Why is it so hard to get a job in a secondary school?

[BlackSun1989]

So my husband is doing his pgce to teach secondary history and he's had 6 interviews so far, no job. Well the 6th one was today and they said they'll let him know on Monday. I'm just getting really depressed about it. Is this normal? I've supported him through 6 years of doing a Phd and now his pgce and I was so looking forward to him working and not having to worry about money anymore but now I'm just getting depressed with each rejection. I worry I'll still have to be the main breadwinner and we won't have money to keep my toddler in nursery and I'm 14 weeks pregnant. I really thought it would be easy for him with a PhD and having worked in parliament to maybe teach politics and history. Where is this teacher shortage the government keep going on about?

I'm a history hod - I'd recommend seeing if he could possibly get some GCSE or a level exam marking (he's probably missed the boat for this summer but might be able to get something there's a shortage of examiners in). It would look really good on a cv as you know a person really knows what they're looking for with exam classes.

Oh my goodness, I've had that too!
I had a candidate with an MA and he told me that he was going to improve our History knowledge! 😂

Do some training in MUN - would be a brilliant thing to offer as a history/politics club

Exam marking is such a good idea because it really does enable you to understand levels of knowledge and understanding, essay construction and second order concepts.

I would be impressed with the politics experience but ONLY if the interview lesson was also really good - that's far more important!

What experience does he have in schools? That’s more important than a phd for a teacher. There isn’t a teacher shortage in history and jobs in Devon are competitive. He might have been better picking a different subject or looking in a different region.

I'm in Devon and my teacher husband has returned to teaching this year. And I'm in NHS. It's not like other areas I don't think. So many people are very happy to get a job and stay in it for life to stay in the area and not commute so the frequency of jobs coming up and movement in the area is very low. He's an extremely experienced teacher with extensive exam marking, SEN, a level and intervention experience and it still took 2 or 3 interviews to get his job. In the NHS we have virtually no movement in teams. When jobs do come up, there's a lot of competition all round I think.

This is often an issue. There is a national teacher shortage but a lot of areas and subjects are actually fine for recruitment. It isn’t personal. Keep going. It once took me thirteen interviews to secure a promotion I wanted!

"I'd recommend seeing if he could possibly get some GCSE or a level exam marking"

Hmm ... as a parent whose child had 3 of his GCSE's regraded upwards last year (one from a 5 to an 8!), it worries me that inexperienced teachers might be recruited as examiners.

However, as a school governor, I know that our most experienced teachers wouldn't touch marking - the pay is too low.

Sad situation.

As a HOD but not History, for me it always comes down to the lesson. I could have someone who interviewed exceptionally well, but if the lesson wasn’t up to scratch I wouldn’t appoint them. Is he willing to start at the bottom of the pay scale? Or is he asking for more because of prior experience? School budgets are tight.

I think your point about exam marking in general is a good one. However, anyone with a PhD will have experience marking undergraduate work and should be more than capable of marking GCSE and A level exams.

OP as others have said, sadly History is not a shortage subject and the south west will be very competitive for jobs as a teacher's wage can stretch further there. It is good that he can offer Politics too. Geography might be a good thing to get some experience in too if he's currently finishing his PGCE. Definitely good advice to get feedback and keep going.

It's not teaching though, it's marking.
You attend the training and follow the mark scheme. Different skills.
Where it goes wrong is someone not applying the mark scheme correctly or misunderstanding the level.
Not a good indicator of classroom skills as such, but if you nail it, it's good experience. I used to do it every year and it paid for my summer holiday.

In general, exam boards want a year of teaching experience post qualification.

In some subjects, anyone will do, though.

Having a PHD is not going to help a school on a practical day to day level
Students simply don't need that level of expertise to do GCSEs / A levels
His specialty might be History but it is rare (IME) that Hunanities teachers just teach one subject
In my school they will all teach History/ Geography/ RPS / PHSE (even some English) - not ideal but that's how it is

Offering, at interview, the ability to run / take responsibility for a club (especially one that will look good in the prospectus / on an open evening) like DofE etc

But also as others have said he should do supply in the meantime

Yeah it a subject and regional thing, there is a shortage in certain subjects but an oversupply in some areas ie history and PE ( especially for men , they miss out on the maternity cover and there are far more male pe student teachers than female ones) A good friend of mine is doing a subject knowledge course so he can teach Biology rather than social sciences which has limited jobs. Teaching training providers aren't always straight forward about where the jobs are. Your husband will get a job , but he may need to do supply or cover to get in with a school. He can also tutor to bring in some money whilst job seeking.

After 31st May any jobs he applies for will only be able to filled by trainees or teachers out of work for some reason (for September start)
as long as he is acting on feedback from other interviews he will get a job much easier after end of May

I've been conducting teaching interviews all week.

