Don't know how to advise them on the work needed to their house

[Startednotfinished]

Mum and dad are both 90, one with dementia and both living independently. They are managing but their house is in serious need of major work (thankfully not the part of the house they inhabit much).

They are resolute they are not moving until they absolutely have to (believe me I have tried!). They don't want to pay for, or have the disruption of the work needed done, but I'm worried as I'm not sure how the decrease in value of the house will affect them if they don't get the work done. Maybe it won't?

I'm not a house owner so am fairly ignorant on these things, but this worries me. I have POA lined up but that will only kick in when neither of them have capacity, so not sure I can do much really. Any thoughts?

Yes, I think mum is worried to spend what money they have (which is not a huge amount and she's worse off if dad goes first) incase it means lower quality care if either of them needs it. But am thinking if the house is difficult to sell or depreciates due to not having the work done, then they're in a worse position if they need to sell quickly. Which, with dementia in the mix I'd think is fairly likely, for one if not both, as it seems they want to struggle on until one of them can't, so anticipating a bit of a crisis situation when that happens.

It's not a great time of year for roof works though, so it might be we can't find anyone til spring in any case 😕

This is really helpful thank you, I will check the paperwork as I'm not clear when POA can kick in.

Thank you - it doesn't help that it's a very unusual building - it's not a standard roof (think grand designs/archetecturally unique type of thing!) so I actually think a surveyor might be the best port of call in the first instance. I'm not sure many roofers will know what to do with it!

I think you have to stress to them that none of you can take a decision until you know exactly what the problems are. So you have to get things diagnosed and then you all can sit back and decide what to do. Supposing these issues can be dealt with from outside, or supposing it means just a few hours away whilst the electrics are sorted. You won’t know till you know.
obviously they’ll need a lot of support whilst all of this is sorted but it seems you are offering that. IME they resist and resist, they make do, then 2 days after you’ve forced them to get stuff sorted, they’re acting like it was all their idea anyway and isn’t it marvellous.

I would recommend against a surveyor. They don't know much about roofing and nothing about electrics, if you get a structural survey on your house they always recommend getting a specialist roofer in and a seperate electrical safety check. Especially if its an unusual building.

I have a close family member who is a surveyor and when we bought our house (a do up) he recommended we paid a good builder for their time over a survey. Honestly ask around for reputable tradespeople. Get 2 or 3 roofers to do quotes. You can get some do a paid quote for a roof with a drone if it needs a good look. No need to wait til spring either for a quote.

For electrical get a safety check. You can often update just the fuse board and get away without a full rewire if they need additional surge protection. That is a lot less disruptive. Look for a registered electrician and again ask around.

You said you don't own a property. Do you rent? If so and your landlord is OK explain the situation to them and ask if they can recommend tradespeople. They are bound to have an electrician at least as need certificates for rental properties.

Thanks for all the replies - all good food for thought, and yes, I think quotes for both are the way to go. It's the unknown that is all a bit daunting and I just don't want them burying their heads in the sand, only to later regret it.

Similar situation OP. Also complicated by listed building. I activated finance PoA about 2 years ago with DP’s agreement- it is only the health POA where you wait until they lose capacity.
Luckily they have a trusted local builder.
They have patched up leaking roof, & I persuaded them to get all windows repainted on basis that if they weren’t weatherproof they would need to be replaced soon which is vv expensive.
They have agreed to get an accessible shower installed in a bathroom- I said a good shower would improve the value of the house.
Other more expensive repairs we are leaving, eg dilapidated Victorian greenhouse.
They are too old to move & luckily the house can accommodate a carer.
Good luck, it’s a tough road ahead.

Round here roofers are booked loads in advance…..we had to wait 9 months

Again you don’t need a surveyor in my experience that is just a listener to print money.

Find a reliable builder from word of mouth or a recently retired builder and ask them for a paid opinion. Or get a builder to do a quote.

We had our gutters cleaned and turns out the guy used to be a roofer and he appraised our roof even though he doesn’t build any more.

moat builders will be able to advise on any build type. I probably won’t need replacing.

what type of roof is it and what is the problem?

what is the problem with the electrics.

