Dr has ‘advised’ that FIL stops driving

[rickyrickygrimes]

What does this mean in practice?

FIL is 82. He’s always been a cautious driver but in the last few years has had numerous bumps and scrapes - none (thank God) involving a person, just other cars / bollards etc. He is very dependent on the car despite living in a city: his mobility has reduced to the extent that he can’t walk to the local bus stop. From observation we can see that his judgment and reaction speeds are too slow.
For the moment the car has a puncture and is parked at SILs place, she is in no rush to fix it.

At a recent rdv with the dr to discuss hip pain, fuzzy head (maybe due to codeine prescribed for pain), general decline, the dr ‘advised’ that he should stop driving. SIL was with him and confirms that in her opinion it wasn’t a direct instruction as such, it was ‘I advise you not to drive for the time being at least’, what does this mean in practice? Are we at the inform the DVLA / inform his insurance stage?

he’s been for a ‘frail older person’ assessment, still waiting for the results.

I be agree with this.

I'd be straight on the phone to the dvla.

He's had a few warning bumps, the next 'bollard' could be someone's child!!

I'm a nurse and am shocked at your husband's irresponsible attitude tbh. If a Dr advises you not to drive then you don't drive 🤷‍♀️

I'm in my 40s and had to give up driving due to medical reasons. It's not easy but it was the right thing to do.
Do you have a community transport system in your area? We have a door to door service. It's effectively a cheap taxi as it's subsidised. I often use it to get to my hospital appointments. The benefits of this are it's a mini bus with lift so easy to get in /out. The drivers are used to helping (much more patient than a taxi). It's a bit of community spirit, I often see the same people on the bus and have a nice chat. It's worth trying out if you do. In our area they do it all over the phone as they realise many can't use the technology, they've even phoned me on occasion when I haven't booked to check in on me.

As your SIL was with him when he went to the doctor, it would be reasonable for her to contact him to clarify the situation. The doctor presumably knows that your father has authorised her to have his confidential information.

When we realised my granddad shouldn’t drive anymore (you really don’t need a doctor to tell you this!) the car ‘broke’ and my dad took the keys until grandad realised he was fine without the car and it was made official. Really irresponsible to still let him drive!!

Just go online and fill in the DVLA for him.
He’s been told not to drive and it was daft of the Dr to not say self report to the DVLA.
I’m a nurse, if my patients don’t self report I just inform them that I will have to. They can opt for a driving assessment and if they pass that’s okay, however, I’m very dubious about some of these as I’ve seen people pass that really should not be driving!
He’s too frail, mobility is very poor. I doubt very much he’d respond with an emergency stop in the required time.

If the doctor advised him not to drive, he cannot now drive ever again unless a doctor specifically advises he can

'Advise ' is the terminology they use, it will be in his notes and his insurance is invalidated

Driving 'against medical advice' is a criminal offence in the UK with a fine of up to £1000

Worth seeing if he can get a refund on the remaining insurance term

If it's in his notes, is that something that you could access via his online patient record? It sounds like he'd benefit from seeing something in writing that seems more official than his recall of a conversation with the doctor (even if that's in fact official, it sounds like he's not accepting that). It then might be easier to 'prove' to him that he's not allowed to drive.

What does this mean in practice?

It means he's not to drive. Pretty self explanatory

My DM uses local community transport if so am not around to give her lifts. Cheaper than taxis, but do need to book in advance. If taking to medical appointments they wait to then take you back home. Also a community minibus with regular routes, but this may be because we are rural so goes round the villages to take pensioners to the nearest supermarket

This is interesting! I posted a thread on MN a while back, asking if I was BU for reporting my own DM to DVLA due to her failing eyesight and omg I was RIPPED TO SHREDS and told how many posters were so grateful I wasn't their DD etc etc. Yet when it's a DF, everyone here is suggesting it's the right thing to do! Interesting

It's a very tricky conversation but someone needs to spell it out to him.
When my mother reached that stage sis and I joined forces and daid that frankly she shouldn't be driving and that if she drove and hurt someone she'd never forgive herself. We got her a mobility scooter which she loved and used it to pop to the shops. For longer trips we wrote down the number of a local taxi firm and she was able to ring them.

I have to admit though that for years and years she complained that she should never have got rid of the car and would be perfectly ok.

Unreal that people thought you were being unreasonable. Failing eyesight is a so dangerous.

I recently reported a friend of my parents whose driving was shocking and he told my dad that he hasn’t taking his medication because he wanted to continue driving. He’s currently suspended while being checked out.

You have been told he's not to drive. It’s not unclear. You have a responsibility to act on the doctors instructions. Id report to dvla and be done with it.

We had this with fil. Diagnosed with dementia. Told not to drive until assessed. He got lost going to the assessment centre after numerous visits beforehand with us and instructions and had to be rescued so we removed the car. We said when he could renew his licence and insurance humself he could get the car back. He now walks and uses buses. Taxis are a dirty word to people of that generation for some reason.

I think advised can mean to recommend but also to inform, in this case it seems it is the latter.

Can your family make the insurance company the bad guy in this? It might be worth hunting through the policy small print to find a clause that would translate the GP's vague wording into 'insurance company says no"?

..meanwhile its such a shame that there is such a labour and parts shortage for fixing punctures...

It may be that the advise not to drive ‘for now’ is based on the fact that he is taking codeine.

His insurance is invalid unless he has a conversation with the GP to discuss his driving and something has changed to convince the GP he is now safe to drive.

The GP was gentle in the conversation not to tell FIL that this was permanent so as to not remove hope.

He should make an appointment with the GP for a months time and if at that point GP feels that this should be permanent FIL needs to give up car and cancel insurance etc.

When doctors advise something they mean they are telling you. It's not advice/suggestions, it is much more concrete.

He should not be driving. Get the car off the property if you think he might drive. Make sure he has taxi numbers etc, and a senior bus pass. I have never driven due to disability and I'm sure it will be a huge shock to the system at first to have to give up, but he'll get used to it.

Or for her to say "come on dad, we both know he was telling you not to, he was just using GP language" What else could he say? it's like when you are advised not to drink or in hospital advised not to discharge yourself they mean do not do those things they are dangerous. the GP isn't in charge of him.

I disagree with your DH. If a doctor says, “I advise you to stop driving”, that pretty much means “stop driving”. Obviously he can’t say “I order you to stop driving”.

Why pushy foot around the issue

The doctor clearly stated with a witness, that they believed that this person was not medically fit to drive

No need for a second visit to GP

You could also tell that person, that if they drive & kill someone, that it will be 1000% their fault

Disconnect the battery
Hide the keys
Report to DVLA, insurance

Bus pass
Local community transport
Electric scooter
Taxi account
Friends & family for lifts

Pushy foot 😝