How soon might a Labour Government put 20% VAT tax on private school fees?

[jennylamb1]

That really. Given that an election date has been declared for July, how soon might a Labour Government set their first budget?

I agree on the basis that idiots dont get to the heights of his previous role but he didn't come across well this morning. For a lawyer he was tongue tied and for the first few minutes sounded un-prepared. That's until the lawyer kicked in and he just obfuscated

You’ve put the finger on the problem. He sweats over the brief, labours over the wording. Thinks that’s the answer. Big picture entirely escapes him.

Well the current incumbent doesn't set the bar very high does he? He can't even work out that standing by a sinking (or rather, sunk) ship is really not very good PR. Your average 12 year-old could work that one out!

I doubt you’d like it any better if he deserted his post now.

They could just say all children with EHCP are exempt from VAT and all schools in which at least 50 per cent of children have an EHCP, that would cover most special schools.

The real problem won’t be funding for the children who really cannot cope in mainstream. The problem will be Lottie who has quite severe dyslexia but is very well behaved and hardworking and overlooked in the state sector, in the private sector with dedicated parents she would have become an award winning architect, or Harold who is a truly gifted violinist and has ASD and doesn’t get to play his violin in a state school regularly to build confidence. Whereas at private school this commands massive respect amongst his peers and he gains social skills and love of life etc He would have been the next Simon Rattle eventually, but who cares, because Jayden might also have been had he been given the same opportunity. So is it better that neither Harold or Jayden now gets a go?

Yes I agree. It’s crazy because this is simply logic: all those in state sector will suffer if this happens, those who are less well off and struggle to put their children to private sector and then there are those super rich that can be creative their taxes and who even if they have to pay for it will find another way to reclaim it from somewhere else. Who will suffer? Again those on low incomes or in state sector.

this is reminding me of Brexit when everyone was shouting to leave the Europe and how amazing it will be and how wonderful when foreigners leave and we finally have all those jobs…. Well that didn’t work out well did it!

There is a funding problem for children who cannot cope in mainstream now. There are hundreds of kids with SN out of education now because their LA cant or won’t make provision for them.
i have parented a child with SN under Labour and Tories. There has never been good provision from the public sector for him because it is never a priority. There aren’t enough votes in fixing special needs education. And Labour have no intention of fixing it now. They will put in place this stupid spiteful policy which will drive more kids into the failing state sector. And congratulate themselves on being good people for doing it.

He's giving Starmer more than a helping hand at at the moment, that's for sure.

Me neither. I drive a Fiat 500x and have three kids at PS though. HTH.

@twistyizzy

"Because all they hear is "tax the wealthy" or "stop tax breaks for privileged people". They don't look beyond that.
It is the Brexit bus all over again.
This is what happens when politics is reduced to populism"

I completely agree it's Brexit type populist politics again which plays on emotion rather than facts or reality.

Genuine question- what level of income do posters see as rich and deserving higher taxes?

Do we have to decide? In Scotland income taxes are already significantly higher on incomes over £30k Pa and I’m fine with that.

if you look at the IFS stuff, we all need to pay more income tax or cut spending. And only the top group is paying more tax since 2010 - although, as per Scotland, there is room for income tax rises in the Uk.

but labour want to win, so, tax dishonesty and populism is what we’ve got.

Tbh if they doubled education spending and funded through income tax to match the private spend, and gave actual tax breaks to families to buy tutors or drama etc I’d be all for it, and it might actually boost a sector doing well…

but yeah, let’s define ‘rich’. So much more exciting on Mumsnet. And don’t forget to consider earnings and wealth.

@1dayatatime

>what level of income do posters see as rich and deserving higher taxes?

I don't have a problem with taxing the rich, I have a problem when a small subsection of them have to pay a relatively huge amount. Education (and many things) are in a bad state and need more than £1.6bn funding.

Everyone benefits from an educated and healthy populace and we might have to accept more general taxation (in the higher tax brackets) for everyone. Labour aren't keen on pointing that out so instead are scapegoating a small group they know will receive no sympathy and be under little numerical scrutiny. It's a cunning plan but doesn't make them look good if you think past the headline.

This tax will impact the aspirational parents, not the "toffs" as some far left leaning voters are hoping. The onus is on an elected government to divert more spending towards education in the state sector. I would send my DC to a state school if the one in my area was decent. Not sure why people find glee in making middle income/ aspirational parents the scapegoats for a bad government.
Truly a race to the bottom in this country.

@Off99sitz

"Tbh if they doubled education spending and funded through income tax to match the private spend, and gave actual tax breaks to families to buy tutors or drama etc I’d be all for it,"

Would you really be all for it though?

Total Govt funding for schools is £59 billion.

Each 1 p increase in the basic tax rate raises £5.5 billion, so to fund doubling the spend on schools would see basic income tax rise from 20% to 31% - an increase of more than 50%.

Funding rises from general income taxation rather than establishing a new tax on education? Yes I would absolutely be for that.

as I said, we are already paying significantly more income tax in Scotland.

As for the actual rises, tax experts would need to review - tax economists generally think tax rates in general highly need review and in all worlds all parties dishonest about need to raise income tax to fund current paltry education spending commitments.

And we do desperately need to fix schools - we’re failing an entire generation of children for health, mh, Sen, and poverty. Labour’s policy is fiddling, attention grabbing and insufficient.

but hey, the tories are running on compulsory national service - if they’d made it a voluntary scheme with some prestige like Norway etc might’ve been interesting but another donkeyish policy.

I don’t think I’ve seen a good policy in this election from any party….

There is some real ideological based 'meanness' on here. Finding it hard not to extrapolate that to all Labour supporters and the Labour Party quite frankly.

I think supporters of VAT on schools could still believe it to be a good policy (and maybe still support it even when they realise it might cost the state) without wishing ill on PS kids and their families.

Or abolish the triple lock and invest in the young.
it will never happen. We will keep shovelling the cash at elderly voters until we turn round and see there are actually no kids left .

Agree the triple lock is another travesty that politically labour and the tories won’t touch - should never have been introduced. We have horrible dishonest divided populist politics all around the uk.

Well, we are fast coming to the time when we can’t afford generous pensions, the bottomless pit of the NHS and young people unable to start families - because of course we don’t want immigration to supplement the aging population either. Buckle up people. It’s going to get ugly

Agree the long term forecasts on immigration say if we think that debate is toxic now, we’ve seen nothing yet…

That post is quite offensive to an awful lot of state schools.

My dyslexic god daughter has been let down throughout her state education. At my DC’s private school the dyslexic pupils are some of the highest performers at GCSE. Lots of pupils with SEN are let down by the state system which is why some parents on middle incomes make sacrifices to send their DC to a private school that is willing to support them. The state primary school teacher of a colleague’s son even suggested to her that she move him to my DC’s private school. The teacher clearly thought it was a better option so I don’t know why you are so offended!

@shockeditellyou- please elaborate why my post is offensive?

My 4 DC go/went to state schools in any event. The DCs of several friends with ASD and other SEN and quite a few dyslexics go to private schools due to their disabilities or other learning needs. So they get smaller class sizes and extra input etc. Why is that such a big surprise to you?
I mean I guess now those kind of parents may end up having to homeschool and join the army of other children unable to cope in that state sector. It is incredibly depressing for a bright but dyslexic and very well behaved child to be dumped in a lower disruptive loud class. This has happened to the DCs of many friends. They became a shell of their former selves so were moved to the private sector.