OP- just a heads up that the moment you get LPOA you can use it.
You don't have to wait until it "kicks in" or your parents are completely incapable. It is a legal document and the moment you have it, is when you can use it for their finances. I think a lot of people don't realise this.

I got it for my dad and used it immediately, no-one asked me if he was incapacitated, I just handed the form over to his bank and used it immediately.

As PP have said, roof leaking and poor electrics is a disaster waiting to happen so if it were me, I'd get it fixed ASAP

OP- just a heads up that the moment you get LPOA you can use it.
You don't have to wait until it "kicks in" or your parents are completely incapable. It is a legal document and the moment you have it, is when you can use it for their finances. I think a lot of people don't realise this.

But it has to be with their consent right? My mum said she wanted us to have it in place because she could envisage a day when she just didn’t want the hassle of dealing with it all so she’d hand it over then. I couldn’t just start using it straight away if she didn’t want me to, right? The OP can help her parents get quotes, organise payment etc but only if they actually want the roof to be repaired.

That is right.

Nine months probably for a full refund roof. For an appraisal and quotes won't be that. Then depends on the scale and complexity of what needs doing.

@Startednotfinished have you been in the loft yourself when it is raining or shortly after? If its missing tiles you will be able to see the water coming in. If its round the chimney that can sometimes be fixed with a chimney repoint and lead replacement.

What does the fuse box look like. Is it one of the ones where you have a few switches/levers that pop up if something trips? Or a brown one with no switches (the fuses in these are wired). It's the brown ones that are very old. If the cabling in the walls and lights are safe enough - is there any flickering, fishy smells, burning smells, etc? Depends where you live but where I am you can get a new consumer unit for less than £1k.

LPOA doesn’t mean you can just go ahead and get people in to obtain quotes for works against your DPs wishes. This is a tricky situation - what if you did get prices for roof repairs and the prices came in far higher than you thought? If your DPs don’t have the money, all that will do is make them more worried!
If the house does need to be sold to pay for care then assuming fees of £60k per year, and potentially 2 year stay would cost £120k - how much do you think the house is worth in its current state?

But POA can only act in accordance with the expressed wishes of the person whose money it is, if they have capacity.

Ok- let me give you a scenario- your mum gets dementia and tells you that you aren't allowed to use her credit card to buy her food. What then? Would you not use it? because consent/capacity can vary from day to day. Your mum needs food so of course you would use it.

The point of LPOA is that it's to be used by someone you trust in a responsible manner and they should be keeping all receipts and statements regarding what they have spent it on. So, yes, there might be times when your relative doesn't give consent but you still use it because it's in their best interests to do so. This is why people need to think very carefully about whom they give LPOA to.

Unfortunately, I had to make the decision for my dad when to start using it because he had dementia and couldn't specifically tell me the day when I should start so I had to use my own judgement about when to start using it. When I did - no-one specifically asked me if I had his consent, I had the legal LPOA form and that was enough.

Nothing will affect speed of sale - price reflects condition

@Rubyrooladyofpoo

but the scenarios you are describing don’t match the OPs situation unless I’ve missed the part where she says that her parents don’t have capacity? she says one has dementia, but both still have capacity to make decisions as far as I can see. That includes bad (from her pov) decisions.

Using her mums credit card to buy some food isn’t really on a par with getting quotes for a roof repair and organising / paying for the work to be done.

I think you should sort a reputable roofer to have a look. What you don't want is someone random turning up and telling them they have noticed their roof needs doing then charging a fortune to do shoddy work or no work at all.

Agree with getting roofers to quote. And agreed that it should be with their consent. However if you are doing all the legwork and minimising upheaval, they are more likely to consent.

Dont expect the process to be easy - imo they will be stressed and upset every day the job is happening. I would definitely go for the ‘decent patch up’ rather than ‘full replacement’ if the option is there.

By which I mean, with their agreement get the use of poa set up - for my mum I had to make a long appointment with the bank branch in person. But being able to just present the options to them, get their agreement and then go ahead yourself is priceless.

New roof not that much disruption inside, so start with that.