VAT on school fees - High Court Challenge.

[EverythingAllatOnceAllTheTime]

Labour’s plan to impose VAT on private school fees in January faces a High Court legal challenge over claims it breaches human rights law.

Lawyers have written to HM Treasury arguing the policy discriminates against special needs children and has threatened court action if it is not dropped.

Showtime…

Oh, really?

Medium rate DLA is £300 odd a month. Higher rate (for kids who never fucking sleep) is less than £600. I am really, really grateful for that money, and grateful to live in a country that pays it, but it does not touch the sides in terms of the actual costs of their needs.

I can't be in paid employment as my children's needs are too high.
My son's school trauma is so huge, and CAMHS so useless, we are presently funding £110 a week for private psychology EMDR sessions.
My daughter has severe hypermobility and is in orthotic shoes, and the hospital advice is that she needs private 1:1 dance lessons, so that's £36 a week.
They can't wear standard clothing - have to wear specific materials and they have to be made a specific way. Hugely expensive. No H&M and Primark for my son, especially.
They have to have long showers every night as the sensory side relaxes them and helps them to get at least some sleep. That carries costs.
They have very restricted diets and we have to cook three separate meals every night - also have to ensure supplements they can actually accept (so, they can't swallow iron - has to be Spatone in juice, which isn't available on the NHS).
Both are in glasses that aren't covered by NHS costs - my son's are so thick, they don't fit in normal lenses. My daughter needs myopia control lenses which aren't NHS covered but may spare her the 40% risk of permanent blindness in later life myopia on her brother's scale carries - that's £45 a month. Nor can they cope with the cheap local optician; we have to use the smaller, quieter private service just to get them through the doors.
They have specific needs that constantly throw up random costs - my son can't cope with NHS dental x rays so we have to pay for the touch-free, 360 machines instead.

That's before the £100,000 we've spent across the last six years proving their needs and taking the LA to Tribunal - which you can only win if the LA broke the law to begin with. Four in, we always win. And their educational provision reflects this. But we don't run a car, don't go on holidays, and my own clothes very much do come from Primark and H&M - or Vinted. We are very, very substantially in debt.

But hey, the EHCP pays the school fees, so no VAT for us. Winning!

You have absolutely no clue. And for the record, I spend a lot of my time helping parents who have no funds and no way to get EHCPs, and who don't understand the system, to get their kids sorted. I don't take a penny and never would - any money they do have should go on expert reports to prove the needs. A lot of people in here are bleating about social justice and showing zero knowledge or compassion for the families affected. I spend a lot of my life supporting low income families in getting their kids the EHCPs and the support they need - some into private schools, with LA paid fees.

Again, I don't give a toss about VAT for parents whose kids don't have these needs. But saying those who do should be broken in state mainstreams alongside peers whose parents have no options... why? Who benefits if even MORE kids are badly harmed? Not even the tax payer - failing SEN kids this much is costing the state billions, long term. Every child protected is a gain for every one of us. And try asking the LA if they think this will go well for their SEN budgets, too. It won't.

We need an exemption for kids on DLA.

So why did you move?? Be honest? As secondary wasn’t looking appealing in the state school? Why was it not appealing?? Because of the behavioural issues in the older age groups!!

I think on a basic level all decent parents understand that if you can afford to help your child - the instinct is you do. But that does not mean I am responsible for the government not investing in public schools or for the government not helping other parents who don’t have the privilege we do to help our daughter. We have saved the tax payer £49k by pulling our daughter out of her brilliant free school - and another child gladly took her place.

When I was growing up as a child of an immigrant we were so poor that we did not have enough food to eat - so I have no problem paying more in taxes to improve education for all, improve the nhs etc. I would rather we all have a decent standard of living than just a few.

But the government is not doing that. My daughter is in yr13 - she is finishing school soon and we will then not be paying the vat. I think it would make more sense surely to get more taxes out of me for years rather than just a few terms of schools? The whole nation should be paying increased taxes to improve our schools - the government cherry picked a few parents because it helped their election campaign.

It isn’t about not mixing with state school kids, well not for most private school parents in my experience. A lot of it is because that is what they are used to - for generations their families have used private schools so they don’t know what state schools are like and it is alien. For others it is convenient for working parents as it gets all schoolwork, music, sport, drama etc dealt with in one long school day without the need to ferry to afterschool clubs etc which is just not possible, and the long school weeks interspersed with long school holidays just works better for dual professional parents. For some it is specialist provision, whether SEN or otherwise. Some is small class sizes and more invidual attention. I agree some is pure snobbery (part of that is on the first time buyers side oddly enough) but not a huge amount in most private schools.

Honestly - my child had such extreme anxiety she was making herself ill and so the school kept sending her home. I wanted her happy (she is now) and I wanted to I hold down my job.

And how do you know this? Do you have a valid, verifiable source showing that 'most' private school parents don't want their kids mixing?

Or is it just what you think private schools are for?

Also remember that you don't need 'most' of them to move. Only enough where the lost VAT + state cost outweighs the gain from VAT paid by those remaining.

