Meet the Other Phone. A phone that grows with your child.

Meet the Other Phone.
A phone that grows with your child.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Education

Join the discussion on our Education forum.

Just cried over writing expectations for KS2 versus reality

35 replies

AtomHeartMotherOfGod · 08/03/2024 01:14

I'm a teacher, Y4.

I was just marking my kids' recent work, and got so depressed about the spelling and grammar on show, it made me sob.

I'm only in my second year of teaching, so am still quite inexperienced, but I'm really down about this. The curriculum requirements are so clinical - they are beyond (what I have daily proof of) what many adults are capable of, but have to be used habitually by 8-9 year olds before I can grade them as 'meeting the required standard'!

I kind of have some ideas for redressing it but I can't help feeling I'm failing them when the errors keep cropping up. I'll go round and give verbal feedback and even then some children don't edit for what I've pointed out. I can't get round to speak every child in a lesson... I just feel like Sisyphus pushing the same messages over and over and nothing seeming to stick.

Just needed to let out emotion but would welcome advice or any words of encouragement.

OP posts:
GHGN · 16/03/2024 09:29

modgepodge · 08/03/2024 15:04

Interesting approach from the school, given that one of the standards the children have to meet to get ‘expected’ is ‘maintain legibility in joined handwriting when writing at speed’. Unlikely the majority of children will manage that if they don’t ever teach joined writing.

the kids with the easiest writing to read write with a mixture of cursive and print or print only. Cursive writing is impossible to read.

Pissedoffgrampa · 27/09/2024 12:55

This reply has been withdrawn

This message has been withdrawn at the poster's request

Bunnycat101 · 30/09/2024 16:38

Current y4s seem to be a problem year. I’ve heard it a lot anecdotally. I have a y4 and a y1 and the year 1s and it was a massive shock to see how beautifully behaved the younger kids are compared to the older ones. I think in years to come there will be studies done on the current y4s and implications of Covid and missing so much early years provision.

Araminta1003 · 30/09/2024 17:54

Our state primary has amazing SATs result. They involve the parents from day 1 in quite a large amount of homework for a state primary and constant guidance on keeping up and then they do small group interventions for the parents who cannot be bothered, pretty much every day from 8-8.30am.

Atom Learning now have some free English Maths and Science programmes for state primary school. Our state primary has also subscribed to EdShed - spelling game. There are gaps in spellings in Years 3-5 due to Covid Lockdowns.
Moreover, screens just mean kids are not reading enough and not visiting the library enough. We make sure every class goes to the library every term! It happens to just be up the road, so that helps. There is no short cut, KS2 has to read daily for a minimum of 15 minutes, ideally with an adult, at home.

Araminta1003 · 30/09/2024 17:59

All the state primaries in our trust are doing print in Reception and then cursive from end of first term in year 1, for those kids who are ready. But initially it is the squiggly letters, most do not join up properly until half way through Year 2. From Year 3, all do touch typing and there is handwriting intervention for those who have not mastered cursive, if they agree to it. Kids with SEND is case by case basis, in agreement with parents as to what they want.

Araminta1003 · 30/09/2024 18:02

I also think end of KS2 expectations are very demanding and rely on a strong partnership with parents. It is not possible with just teacher input with a class of 30 plus. The experienced teachers are getting the parents involved as much as possible.

BulletproofHat · 30/09/2024 18:05

ThanksItHasPockets · 13/03/2024 12:51

This is incorrect. Children in English state schools cannot achieve the expected standard in writing at the end of year 6 unless they demonstrate that they can join consistently and legibly.

I thought they could, if there was one area of specific difficulty only, eg spelling or handwriting? Or has that changed since I left teaching?

ThanksItHasPockets · 30/09/2024 18:11

BulletproofHat · 30/09/2024 18:05

I thought they could, if there was one area of specific difficulty only, eg spelling or handwriting? Or has that changed since I left teaching?

Are you thinking of the allowance for a 'particular weakness'? Yes, the teacher can use professional judgement if they feel that a child's particular weakness has stopped them demonstrating a specific 'pupil can' statement, but a moderator would expect to see only a couple such cases in a class of children. The pp to whom I was replying was under the impression that there was generally no need for children to join and that the whole school could achieve ARE with printing only. This is not correct.

mathanxiety · 30/09/2024 18:24

My DCs went to school in the US, where all through elementary school, they had to do a few drafts of work that was handed in. As they progressed through the grades, the number of drafts required increased to about four, iirc.

The first draft was always the roughest, obv, and they had to correct all mistakes by the time the final copy - "best work" - was handed in. They had to do the corrections at home, on new paper, so a complete rewrite was needed every time. If a child's first draft was problem-free, the teacher would suggest adding some extra details or using more advanced vocabulary, so nobody sat on his or her laurels for a week.

ObsidianTree · 30/09/2024 20:07

GN637 · 08/03/2024 19:55

My son is year 4 and I recently got him to write a diary of what we did during our holiday. Five days of what he did, how he felt etc. It was fucking torture. They'd been doing diary writing in class and I thought he'd be able to do it with a little help. He needed constant help. I had to spell most words. He struggled to write a paragraph. He's a bright child and can read well (but is slightly behind) and his maths is fantastic but lockdown did a lot of damage to his education. He missed more school than most due to the GP refusing to diagnose him with a health complaint that resulted in more Covid tests than I care to remember and so many missed weeks of years R and 1. The spellings they are expected to know are ridiculous when they can't spell words such as then or went. He often gets 10/10 on the weekly spellings of words such as technology but basic words? Forget it.
Teachers deserve medals. We need more teachers and smaller classes an d better discipline. Ds is constantly distracted by those with behaviour difficulties. Around 1/5 have additional needs. How on earth are children expected to succeed in classes of 34 with challenging children in such high numbers? It's a good school too.

My daughter is in year 2 and I was surprised by her new type of spellings. She now has to be able to spell there, their and they're and know the difference between each word and be able to put the correct word into a sentence read out in the spelling test. She doesn't remember learning the difference in class. My son who has just left primary has never had spelling tests like this. He also got ridiculous big words to spell.

Maybe this type of test my daughter is now getting is to try and fill the gaps with the difference between words, but I think it's a bit much expecting a year 2 to know the differences. Especially when she doesn't remember learning this in class. I am struggling explaining to her how to identify the differences.

New posts on this thread. Refresh page