be entitled to british citizenship. My 12yo has dual nationality and a UK passport and his circumstances were the same. With citizenship he could also attend a British state school.

present
You can thank Theresa May and the Hostile environment she brought in as Home Secretary.
Most of the xenophobia and racism whipped up since 2010 can be traced back to her policies as Home Secretary
remember the Go Home vans

He comes back for a few week on holidays?

Well then it will just be a holiday won’t it?

@TalkinPeece
Conveniently forgetting there that TM voted to Remain

My 12yo has dual nationality and a UK passport and his circumstances were the same. With citizenship he could also attend a British state school.
Better be quick though
as once the UK is non EU it will be the same process I went through
kiss goodbye to £3,000

Brekkie
How she voted is irrelevant.
She brought in the hostile environment
Its why I got my UK passport before she did too much damage

If the child‘s father is a British citizen by birth (rather than be descent) and the father is on the birth certificate, the child is a British citizen regardless of where he was born and whether he has a British passport. It will be easier to travel in and out if he actually gets a British passport. The father just needs to apply.

UK Health care is theoretically only free for UK residents (regardless of nationality/contributions etc) but in practice an English speaking parents would rarely if ever be asked to prove entitlement. Emergency treatment is always free - so assuming the child has no underlying health conditions, this is unlikely to be a problem. The child will in any case be insured in the French system and the mother should be able to claim back any costs incurred.

Both UK and France are Hague Convention (child abduction) signatories. This convention has nothing to do with the EU so will not be impacted by Brexit.

So all in all, there will not be any problems.

You do not need to be a resident to apply for British citizenship/passport.
You do if you want free access to the NHS.
Surely the child can get travel insurance, then no bother.

@Talk in Peece

Non UK citizens can study at UK state schools if their parents are resident In UK. There were loads at my younger DC’s state school. This childs father is a UK so enrollment should be straightforward.

www.gov.uk/guidance/schools-admissions-applications-from-overseas-children

The link you have posted is for UNACCOMPANIED non UK national children.

From what you’ve said, technically I don’t think Brexit will make any impact.

If the ds was born outside of the uk to one non-British parent and one British parent, the British parent (as the rules currently stand) cannoass down their British nationality to the ds, either now or after Brexit.

If the ds has been settled in France for some time (enough to establish ‘habitual residence’), the British parent could not permanently relocate the ds to the uk without the mother’s permission being in breach of the The Hague convention, either before or after Brexit.

I’m sort of in the opposite situation - I intend to register my dd’s birth (born in an eu country to me (Brit) and an eu (non Brit) father with the ok authorities before Brexit, but that’s only for when the zombie apocalypse happens after Brexit resulting in the total breakdown of all law and order my own piece of mind.

@TalkinPeece

“Totally irrelevant”
She wanted to stay within the EU. That fact alone would indicate she’s not a xenophobe