SEN is somewhat relevant here because they're more expensive to educate. The government paying the bill parents have been footing so far will increase the cost.

Yes- but it will trail off. The birth rate is falling. Lots of state schools aren’t full. They will just redistribute the budgets.

Luckily I couldn’t care less!

We are poor..we have done many appeals to SENDIST. I represent myself and I win them all. I also have a LD. It's not about being rich.

I have a son who could not talk a word, completely non verbal until I got him moved to a independent SEN school. He was only child in his state school getting speech therapy out of 5 non verbal kids in his class. There was a speech therapist in every class at indi.

Should I have been ulteristic and left him non verbal for life to level the field? He talked within 3 months in the independent school. Is it a privilege to talk? To read or write at the level of a 4 year old aged 13? Because that's his level. It's hard to literate when you can't talk due a LD. Or communicate by ANY means at all.

How much do you think supported living costs over a lifetime from age 18? Do you not think this is better use of tax payer money?

I don't feel privileged with my son who has the mental age of about 6, talks like a toddler and is bearly literate but I thank God every day he has got this far. Totally down to his independent SEN school. There is no legal team to thank. No vast wealth.

In the fair world you get speech therapy into state sen schools and OT into state schools and decent MH support to every child. But ten years on from my first appeal the sen system and camhs has got far, far, far worse. Now every LA is in trouble. Fix state first so there's no need for indi sen. Until SEN is fixed in state you will never, ever, ever, ever get rid of indi SEN. I don't need privilege or money to get my son a voice. I only need a deep set feeling of injustice. Every day I hated my LA it drove me through sendist. You can Google the laws on lime.

I know from 14 years of kids in private schools and having very honest conversations with other mothers!! This isn’t about being snobby- it is about parents weighing up the options and choosing the private to get away from kids who will be problematic!!

Or they could just redistribute the budget without incurring the cost to the state of educating those extra children.

Revolutionary, I know.

Your continued posting indicates to the contrary!

I’m interested in the subject matter, please don’t flatter yourself that you are the star attraction 🤣

A thread I started, I should add.

Thank you for your input to date.

i suppose it depends what sort of area the private school is in. In urban areas or by towns where there are known to be issues, maybe there is more of a desire to keep kids away from poorer children perceived to be problematic. In the areas of my kids schools that honestly isn’t really a feature. There are good state schools and less good state schools near us but none where you would worry about their safety. I appreciate that is not the same everywhere.

At an individual level, many many parents have taken action through tribunal and judicial review.

In terms of group action, there have been so many marches, sit ins, consultations, meetings with MPs, select committees, enquiries etc. Just this week there was a parliamentary debate of SEND and issues like the LA safety valve programme.

There hasn't been a group action to challenge the law as the actual law is ok. If you look at the equalities act, education act, send code of practice etc, the rights are fine. It's just getting them applied is a battle and inconsistent.

Well if you're part of the Eton set, you're obviously going to think like this. Your anecdotal evidence also doesn't reflect all private schools across the country.

Also, 'poor' and 'problematic' kids are two different things. Disruption of learning, bullying, knife crime etc are all valid reasons to avoid a local state school.

There are quite a few independent schools within driving distance in the north west, where I live. Parents send their kids because of small class sizes, SEN support etc. Certainly no issue mixing with the 'poors', that's who their families are, the neighbours, people they play football etc with. Many have siblings in state schools.

I'll take the expert analysis over your opinion. As you can see, everyone myself included can have an opinion. Doesn't mean that it's valid or a true reflection of what will happen.

I'm sorry to hear about your DS's difficulties, and I'm glad that he is now getting better support. You have clearly worked very hard to get this in place. But, regardless of whether or not they have a deep set feeling of injustice, not all parents will have the skills or confidence to advocate on behalf of their children/represent themselves effectively. It simply isn't an option for everyone.

You say that you are poor, so I presume that you are not paying school fees and that the VAT issue won't affect you. As far as fixing state education is concerned, I'm absolutely with you...I want all children to get the support that they need, including the ones with parents that don't know how to get their voices heard. And I think that those of us with broader shoulders need to pay for that through higher taxation.

Then why would you choose the private? Stop being naive.

I am also happy to crowd the lawyers. Please post a link.

I realise how low DLA is however it's still not unreasonable that some of it might go towards education.

We moved to an area with great state schools. Started the kids in the local community playgroup. It's a lovely area, great community, and I had a fond hope that he'd settle in, spend all his educational years there with the usual hurdles and challenges that help build resilience, and leave at the end with a decent education and good friends, part of the community like anyone else.

Life had other plans.

https://www.change.org/p/stop-labour-from-adding-20-vat-to-private-school-fees-and-forcing-kids-to-change-schools/psf/share?cs_tk=AuvIh5UE4q5nUPcL5mYAAXicyyvNyQEABF8BvFTr_ZS0bbBZzIJjvuZS9rw%3D&update_id=32878274&utm_campaign=05140e8c71e344eab0c71b679c429029&utm_content=initial_v0_8_0&utm_medium=email&utm_source=petition_update&utm_term=cs

Meanwhile lots of us struggle to take you seriously. 🫣