Forcing care?

[rivalsbinge]

I’m asking on behalf of my DH, his dad has dementia diagnosed 15+ years, up until recently his mum 84 has been his carer but now she is frail, having ing some very strange symptoms like paranoia etc and becoming quite unstable.

My DH and his siblings want them both on a care home to relieve her stress and help them to have a better quality of life. But MILL is point blank refusing to accept she is struggling, won’t see a GP for what we suspect are TIAs and is also refusing the carers entry to their home.

As a result her husband is poorly cared for and suffering.

What are the rules? Can anyone force care? Would my DH have to prove neglect? How on earth to you move on from here?

They have money can afford care, she is just refusing any help at all.

It does feel like a high speed train crash waiting to happen and outs so much strain on our family, with a-levels and day to day life being constantly upended, and the expense of travelling etc I do hope we can get something in place that works for them both quickly.

In a sense being eight hours away means their local social work team will be in no doubt that you can't help. Are you in a different country to them, OP? For example, England v Scotland. There are slight differences between the English and Scottish (and Welsh and NI) situations for navigating personal care and OPG.

We are in a different country yes, so the systems do appear to be different, we are just navigating that as well.

Hi OP my dad was in Scotland and I in England and I found I could call their social services dept and got a welfare person from the council to sort out attendance allowance, stuff can be done from a distance.

Mine was a bit more amenable to help though, despite having dementia.

Is it possible to get one of them into respite care?
Mum may be more amenable to Dad going into respite to give her “a little rest”.
This would get Dad into a situation where his health can be properly assessed.

We did respite for a week when she was sick and he came back even more confused (apparently) and she’s said never again, in fact that’s why she’s so stubborn saying no care for them ever, it did more harm than good.

He loved it and in our opinion thrived, he was clean, happy, chatting and non the wiser, he didn’t even question where he was where she was.

That’s the thing I the social services are being really good but we can’t get her to take the care? That’s this issue can’t seem to convince her and now are totally stuck.

I’m so sorry, it’s an awful situation.
You must keep in mind that you can only do so much. X

Thank for being so kind, I think it’s awful that we have a FIL who is stinking dirty being neglected, not eating quality food and he’s not capable of self care and yet it’s his wife doing this to him out of stubbornness, fear or some other mental health issues.

We feel so helpless to do anything.

You literally have to report everything as a safeguarding, by email every time. They can't necessarily force care, but they do have to deal with neglect, be it by putting FIL in respite under a care order etc

Adult social services will override MIL wishes if things continue deteriorating.
I'm sure that they would be responsible once involved if FIL is suffering.

I agree

OP, it’s an alien world right now. Who expected to have to navigate emergency at risk social work from 800 miles when you want your absolute family focus to be on DC’s important exams?
DM was sectioned on the day of DD’s most critical exam. DF had a tragic accident a few weeks later when DD’s leavers trip to Crete were assembling at the airport.
The social work team and MH officer who stepped in saw this chaos every day. Along the way you will meet some inspirational people who will get you and FIL and DH out of your current normal to a new position. It won’t continue like this as change is inevitable 💐

All you can do is report your concerns over the phone repeatedly and ask for fil to be checked over and make sure it’s noted that none of the family are helping in any way so if she says they are it’s a lie.

That’s a plan we have voiced concerns but if they get in touch with her she says they are fine.. nothing to report and can come across well.

Wow you’ve really been through it as well. such kindness on this thread thank you.

Honestly I’m so grateful it’s not my own parents in this state, my DF died 4 years ago and my DM is currently active, fit and sane, who knows what’s next for her but I’m just glad it’s not the utter mess my DH is facing.

You really do have to persistently report so that they have a paper trail which then leads to the necessary checks. My parents social worker sent the police round as it was reported that my mum assaulted my dad, she was hitting him with her car keys and he was too proud to tell anyone. She sat in the living room and cackled with laughter. It was the first in a very long line of reports, but eventually built up a picture of what his life was like living with her, yes she has advanced dementia, yes she was eventually moved into a home as it was deemed she lacked capacity, your FIL is in a safeguarding situation which they have a statutory obligation to act upon. We were getting nightly calls from my mum telling us she wanted to stab him etc. I know its very hard but it has to be officially reported. They can even be asked not to say who the reports came from if that's a worry for you. You have to get the professionals to look at this further

@Lightuptheroom is right. The more agencies / members of the public that are involved commenting worries the better a picture is painted. Has DH or siblings actually spoken to DFil in last few days? Could DFil be more frail these past few days and actually need urgent medical intervention. You need to add these concerns into your emails. Eg DMil refuses to let us know he is awake; literally she gives us no confidence to know he is alive..Dramatic I know but you are at a dramatic stage if his dementia journey is 15 years.
Personally I would be trying to trigger DM to display unusual behaviour to the delivery people so that their safe guarding code kicks in. Can you have their local pharmacy deliver incontinence products privately and hope your DMil’s angry response to these arriving unexpectedly prompts pharmacy personnel to call the SW team.

If it helps you, the language is 'I'm reporting a safeguarding concern' on (date) (time) Mrs x was witnessed telling Mr x blah blah blah. We have concerns for his safety and would like this recorded on his file as a safeguarding alert. We understand that x and y agencies have a duty of care to Mr x

This means that social services HAVE to respond with x amount of hours or days. They HAVE to see the person and complete a report. Believe me when they receive at least one report every day they have to act. A person without capacity cannot be relied upon to give an accurate account of the neglect they are experiencing. The local authority are massively slipping up here if they are providing a care package and allowing your MIL to evade them. Tell your DH to contact his MP and the police if social services fob him off. They have a duty of care end of.

@Lightuptheroom has excellent advice there, and the wording is perfect. Tell your DH to say that his mum will deny everything, so they must make sure that they see your FIL and note his condition.

Could you do it for your dad though and not her, get him allocated a social worker? The it would be less about her and more about him..