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Labour’s private school tax raid ‘likely illegal’

1000 replies

Zizzagaaaaaww · 28/06/2024 17:04

Thought some may like to read this article

archive.ph/i1XD3

Sir Keir Starmer’s planned VAT raid on private schools is likely to breach human rights law, The Telegraph can reveal.
The Labour leader risks falling foul of European Court of Human Rights (ECHR) law <a class="break-all" href="https://archive.ph/o/i1XD3/www.telegraph.co.uk/money/tax/labour-private-school-tax-moronic-policy/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">over his party’s flagship policy, one of Britain’s top constitutional and human rights lawyers has warned.
Lord Pannick, who has taken on some of the UK’s most high-profile court cases, backed legal advice warning that making private schools subject to VAT was likely to breach ECHR law.
He told The Telegraph: “It would be strongly arguable that for a new government to impose VAT on independent schools would breach the right to education.

“That is because all other educational services will remain exempt from VAT and the charging of VAT on independent schools alone is designed to impede private education, and will have that effect.”

The KC and crossbench peer said that the Labour policy risked breaching two articles in the ECHR which protect the right to education.
He referred to legal advice written in response to Labour policies as far back as the early 1980s, when the country’s most senior lawyers warned that plans to end tax exemptions for private schools or abolish the institutions altogether would likely breach international human rights law to which Britain is signed up.
Previous leaders of the party have floated the idea of taxing private schools as part of plans to integrate them into the state sector. Under former party leader Michael Foot, the Labour manifesto of 1983 pledged to “charge VAT on the fees paid to [private] schools”.
The policy to abolish the schools was eventually shot down by senior lawyers, who argued it could be at odds with the ECHR and spoke specifically about the risk of imposing VAT.
While Sir Keir has ruled out abolishing private schools, he plans to force the institutions to pay business rates and 20pc VAT on tuition fees.
In an unearthed legal opinion from 1987, seen by The Telegraph, the late Lord Lester and Lord Pannick, prominent human rights lawyers, concluded a government “could not lawfully prohibit fee-paying, independent education or remove the benefits of charitable status or impose VAT in respect of such education” while a member of the court.
A foreword to the opinion written in 1991 by Lord Scarman, who served as a Law Lord in the precursor to the Supreme Court, said it would “encourage a challenge which could be mounted by taking the argument to the [ECHR]… if ever a government should seek to abolish or discriminate against [private schools]”.
The opinion was jointly written by Lord Lester and Lord Pannick as advice for the Independent Schools Council (ISC) and later published in its journal. Lord Pannick confirmed his belief that the argument still stands today.

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Scruffily · 29/06/2024 11:24

twistyizzy · 29/06/2024 10:57

The rush to get an EHCP is because they will then be exempt from paying VAT. Surely you can understand how an announcement like that would elicit behaviour change?
100,000 SEN DC in indi schools but only a small % have EHCPs at present

There may be a rise in future applications for EHCPs, and that isn't a bad thing given that the process requires children to be properly assessed. It's always a bit of a worry if a child has unassessed SEN that something is being missed, e.g. sensory problems.

I doubt, however, that there will be a "rush". Parents will quickly discover that the fact that you ask for an EHCP doesn't mean that you get one, or even necessarily that you get past the first base of qualifying for an EHC needs assessment. It certainly doesn't guarantee that the private school of your choice will be named in the EHCP. If your child is currently in a mainstream private school, there's a very strong likelihood that the EHCP will name a mainstream state school.

ArseInTheCoOpWindow · 29/06/2024 11:26

twistyizzy · 29/06/2024 11:20

It doesn't matter, the point is that parents are already applying. Most EHCPs aren't awarded first attempt anyway, they more than likely go to appeal and are awarded at that stage. This all costs time and money. So even if the EHCP isn't awarded the process will have cost the state more than the income from VAT per pupil that applies.

But this will change under Labour l think who are more committed to SEND dc.

We applied last year and had one by Christmas.

crumblingschools · 29/06/2024 11:27

@Scruffily the average time for EHCP in our area is over a year. Local authorities don’t seem to give a shit that the rule is 20 weeks (or they are as underfunded and understaffed as the schools)

If a parent has chosen a small private school as it can cater for their child’s SEN unlike the local state school, where is the equality for them?

twistyizzy · 29/06/2024 11:28

Scruffily · 29/06/2024 11:24

There may be a rise in future applications for EHCPs, and that isn't a bad thing given that the process requires children to be properly assessed. It's always a bit of a worry if a child has unassessed SEN that something is being missed, e.g. sensory problems.

