Settled Status - when already have ILR

[NameChangedAgain18]

Can anyone help me decipher the government webpages for Settled Status?

On this page, it states that "you will not need to apply if you are an Irish citizen, or have indefinite leave to remain":
www.gov.uk/settled-status-eu-citizens-families

But then, the page on how to apply seems to suggest that you will need to apply if you have ILR, and that the fee will be waived:

www.gov.uk/settled-status-eu-citizens-families/applying-for-settled-status

I'm asking because my mother came here in 1965, so pre-EU. She has never taken British citizenship (which would, at the time, have meant giving up her French citizenship) but she has either permanent residence or ILR (I'm not sure which, without checking). Is this going to become void at the point of exit from the EU, requiring her to apply again for the rights she had already been granted? Is anyone else in a similar position, and can advise?

I've been discussing the same thing with my dad who came to England from Italy in the 60s. It's all so bloody vague but, at the moment, i cant see any cut-off point or specific circumstances under which EU nationals won't have to apply - I'm furious. If anyone has useful information, please share.

Yes, that’s my understanding (and feelings) as well. My mother’s 75 now, and not very mobile. She allowed her French passport to expire as she hasn’t travelled abroad for 20 years. So, if she does have to apply for settled status, I am somehow going to have to get her to London, twice, to renew and then collect her French passport. I’m disgusted that elderly people who have already been through an immigration process are now being told that their documented right to stay is being removed from them, and they have to apply for a new status, after 50 plus years of living here.

I think it's right that even if you have ILR (or Permanent Residence, as it says on the crappy 1940s-style PR card), the plan is that you still have to register for Settled Status, they just won't charge you. And they assure us that registering for SS will be easy, as long as you have an Android phone. I expect there'll be plenty of older people (including us) who can just about handle email, but aren't particularly clued up about smartphones.

Of course, none of this will apply if we leave without a deal. Then it's anyone's guess what will happen. Fortunately, we know the Home Office is a caring and efficient agency who don't make mistakes, so we'll be "fine". (Did I mention Windrush? Anyway, I think I got away with it).

I think it might be that you need to apply if you have ILR but don't have a biometric residence card (which are fairly recent). But you only really need this to return to the UK if you leave, I have one and have only ever used it for this purpose. (Could also be used as a valid form of photo id instead of a passport or drivers licence).

Sadly your Mum has a problem
if she arrived before free movement (1989)
and has no citizenship documents she is technically stateless

I'm non EU non Commonwealth and having been locked up by UK customs once am an utter stickler for having the right papers

FWIW the French would have given her a harder time (Anglaise sans carnet) than the English have

so you'll need to take her to London

@namechange
On a more positive note, the Home Office seems to be processing papers of EU citizens quite fast at the moment (possibly due to school holidays? Less applications in the summer?) I sent my application for PR last month and already have the card. Average waiting time was supposed to be 6 months. I would sort this out for her right now.

FWIW the French would have given her a harder time (Anglaise sans carnet) than the English have

Not true (in the reverse situation she'd automatically be entitled to French citizenship by now).

I think I would try to sort this out now if waiting times have decreased as the PP says.

But it's disgusting that she should have to.

Quietrebel

We hadn't noticed things speeding up. We submitted DW's citizenship application in early May and are still waiting. Mind you, things weren't helped by the HO losing her biometric enrolment information (and blaming us), then taking almost a month to fess up and request new ones. Which we did a month ago and still heard nothing.

Our first application (for PR) was submitted in early March last year. It was rejected (after 40 years' residence) and we had to redo the entire application. Getting all the required documentation together obviously took a while, too. So, 18 months down the line, language & Life in UK tests, over £2000 paid, untold hours spent ploughing through the forms and still in limbo. I just hope it's resolved and DW gets her citizenship before next March, otherwise we're buggered (if there's no deal)!

To cap it all, the whole shebang may be invalidated if we have to apply for Settled Status instead. Hence going the whole hog for citizenship now, as dual nationality may no longer be allowed after next March.

@Hasenstein
How poor of them to have messed things up so badly for your DW. I can only of course speak for myself and perhaps it was just luck due to a less busy time over summer, but equally perhaps this reflects a different approach to processing applications.
I hope things speed up for your DW.

mistigri
The French gave me a very hard time years ago for not having the right visas.
I stopped going there for nearly a decade because of it

Ta1kin a British national who had lived in France for over 40 years and had locally-born children would be able to obtain French nationality very simply via the declaration process.

