Labour’s private school tax raid ‘likely illegal’

[Zizzagaaaaaww]

Thought some may like to read this article

archive.ph/i1XD3

Sir Keir Starmer’s planned VAT raid on private schools is likely to breach human rights law, The Telegraph can reveal.
The Labour leader risks falling foul of European Court of Human Rights (ECHR) law <a class="break-all" href="https://archive.ph/o/i1XD3/www.telegraph.co.uk/money/tax/labour-private-school-tax-moronic-policy/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">over his party’s flagship policy, one of Britain’s top constitutional and human rights lawyers has warned.
Lord Pannick, who has taken on some of the UK’s most high-profile court cases, backed legal advice warning that making private schools subject to VAT was likely to breach ECHR law.
He told The Telegraph: “It would be strongly arguable that for a new government to impose VAT on independent schools would breach the right to education.

“That is because all other educational services will remain exempt from VAT and the charging of VAT on independent schools alone is designed to impede private education, and will have that effect.”

The KC and crossbench peer said that the Labour policy risked breaching two articles in the ECHR which protect the right to education.
He referred to legal advice written in response to Labour policies as far back as the early 1980s, when the country’s most senior lawyers warned that plans to end tax exemptions for private schools or abolish the institutions altogether would likely breach international human rights law to which Britain is signed up.
Previous leaders of the party have floated the idea of taxing private schools as part of plans to integrate them into the state sector. Under former party leader Michael Foot, the Labour manifesto of 1983 pledged to “charge VAT on the fees paid to [private] schools”.
The policy to abolish the schools was eventually shot down by senior lawyers, who argued it could be at odds with the ECHR and spoke specifically about the risk of imposing VAT.
While Sir Keir has ruled out abolishing private schools, he plans to force the institutions to pay business rates and 20pc VAT on tuition fees.
In an unearthed legal opinion from 1987, seen by The Telegraph, the late Lord Lester and Lord Pannick, prominent human rights lawyers, concluded a government “could not lawfully prohibit fee-paying, independent education or remove the benefits of charitable status or impose VAT in respect of such education” while a member of the court.
A foreword to the opinion written in 1991 by Lord Scarman, who served as a Law Lord in the precursor to the Supreme Court, said it would “encourage a challenge which could be mounted by taking the argument to the [ECHR]… if ever a government should seek to abolish or discriminate against [private schools]”.
The opinion was jointly written by Lord Lester and Lord Pannick as advice for the Independent Schools Council (ISC) and later published in its journal. Lord Pannick confirmed his belief that the argument still stands today.

They're either pretty ordinary, or else they're so wealthy they regard thousands of pounds as 'a bit of VAT'. I'm sorry, but you just can't have it both ways. I meant competition from other schools. Their school becomes more elite if others close. Or, perhaps, like you say, they can just easily afford it and don't really mind either way. In which case, I'm sure they're decent people, but they haven't really thought about it very deeply. Just like you clearly haven't.

“Several have three or four DC in London day schools. I meant not Oligarch wealthy but senior partner level professional salaries.“

OK well the equity partners in the top London law firms took home 2 million each this year and some senior bankers do too as well as some private equity, some years. But even that lot typically wants their kids to mix with more normal eg doctors & teachers children too, because many of them don’t like their own DC being too out of touch.
If private school becomes top 1 per cent or top 0.01 like some Swiss boarding schools, it’s a problem for the schools too, both in terms of recruiting genuine intellect and in terms of lack of normality and drive.

I do know some people who have taken their kids out of certain London schools due to money splashing/nouveau riche attitudes too, so I do think it will affect these schools if they only end up with super rich on the one hand and bursary on the other. You need a more normal ground as well as otherwise it’s just weird for the bursary kids too.

They're either pretty ordinary, or else they're so wealthy they regard thousands of pounds as 'a bit of VAT'. I'm sorry, but you just can't have it both ways

Yes sounds like they are wealthier to others than pp finds the norm with info here on what they do

Although if they are partners and do own tax returns? I expect they don’t take accountant advice to reduce tax bill in any way or maybe voluntarily pay more tax in line with their keenness

The problem is, as far fetched and ridiculous as these ‘real friends’ are portrayed, it is how a lot of people do see fee paying parents. They simply can’t understand people ‘showing bad form’ quibbling over ‘paying a bit of VAT’.