I doubt, however, that there will be a "rush". Parents will quickly discover that the fact that you ask for an EHCP doesn't mean that you get one, or even necessarily that you get past the first base of qualifying for an EHC needs assessment. It certainly doesn't guarantee that the private school of your choice will be named in the EHCP. If your child is currently in a mainstream private school, there's a very strong likelihood that the EHCP will name a mainstream state school.

That may be the case but applications are already happening. You may want to think it won't have an impact but the data will be there soon enough. At present we only have anecdotal stories but if you extrapolate the 10 x DC in my daughter's year group who have started applying, across the whole sector then you can see how the numbers stack up. The state can't cope with the current number of applications, let alone any increase.

TheFallenMadonna · 29/06/2024 11:28

twistyizzy · 29/06/2024 11:21

That is only a small % of indi schools. Most SEN DC in indi sector are in non-specialist schools

And are having their needs met without an EHCP. Like the majority of children with SEND in mainstream schools (I mean, that is arguable, but the LA does argue it, so it is relevant to the assessment of whether an EHCP is given). I know there are differences in provision (that is what is being paid for after all), but SEND does not automatically equal EHCP in maintained schools, not by a long shot.

twistyizzy · 29/06/2024 11:29

TheFallenMadonna · 29/06/2024 11:28

And are having their needs met without an EHCP. Like the majority of children with SEND in mainstream schools (I mean, that is arguable, but the LA does argue it, so it is relevant to the assessment of whether an EHCP is given). I know there are differences in provision (that is what is being paid for after all), but SEND does not automatically equal EHCP in maintained schools, not by a long shot.

Only having their needs met because their parents are paying for 1-2-1 support, not because they don't have needs!

crumblingschools · 29/06/2024 11:29

And a child costs a state school money whether they have a funded EHCP or not. So having more pupils with SEN in state schools is not going to help them

sweetnessandlighter · 29/06/2024 11:30

"Tax raid" 😂 it's VAT on a luxury item, which applies to thousands of goods and services we buy every day. Tax raid FFS.

twistyizzy · 29/06/2024 11:31

sweetnessandlighter · 29/06/2024 11:30

"Tax raid" 😂 it's VAT on a luxury item, which applies to thousands of goods and services we buy every day. Tax raid FFS.

VAT isn't a luxury tax "FFS"

ArseInTheCoOpWindow · 29/06/2024 11:31

twistyizzy · 29/06/2024 11:28

That may be the case but applications are already happening. You may want to think it won't have an impact but the data will be there soon enough. At present we only have anecdotal stories but if you extrapolate the 10 x DC in my daughter's year group who have started applying, across the whole sector then you can see how the numbers stack up. The state can't cope with the current number of applications, let alone any increase.

But they won’t get an EHCP unless their disabilities are severe enough to warrant one.

My Dd has an EHCP. Her needs could only be met in a specialist state school. If dc are doing OK then they don’t need an EHCP.

TheFallenMadonna · 29/06/2024 11:32

Then hopefully they will have the evidence required for the needs assessment.

Another76543 · 29/06/2024 11:32

Scruffily · 29/06/2024 11:02

Because you've opted out of equality by taking your child out of free state education.

This had to be one of the more ridiculous statements I’ve read. If there was equality in the state system you might have a point, but there isn’t. Anyone choosing a selective state school is opting out of equality because that option isn’t available to all. Anyone choosing a faith school is opting out of equality because those school places are not available to all. Anyone not choosing their nearest state school, but choosing a higher performing one, is opting out of equality. There is huge inequality within the state system.

Scruffily · 29/06/2024 11:33

Charlie2121 · 29/06/2024 11:00

That’s not true. I’m far from being an expert of EHCP however it is reasonable to suggest that the entire cohort of 100,000 SEN children in private schools will at least submit an application. Whether they get a favourable outcome or not isn’t really the point. The issue is that the local authorities will have 100,000 claims to assess. They struggle now dealing with a tiny fraction of that amount. Imposing a tax on a child with special needs simply because their local authority wasn’t resourced to deal with their claim is not going to play out well politically.

"They struggle now dealing with a tiny fraction of that amount"? That's simply not true. There were 138,200 initial requests for EHCPs in 2022.

There simply is no reason to believe that the parents of every child in state schools with SEN would apply for EHCPs. The majority of children with SEN don't qualify, and if your child isn't going to qualify there is no point applying. Even if they do, a large proportion would be put off by the realisation that they stand an excellent chance of going through the whole process and not getting a private school named in the EHCP.