British immigration rules are far more draconian than is the case in most European countries, in particular for people who have lived in the UK for many years legally, and those with British children or partners.

It is a national shame that a person who has been in the UK legally for over 50 years should be at risk of losing their status, and that they should have to pay to secure their right to remain permanently.

mistigri
Don't I know it.

I'd been here over 40 years when I applied to become British.
My English school exams did not count as proof of language proficiency
I had to take the Life in the UK test - most of the staff at the test centre admitted they could not pass it
and I had to pay out over £2000
despite having had ILR for decades

the UK has the most expensive visas in the world

Hello, I’ve only just seen the more recent replies on this thread. Thank you for your posts.

Unfortunately my mother has taken the view that she is not going to apply for a status she already has. She is saying that she has documentation stating that she is allowed to remain in the country and stating that she has nothing further do do with regards to paperwork, etc. Therefore, she says she will be doing nothing else. She also doesn’t trust the government to refuse her this new status, so thinks it is safer just not to engage with this process, and sees it as potentially jeopardising her existing status.

I can see her point, but am very worried about the whole thing.

Unfortunately my mother has taken the view that she is not going to apply for a status she already has.
She doesn't already have it, though. When freedom of movement was established in 1993, ILR became irrelevant for EU citizens.

She doesn't already have it, though. When freedom of movement was established in 1993, ILR became irrelevant for EU citizens.

That sort of makes sense. However, I’ve just taken a look at the online guidance and seen something else (I’m almost certain it wasn’t there last time I looked) which seems to suggest that she might be able to just retain the ILR:

“If you already have indefinite leave to remain this will not be affected by the UK leaving the EU. However, settled status gives some better rights and if you would like to, you can exchange this for settled status free of charge.”

I hope this is the case. I’m feeling very stressed out at the prospect of having an elderly parent who is refusing to prevent herself potentially becoming an illegal immigrant.

The racist xenopobe Theresa May
has a LOT to answer for

if she arrived before free movement (1989) and has no citizenship documents she is technically stateless

This isn't true: she might not have proof of citizenship, but lack of documentation doesn't automatically mean that someone isn't eligible to hold it. OP's mother is still French but doesn't have any valid paperwork to demonstrate this. So the first step would be to get valid French ID and then apply for settled status

OP - have you seen the ILR stamp in your mum's old passport? Is it still legible?

If she has a passport with the ILR in it
and no cancellation mark across THAT stamp
it is still valid
much as it galls the Home Office, "indefinite" means exactly that.
The passport can have run out yonks ago
but so long as the stamp has not been cancelled, its good
(they cancel them when they move it into the next passport - I have my full set)

Have you looked at the Windrush scheme? It applies also to EU citizens who have been here for many years, like your mum (and mine!) and offers documentary proof of iLR. EU citizens can't apply for this any more, but if they were here before 1971 ( I think) then the Home Office will look into government records & provide documentation of ILR for free. And if you have ILR then I don't think you have to apply for settled status, because your residence rights were established before the UK joined the EU.
There are some differences between ILR and settled status but for an elderly person who is unlikely to travel much then the differences probably aren't relevant.
Lots of EU people have ILR from decades ago but the govt didn't automatically provide documentation. The Windrush scheme is designed to resolve this for EU nationals, as well as commonwealth/U.K. Citizens.

I agree, Ta1kin, I was asking the OP to check whether the ILR stamp is still visible as it must be at least 20 years old if the passport expired back then and probably a lot older. Stamps can deteriorate, particularly if the passport went through the wash at some point or something similar

My ILR from 1970 is still clearly legible in that passport - goodness knows what the ink was that they used !

Some countries cancel and destroy the old passports on renewal, which means that many people might well have lost that ancient ILR stamp from the 1960's!

Some countries cancel and destroy the old passports on renewal
which ones?
The old passport comes back marked as cancelled - both my nationalities .... why would they destroy it when it might have transferrable visas in it?

If your mum has never lived outside of the UK since she first came to the UK, she might qualify for a BRP card under the Windrush scheme. She won't be eligible for free citizenship as that's only for people born in commonwealth countries.

Would that be easier to explain to her? That way she's not applying for anything new, only a modern version. Like paper driving licenses being replaced with plastic cards.

The French authorities keep old passports. And once Britain joined the EU followed by Freedom of Movement, who ever thought that it might one day be critically important to have a certain passport stamp?