Incontinence - Advice

[helpwithelderly]

Please can anyone offer any advice.

My grandfather is now double incontinent, he lives at home and has carers going in to help.

Family also go every day to visit.

The problem - Grandfather is refusing to use any incontinence products.

Therefore, we are cleaning up accidents several times a day. This is now becoming overwhelming for all of us as due to failing eye sight he can’t see very well and the trail that’s being left around the house, on towels, his clothing, the floor etc

We are very concerned on top of the house situation above that he is going to get very, very ill as everything is becoming contaminated despite how much we clean etc

We have tried to discuss it and he becomes very angry and upset.

Please can anyone offer advice if they have been in this situation.

There isn't anything you can do unfortunately. I think the continence issue is why a lot of people end up in care homes to be honest - because family can't cope with it anymore.

Going through similar with my DM who will only wear those pads for women who have occasional leaks while completely soaking her pyjamas multiple times a night and her clothes during the day. It's so frustrating. No solutions I'm afraid but offering solidarity. We asked her carer to raise it with her and she's tried but DM just refuses to wear incontinence pants.

My mum has pads that are put in her pants as she can't get to the toilet by herself and also has carers going in.

Would he not even use pads? Does he not realise he is being selfish?

Thank you @devastatedagain and @Iamthemoom for replying.

We are 18 months into caring for him after the loss of my Grandmother. About 12 months into the incontinence which is getting worse by the day. We now have carers to support us but only 4 weeks in and he is not regularly complying with them.

Today I have been to his house twice and both times he has had a bowel accident.

He used to wear underwear and trousers so the underwear would catch most of it, now nothing, just trousers.

We have tried everything to encourage him but he is just refusing.

I have begged him to help us to keep him in his home by wearing them. I’ve said he will need to go into a care home if he doesn’t help us. Collectively we have tried everything and it’s always a no.

This is the brand of pads my mum has. She gets some provided through the continence service but they won't provide the higher absorbency she needs for night time so she buys them from amazon

He has these and pants provided by the hospital.

We also purchased 50 x Tena Pants that we felt wound be easier for him. All sat untouched in his bedroom.

Would he wear pull up Incontinence pants like the nappy pull ups but for adults?

We were all living in fear about what we would find when we went to visit as in, had he hurt himself or had a fall.

The carers have removed that fear but it’s been replaced with dread at what we will be cleaning up. It’s so unpleasant.

We bought them, we showed him how to use them. Refused.

I have even put a pair on myself, gone to visit and told him I need them too and shown him I’m wearing them. Refused.

From experience, it could an objection to the appearance of the products.
We couldn't understand DFs objection to the pull up style pants until he referred to them as the "frilly knickers". Then we could see that the ruched elastic and the white colour did make them look like frilly knickers.

In addition, it could also be related to a difficulty in putting the products on or finding them uncomfortable. DF is very stiff and could not put pull ups on by himself as the electric is too springy and they are difficult to hold open to get a foot in.

I think that the incontinence service will send free samples of different products to try. Could you get a few that could be suitable and then see if your grandfather would mind discussing them- you could ask him which colour, style etc he likes/doesnt like and then discuss comfort and ease of putting them on/off.
An occupational therapist might be able to offer help too if you can access one.

No advice but sending sympathy OP.
The continence issues are really hard I am finding, both practically and emotionally.

Another consideration is does he have somewhere to dispose of used pads or soiled underwear?

A bucket with a lid could be put in the bathroom and show your grandfather that any underwear he's had an accident in can be put in there with the lid on.
He could be worried about the expense? Could be he reassured about that? Many people worry if they are using more than they used to even if they actually have enough money.

The pull ons are blue TENA and he could manage to get them on and off. He said he liked them then refused to wear them.

He also has a pad like a sanitary towel that sits inside white very soft pants. Refused.

He will not use any type of pad.

When he was in hospital he complied and wore both of the style we have at home, but as soon as he got home. Refused.

Thank you and yes they are. I send sympathy and empathy to you.

We have bought buckets, bags, bins for disposal.

He knows that the NHS sent them for him because he needs them but he keeps asking us to send them back.

We have tried so many different wants to support, we feel like all options are exhausted, hence posting here for something we haven’t tried.

I don't have lots of knowledge but I do believe incontinence is closely related to cognitive decline. Do you think he is genuinely choosing to shit himself on the daily, or is he just optimistic and forgets he needs pads?

A route might be for the carers to escalate this. Are they ever dealing with it, or are you always doing it? Do you know what the nursing team were doing in hospital? My guess would be that they had a regular toileting regime plus skilled nursing to persuade him to wear the pads.

I wonder if you may have to down tools for a day or two. At that point the carers are likely to escalate. But I'm afraid the end point is likely to be respite placement in a nursing home, which is likely to become permanent. That sounds tbh like the most likely outcome in any case.

@PermanentTemporary It started about 12 months ago and over time has got worse.

We do believe he has cognitive decline and we do believe this is not helping what was already a difficult situation. We believe the two are directly linked.

In hospital he just wore them, no question and just let the staff do what they had to do. He seemed compliant.

We are constantly questioning what we can do and what we can say and how we can help.

Carers are fairly new to this. They assist in cleaning up when they notice but sometimes they just don’t get to the area it’s happened in due to his non compliance. Because he says no, they leave.

Today, for example, he had, had an accident, it was on the floor, he saw me clean it. I then returned later and he had, had another accident, again he saw me clean it. I explained both times that pads would help. He got cross and upset.

In addition, he is trying to hand wash soiled garments in the sink, unsuccessfully, and as you can imagine the clean up operation for us is not pleasant. This is now every day for us on top of what the carers have been able to do.

Was just going to say the same.
This is usually the final straw.
Mil seem obvious to her incontinence (and the fact the house stunk to high heaven)

I think you are right. It’s soul destroying.

Yes, I can understand re: smell.

Go visit some care homes

Does he have a social worker? If not I would be asking for a social service review as this is beyond what you as a family can support.

He does, they are visiting in two weeks to assess.