How are they far fetched and ridiculous? Because they have more money that the average private school parent? It's all relative to one's own circumstances. Some people would find the concept of having the money for private school fees just as inconceivable.

I honestly don't know what they do regarding their tax. It would be a bit crass to ask them. It really is none of my business.

Where did I write that they are pretty ordinary? I said they were very affluent but not super rich. The wealth in some of these top London schools is in a different league. The schools I am referring to have no need to worry about competition from other schools. To be fair there is much more concern in these top schools from parents (somewhat ridiculously) worrying about widening participation than other lesser private schools. You are correct, they haven't really thought about it very deeply because they do not see VAT to be a huge problem. Likewise, it doesn't affect my family and there are other political issues that concern me much more.

Given what you say here I have no doubt they pay tax voluntarily, why wait to be asked?

I think your ‘not rich for London’ is skewed though. If they are senior partners and would happily double school fees and stump up loads more tax they are far above most even in London. Maybe they are too apart from what some people earn

You tried to make out that they were just typical private school parents, not super rich, and didn't mind paying because they were decent people ('decent' because they vote Labour and Lib Dem). Why come on here to rub people's faces in it that there are some people so well off that they don't care about the VAT? Why remind everybody that they don't care about the schools or parents affected because they're all fine? It doesn't suggest a social conscience at all.

With respect, I also do not believe your stories about these ‘private school families’ who support the VAT so will not engage with you further. This a stressful situation for thousands of families concerned about their children and not some weird hobby.

I didn't say they would happily double school fees. I said if school fees doubled, they would keep their DC in their schools. There is a difference. I didn't say they would 'stump up loads more tax' either. I said they would be fine with higher income tax, the implication being instead of school fees increasing substantially with VAT. As I said before, their situation may be unrelatable for some other private school parents but no more so than for others conceiving of finding the money for school fees even without VAT. That is too far apart from what many earn.

I was not saying they are jumping up and down to be able to pay it. Rather that they are accepting of it and that it does not impact their lifestyle. I'm sorry but that is the truth and I don't understand what you mean by 'some weird hobby.'

Yeh I agree. It just sounds like they earn substantially more than the figure mentioned below going by pp’s admission and have a skewed idea of what many others earn in London

There is no such thing as typical private school parents. It covers a spectrum of circumstances, as is obvious from these threads. I said my friends were decent after there was a somewhat embittered assumption that the group of parents who can absorb the VAT are happy other people are excluded from their schools and that there will be less competition for their children. All absolute nonsense in this case. Please stop trying to twist things. Such posts suggest that the politics of envy could be alive and well on the other side too.

Why are you even on this thread if it doesn't really impact your lifestyle and you're not bothered by it? Go and be richer than everybody else in your own school car park. Go and be not bothered by it on your own class WhatsApp group. Go and be better, and more decent, and more complacent than us somewhere else!

You have got the wrong end of the stick again. I've already said that my children are now at university. I'm (a bit) interested in this topic just as I am interested in other political issues. I am allowed to have a view. I'm sorry if better off people make you angry. Is that not what some of you accusing state school parents of?

I think people are aware there is a range of incomes in private schools but it’s clear from what you’ve posted about these other people the not rich for London doesn’t really stand

You are the one who has got the wrong end of the stick. I have plenty of friends who are better off than me. It doesn't bother me at all. However, if they told me that they didn't see what all the fuss was about this VAT thing because they could afford to pay it, that would bother me. Luckily, all my friends are decent people, and not thoughtless idiots. That's why we're friends.

This thread displays some of the worst British attitudes of snobbery and one upmanship. From both sides of the political spectrum.

Yeh it just sounds crass and what @Sarahsure said

Where did I ever say that they said they didn't see what all the fuss was about. Their only sin is voting Labour or Liberal (I actually don't know which) and quietly paying up. The rest is all totally inaccurate conjecture. What rancour in some of these posts.

I also voted Liberal Democrat. Think you might be the one making the inaccurate conjectures. And just generally misunderstanding every post in order to wind people up.

I am not misunderstanding any posts. The bitterness of your posts is coming through loud and clear. So you have no issue with their voting so your outrage and insults are all about them just quietly paying up. Totally unwarranted and more than a bit pathetic in terms of attitude. They are ‘thoughtless idiots’ just because of that?

Tbf it’s not even these people posting it’s someone else talking about them online for whatever reason

I agree with you but probably best to ignore