Gifting of money vs deprivation of assets

[ChristmasLightsLover]

Please can someone suggest a good advisor - not sure if it should be legal or financial - to talk with about gifting money and avoiding deprivation of assets issues?

This feels like a minefield. We aren't sure on how to best go about this and want to get our ducks lined up.

If you've had experience please do tell me on what to look out for! Thank you.

I suppose until you've experienced it, most people have no idea of the reality of what letting the state pay for it means. It isn't just comparing the cost of a place in a CH but whether you'd even get there.

For me it was the realisation that relative could choose to go into residential
care and have a much much better quality of life because she could afford to pay for it vs being left with a few carer visits each day, a less than optimal diet, worrying constantly about security and house maintenance and spending the majority of the time alone.

What is it you're thinking of doing
Who is gifting the money
Are they in good health
Are they likely to need care
How much do they want to give and who to

Interesting thread as I have similar situation. My Mum has an approach where she wants to see people enjoying her generosity, preferably with her, rather than just leaving money behind.

As an only child, every time I have an expense she just wants to pay for it and she is comfortably enough off to do it. However, I've been telling her she can't just do that, specifically because of deprivation of assets.

However, she is reasonably fit and health for her age. Perfectly capable of looking after herself, her home and her finances. On paper, you'd think 'well that's OK then'. The big 'however' though is she's 90.

So, does there come a point when age outweighs health and finances. Should it be an automatic assumption that it would be reasonable to anticipate someone will need care when they reach a certain age?

@ForPearlViper funnily enough I've just posted something similar on the money forum - except he's 85

Thank you, I'll go and look there too.

Has she got a house?

She can give you things, pay for things if she likes, IF she needs care house can be sold to pay. Treating you is hardly divesting herself of all her savings, and she doesn’t currently signs of needing care.

It is a minority of people who go into care homes.

@ForPearlViper What she’s giving you is peanuts compared with care costs. If she spent £1000 on you, it would bring the need for LA support forward by a week.

Pretty sure I've seen that figure banded about quite a lot. I think Teresa May used it too when she was trying to get a care home cost limit put into statute. The statistics seem to indicate the average time the average person spends in a care home is 12-18 months, so at an average of £1500-£2000 per week, it seems to work out about £85k.

Of course, the majority of people don't go into care homes at all. And a minority will spend a lot more time than 12-18 months in one, but the £85k is an average.

I think councils take a very different view and don't follow the IHT rules. Different councils have different "rules" and of course circumstances vary enormously. But there seems to be a lot of emphasis on intention. Of course, the sooner the better really. A council is highly unlikely to go back a decade or two. They're far more likely to start close to the date of need of care home and work backwards to gain a general overview of the person's finances, then check for any major asset disposals, i.e. by cross checking the land registry etc.

Sometimes the personal circumstances make it obvious. I.e. an otherwise healthy person, being diagnosed with early stage dementia/alzheimer who suddenly transfers a property or loads of investments/shares looks highly suspicious, so that fact alone is more important than number of years before care becomes necessary.

Likewise someone otherwise healthy, in younger retirement, deciding to transfer/gift property, investments, cash, for no obvious reason at all, with the full expectation they'd continue to be in good health and live independently for another decade or two, would probably be fine against council challenge, even if they then went onto contract something needing care home just a few years later, as there was clearly no "intent" to avoid care home costs at the time of the gifts, as there was no reason to think a care home would be necessary within realistic time frames.

We're not talking the odd £1000. What has prompted the conversation is new roof on large house type money.

Also that wasn't the question. I'm asking if there is point when age becomes a more significant factor than existing health and unused income when a decision on deprivation of assets is made when there is sudden change of circumstance.

Just to reassure everyone re intentions, the first line is that she moves in with me with her own bedroom, sitting room and bathroom!