Even if every single parent applies, the cost of a one-off bump in applications spread amongst all local authorities is not going to outweigh the tax revenue realised.

crumblingschools · 29/06/2024 11:33

@ArseInTheCoOpWindow the ok can be a very low bar. Many children are currently being failed in state schools no matter how hard the schools are trying

Another76543 · 29/06/2024 11:34

ArseInTheCoOpWindow · 29/06/2024 11:26

But this will change under Labour l think who are more committed to SEND dc.

We applied last year and had one by Christmas.

Where is the funding coming from for this extra SEND support which Labour is apparently so keen on?

Scruffily · 29/06/2024 11:35

twistyizzy · 29/06/2024 11:06

Let's talk about the existing inequalities in state education which make many parents choose independent school:

  • exorbitant house prices around catchment areas of good state schools
  • grammar schools
  • wealthy cohorts at the best state schools
  • some state schools have amazing sports/drama/arts facilities whilst others have no options for these subjects at GCSE
  • some state schools have stable teaching staff with great behaviour, others have multiple vacancies which they can't full and successions of temporary staff teaching Yr 10+11

Why aren't Labour taking about addressing these existing inequalities to ensure ALL state schools are fantastic?

They are talking about making all state schools fantastic.

crumblingschools · 29/06/2024 11:35

@Scruffily our LA have pretty much said they are rationing EHCPs. They also got judged inadequate for SEN provision so no surprise really

Another76543 · 29/06/2024 11:36

Scruffily · 29/06/2024 11:35

They are talking about making all state schools fantastic.

How will they fund this? It’s not coming from VAT on school fees.

Scruffily · 29/06/2024 11:37

OneWorldly4 · 29/06/2024 11:17

Oh the joy I had reading this yesterday!

The legal opinion Labour sought years ago was from a highly prominent lawyer, who quite rightly, advised this policy would be unlawful. Before judging, read the lawyer's opinion.

Given the venom so many people clearly have against private schools (based on many stereotypes might I add), this made my day!

Looks like our little Tarquins might be able to stay in their school after all. Brilliant!

Before judging, reflect on the fact that the opinion was written 40 years ago and there have been some major changes subsequently. In particular, a little matter of leaving the EU which was one of the main barriers in the way of this policy.

Scruffily · 29/06/2024 11:39

anunlikelyseahorse · 29/06/2024 11:19

They've said that children with EHCPs will be exempt

If schools close due to loss of student numbers, then kids with EHCP at indies will be back in mainstream anyway.

Children with EHCPs naming independent non-specialist schools are usually there because there is evidence showing that it is essential in order to meet their needs - most frequently because they need small classes. If their school closes, the local authority will still have to place them in a school with small classes, which is likely to be another private school, not a mainstream one.

ArseInTheCoOpWindow · 29/06/2024 11:40

crumblingschools · 29/06/2024 11:33

@ArseInTheCoOpWindow the ok can be a very low bar. Many children are currently being failed in state schools no matter how hard the schools are trying

I know it can. Mine was ‘ok’

But if a dc is managing in a school private or otherwise then the chance of an EHCP is low. Mine was a school refused. Tons of evidence from psychologists, CAHMS, psychiatrists. I think there were 84 pieces.

She still got refusal to assess initially.

RafaistheKingofClay · 29/06/2024 11:41

twistyizzy · 29/06/2024 11:20

It doesn't matter, the point is that parents are already applying. Most EHCPs aren't awarded first attempt anyway, they more than likely go to appeal and are awarded at that stage. This all costs time and money. So even if the EHCP isn't awarded the process will have cost the state more than the income from VAT per pupil that applies.

A stat I’m sure will change if people start applying for needs assessments just to avoid paying VAT.

Most children with SEN in schools don’t have an EHCP because they don’t need one.

crumblingschools · 29/06/2024 11:41

@ArseInTheCoOpWindow and how is this policy going to help DC like yours? How much time and resources do you think went into that process, for just one child?

twistyizzy · 29/06/2024 11:41

Scruffily · 29/06/2024 11:35

They are talking about making all state schools fantastic.

What next academic year? Or in their 2nd term? Too late for DC at existing indi schools.
Apart from VAT how are they promising to fund making all state schools "fantastic"?

TheFallenMadonna · 29/06/2024 11:42

crumblingschools · 29/06/2024 11:33

@ArseInTheCoOpWindow the ok can be a very low bar. Many children are currently being failed in state schools no matter how hard the schools are trying

Exactly. People, it would seem, are voting for change. Even if you think that is counterproductive.

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