Children moving to new schools due to VAT changes

[Popcorntv]

Hi all,

Clumsy title! I wanted to start a tread for those whose children are moving schools because independent education is no longer an option. The change hasn’t forced our hand quite yet but has reopened the conversation on school - DH never wanted DCs to go private as he had a miserable time at this very prestigious boys’ school - but I won out originally…

i can find lots of chats on here and FB about people threatening to leave but very little for people who really are making the change!

Now we are trying to move both DCs. We are in London. DC2 should get a place for Y6 in our local primary (started there - wish we’d never moved them!). DC1 is going into Y9 and finding a place is a bit of a dark art. No info at the moment due to schools managing the admissions and being on holiday. Local chat suggests it may be very difficult to find her a place…!

My daughter is not at school as yet but I will be putting her in state school despite wanting to put her in private because of her sen needs.

This has completely changed the dynamic around me too.

It sounds like there may be exemptions for children with SEN who have had an assessment, so hopefully you may still have that option.

Only if the EHCP names the Indy school. Otherwise VAT will still apply

If you are saving the money on your younger child could you not keep the oldest where they are until 6 th form . I know it seems unfair but it’s a much easier move in yr6 / starting secondary than in the later years .

This is definitely a consideration. As it happens DC2 went private earlier so if DC1 stays until GCSEs are complete they’ll have had the same number of years in private education

My next door neighbour has places for private schools (twins), paid the deposit but has withdrawn only last week for a local free school. They lost £2k but did not want to spend on uniforms and lose more.

Ds is going into year 11, we will move him after GCSEs, so this time next year. That was never the plan but the VAT will force our hands. We will be looking around sixth forms over the next few months and applying for places. There's limited options really, two good state 6th forms (grammar) that he would be happy with, and one other good one that he's dead set against - sigh.... And whether he will get the grades for either of the Grammars is of course a gamble.

If he's had the benefit of a private education all these years, smaller classes and all that, education that you thought was worth paying tens of thousands for, surely his grades should be good enough to get into a state grammar sixth form?

People pay fir private school for lots and lots of reasons ( eg longer hours, extra curricular provision, SEN support, or just a nicer environment, if local state options are poor).. It's not all about grades - and not all private schools are academically selective. And some state grammar sixth forms will have very competitive entry.

We werent necessarily buying execellent grades, we sent him to private for his confidence and self esteem. Private schools do that in so many ways.

Meant to add the state grammars he would like to get into are selective all the way through so can demand high grades.

yes this. So a very narrow 'concession'. Our DS1 does not have an EHCP because he has been very well served by our indy and we did not think it was necessary to go through that process as we were funding ourselves. He does however receive DLA and I hoped that this might cover the proof of SEN, but the parameters are so narrow.

We currently are staying but know anecdotally already of a couple in DS1's class (of 16) who are moving. They will be home schooled apparently until the next academic year. Note- this is just what i know of, it and we are not yet abck at school so who really knows yet).

I am a cynical soul and I believe the Labour party brought this in for January rather than next academic year (as they promised) because it makes it harder for people to move mid-year and they can say 'See, negligible impact on private school numbers'.

@DelphiniumBlue we sent eldest to a small private school for pastoral reasons not academics. This is always forgotten in the trolling against private, it isn't always about gaming the system to get the highest grades. Sometimes it is about trying to do the best for the child.
Also I teach full time at a state comprehensive, 7:30 to 18:00 are my regular hours, eldest's school chase and chivvy him in ways I cannot.

Oh get off your sanctimonious high horse. People use private education for many reasons. Academics were part of what we wanted for our children but not everything.
For a range of reasons (mostly health related) my DD is unlikely to come out with top grade GCSE results. This is nothing to do with what school has or hasn’t done.

Academics is not what made us choose for Ds1. Thanks to a completely preventable birth injury he went too long without oxygen at birth and now has a sub average IQ (along with other things) that saw him literally 1 IQ point above needing a special school. The school we chose for him has small class sizes and great pastoral care. He's never going to university. He's about to enter Year 10 and frankly is unlikely to ever pass his GCSEs. But he is entitled to a decent school experience and we are lucky that we can pay for the best available to us.