Stronger candidates gave specific and detailed evidence to show directly that they had all essential and desirable skills from the job description. This comes first because candidates are scored against a set or criteria. They also showed a desire to learn and develop professionally, and to contribute to the school community and student development. When doing so, they used the language of teaching. They also showed familiarity with the curriculum and school (eg they referred to statements from the website about school values and how they demonstrated these in their teaching).

Weaker candidates often mentioned previous experience or qualifications generally (e.g. I used to mark for X exam board) but didn't show why it was relevant to the position. The interviewer isn't going to infer your skills or competencies - you need to tell us what they are and make the connections, with evidence. A PhD on its own is not an indicator of an excellent teacher.

So if you mark for X exam board, are you trying to show awareness of common issues that students have with demonstrating knowledge and how you might address these in the classroom? Or are you telling me that you can manage a heavy workload and have strong admin skills? Be explicit.

If he's getting interviews for competitive positions, presumably he has what is needed on paper but can't show its practical relevance. Perhaps he needs to brush up his interpersonal/communication skills to come across better. He might benefit from coaching. Even youtube or some careers websites provide excellent advice these days.

It seems a lot of time, effort and money to invest for him to go into what, with the kindest phrasing I can muster, is the most saturated, non-core teaching subject in existence at a time when schools are under extreme financial pressure and rolls are falling due to a decrease in birth rate.

He really needs a second subject or specialist skill set to make him 'useful' to a head seeking to get the best return for their investment - having a Dr Smith instead of a Mr Smith makes pretty much zero difference when you're recruiting for a non-grammar and in the grammars, Drs are ten a penny. You're just as likely to find a Dr working in Admissions, Data or as a TA as you are in the teaching staff.

Does he have any Classics qualification? Could he teach Latin? Could he bring experience of archaeological digs to broaden their experiences? Does he have good A Levels so he could teach KS3 in different subjects? Any experience of actually being around children and young people? First Aid qualification? Mental Health First Aid? A sport or Music? Any scientific/statistical/data analysis experience? Any vocational qualifications or experience in teaching functional skills?

Unfortunately, he's just not that big a deal, especially when you're looking at a desirable location - if they're looking at potentially having to cut staff numbers due to lack of money, when they do still have to recruit, they are going to look for the candidate who is going to give the best return, not just another Dr to add to the staff list.

Thanks for your replies everyone they are really helpful. He has been asking for feedback which has been kinda mixed. Some didn't really say anything, one said they weren't sure how he would deal with difficult behaviour because the class he had wasn't that difficult to manage. The 5th one this week they said his lesson wasn't great and I think he knew that. He felt a lot better about the 6th one but we have to wait to find out about that. He is good at getting interviews, he's got about 6/9 he's applied for so far so I guess it is something on the day. Most have had a few candidates, often more experienced teachers. The behaviour one he was the only candidate so that was worrying. They said they'll keep him on file and are interviewing again on Monday.

Yes you're right, I know having a phd doesn't mean you are a great teacher there's a lot more to it. He worked in secondary schools during that in this initiative to encourage disadvantaged pupils to apply to university. Lots of undergraduate teaching and marking experience (which I appreciate is different).
I can't imagine he is arrogant though, he's not arrogant at all. He doesn't have any science/maths A levels but has applied for posts and inteviewed for history or with philosophy/politics/RE.

Speaking as a teacher who escaped after 25 years, the state of schools at the moment would have me applying for anything but teaching.

He definitely is trying to start at the bottom of the pay scale.

It sounds like he needs to get to grips with behaviour management, did he take note and act on EAL, SEND, PP etc?.

After May half term, the only people he will be competing against are other PGCE students and currently unemployed/mat contract teachers. It will still be competitive for History roles in a popular area, but the field of competition will be "lower" and schools will be less likely to be holding out for better teachers.

Most of my peers on my PGCE (including me!) didn't get jobs until much later, more like June or July.

As others have said, Devon and Cornwall are very popular with teachers and tend to have fewer vacancies.

History is also a popular subject.

However - as a new teacher he may find it harder to get a job, but if he keeps going it is likely he'll get something.

Managing behaviour is often the issue that new teachers struggle with the most. I struggled with it a lot when I started and it took me a few goes to find the right school for me.

Don't give up. There's still a lot of time to find a job for September.

Private and grammar schools will be more impressed by his PhD and I think you mentioned undergrad teaching experience?

Worth trying those and also possibly sixth form colleges if you have them. They will also see the PhD as a plus and and the undergrad experience and links as useful.

He needs to offer Geog or RE really, they’re shortage subjects. Also, I’m imagining he’s older than your average PGCE student? That can make it harder to find a job, sadly I’ve found older trainees tend to find the job more difficult and stressful.