His fees will go up by £100 a week- after tax. It's going to be very difficult for us.

But you know- we are all bastarding rich arseholes who are paying for grades and contacts. So we and our children get what we deserve- apparently.

we are in a similar situation. It is a shitty catch-22 situation where you only get send support by letting your child fail profoundly in state schools that everyone agrees cannot adequately support their needs.

my understanding is that the only mechanism for recouping vat for send students is by the LA in situations where they are funding the education- no one who is self funding would be able to recoup VAT. At least that’s how it stands in the latest proposal.

agree fully that Labour are intentionally trying to catch people out as a means of making the initial figures look better than they otherwise might if they gave people sufficient time to make sensible decisions.

Plus if your eldest stays for 3 more years and your youngest is yr 6. If finances allow they could start in private from yr 9 again if state isn't working how you'd like. Much easier to put 1 through than 2 at the same time!

At this level of SEND need, you would surely have applied for an EHCP and therefore be exempt from VAT, though. And there's no IQ requirement for special school. My DC has a much higher than average academic ability and still went to specialist provision because of SEND needs - funded by an EHCP. And typically you can't attribute a full scale IQ in the case of significant SEND anyway, because of spiky abilities across the board.

Well- I asked the ed psych who tested him if the IQ meant he ought to be in a special school and she said he was about a single IQ point above being considered eligible. I'm going on what we were told. I recall it incredibly well because it was the moist shocking body blow to us. Up until then we thought he was simply developmentally delayed- not that he had an IQ of well under average. We also 3 years after that had another IQ assessment with a second ed psych done as a separate part of his ADHD assessment (done by a psychiatrist) and he came out the same - although granted they were using the same criteria, whatever the standard testing is. I can't recall the name of it.

And no, we did not apply for an EHCP because he has been in his school since the age of 4 and they met his needs and we did not see the need of going through that process for what was then no good reason. We were paying for his schooling and it met his needs. We did not see the need to bring the LA into something that was working perfectly fine for us. Why would you sit on a waiting list for years and bring the LA with all that involves into a situation if you did not need to?

I think there would be no way on this earth the LA would have said his current school was the only one that met his needs. Because it costs £20 k a year and local budgets are stretched. And because had been at the school funded by us for 6-7 years at that point.

This is what I’d do then .

@SnappingAtHeels did you pay privately for your ds’s assessments?

There is definitely no IQ requirement for special school here in Wales. Their provision is there to meet the SEND needs of the pupils who attend. Our local special school has pupils passing GCSEs every year, completing their DofE etc.

From what you’ve said your Ds had never been to a state school. Of course he is entitled to a decent school experience but you have never given the state any opportunity to provide that which now leaves you in a very difficult situation with the addition of VAT to his fees.

We are planning to see through pre-prep (1 more school year) and exit in year 3 - when lots of children leave our setting to go to a through school. My husband also didn’t want our daughter to attend private school, I won, but wished we hadn’t bothered tbh. If anyone is apply for primary spaces in Brighton, please would they let me know if they are struggling to secure places?

DS has been at a smallish private school since year 8, he has ASD & getting lost in the local state school. The pastoral care he has received has benefited him in so many ways, including his self confidence which in turn has helped his learning.
he sat his GCSEs this time, but will be returning to the local school for sixth form, it was a struggle having him there for the years he was there & we had budgeted for 2 more years, but unfortunately the vat has put it out of our reach. I definitely don’t regret the time he did spend there, he is a different child

It’s free anyway if they have an EHCP. The Lea pay for it all.

DC has to be pretty severe though.

Fucking hilarious posters on here …….years and years of parents of SEND children posting about the battle they have with the system and the years and years it takes to get an EHCP but suddenly it’s oh so easy and ‘should have got an EHCP’ now for the heartbroken parents of children with SEND having to move their child due to this utterly contemptible pathetic dog whistle politics of envy policy.

1 IQ point above needing a special school

My Dd with an EHCP got 10 GCSE level 7 to 8. Went to ‘special school’ to do her A levels,