Anyone worried about teacher shortages?

[blackcatbabe]

Schools are struggling to recruit at the moment, particularly in the South East. Anyone particularly worried about this in their kids' schools?

Exactly. And in the same way my HLTA is incredible and would provide a far better education for children than some experienced and well qualified teachers.

No. Nor is it "private good, state school bad" either, which I'm sure you weren't implying.

And if they’re in year 1 of that private school teaching experience? You’d be happy to pay thousands for that ?

Yes. I think we're reaching a point where soon classes/ years/ schools simply don't have the staff to open. This is obviously worrying, especially for secondary school aged children who should be preparing for whatever GCSE's the school is able to offer, and having maths covered by say a PE teacher isn't great. I However, I think long term, it will be a good thing as it is the only thing that'll trigger the changes this sector desperately needs.

Exactly.

Or they get stuck in the same school because they can't move elsewhere because an ECT is much cheaper and they get recruited. Often meaning no career progression, no payrise and in some cases perfectly good teachers managed out to be replaced by cheaper ones.

My parents - both teachers actively discouraged me as I did my degree too!

I would for sure. There are plenty of incredible teachers in state schools but the system is fucked and that's a huge issue.

Absolutely.

Education has become more about school image, too many head teachers running huge Mats for huge pay and then still needing heads of school etc. I don't believe it's a cheaper way to do things.

Add to that the effect on pupils with send because they don't want to waste their budget on them.

@JRHartleysmum Don't know, I don't have thousands to spend so I don't have to make the decision! But Year 1 with an unqualified teacher who's got great subject knowledge and demonstrated good teaching skills at interview, who's going to be well-supported by colleagues while they learn their trade, with a decent amount of free periods in a small class with no real behaviour problems, vs a first year NQT in a large class with behaviour problems and half the department absent through stress or job vacancies so unavailable to provie meaningful support -yes, I think I'd choose the former. I'm not saying that's always the 'choice'. All I'm saying is it's not always straightforward. (Similarly, a state primary school class might be far better served by a very experienced HLTA than a poor supply teacher, as noted by another poster).

You’d pay thousands for an unqualified, inexperienced teacher ? Don’t be ridiculous

Yes this is a huge shake-up which is going to require a lot of reorganisation and loss of expertise. I wonder if some teachers will decide it’s not worth it and leave. It’s such a shame for those students who don’t get the grades for A Levels but do very well at BTEC.

Why would someone accept lower wages and no tps ? Private school parents are going to be affected as less people train. Some universities are closing certain subject training courses as they’re getting no applicants. You can’t buy your way out of this crisis. I worked at a big northern indie that is having huge staffing issues after opting out of tps.

But you're not 'paying thousands for an unqualified teacher'. You're paying thousands for the whole package, while accepting that a small number (usually) of the teachers might not have a formal teaching qualification.

If you’re paying for it you expect qualified teachers and private schools should be open about this

Precisely. I don't know anyone who wouldn't have their children escape mainstream education if they could afford it. I also don't think a 9 month course necessarily makes someone a better teacher but that's a different discussion.

So, how will these people learn to deal with the problems and complexities at state schools? Teacher training is rigorous, and quite rightly so. They are observed and checked and measured and feedback given. They have to meet Teacher Standards. I can watch a trainee teach my yr10 class, walk around and support if necessary, give advice, help her to improve next time.
All professions require training for a reason.

I think it's very worrying, and I am worried for my DC as they head towards high school. I used to teach, enjoyed it for a decade but left 1.5 years ago - my new job is so much better in every way. My experience is valued, unlike in teaching if you dare to become experienced and cost a bit more you'll likely get chased out. Only sector that seeks to de-value experience. I really hope my DC do not choose it.
Such a shame as when I first started it was a great job and I loved it. It's unrecognisable now

Woahhhhhh.

That's scary.

Also very interesting when you consider Cleverlys blustering over apprenticeships the other day.

They are obviously setting the pathway for selling them as a better idea than college. They are also narrowing opportunities for those who aren't in top of all qualifications who often have so much more to offer in certain industries which they enter through BTECS.

A PGCE isn't a magic wand that makes someone a good teacher. My husband is a wonderful teacher because of his inherent skills, personality and years of teaching experience. His PGCE helped him to develop some of his practice early on and become a better teacher, but it's only one factor. I would be a crap teacher. I might be marginally better if I did a PGCE, but I would still be crap -I have neither the skills nor inclination to teach. I would far, far rather be taught by my husband without a PGCE than me with a PGCE.

But they have been observed and assessed before being put before a class. The idea that someone with zero qualifications could do the job as well is ridiculous and just shows how little teaching is valued these days

Absolutely!
I believe there should be a qualification to be a teacher in schools, BUT the current PGCE is absolutely meaningless. Lots of people don't have one, but I'm sure wouldn't struggle to pass. But why waste time and money? I think as the qualification is, there is no real arguement that qualified teachers are better than unqualified. They need to make it far harder to be a teacher, reflected with better pay.

That's only one example, @assonant . I'm sure your husband is amazing. However.
Teachers need proper training. With targets, standards, observations, interventions and outcomes.
All my colleagues are trained
Some are better than others, but at least we know they've passed certain Standards.

My secondary aged DC has had loads of subs all year covering any and any random subject. She said some days she could go a whole day with the same sub turning up teaching different subjects. In practice this means giving a handout and not really teaching anything. How could they though if it isn’t actually their subject. It is a crisis. My DC actually wants to be a teacher despite all this. I hold the view that it can’t get better until more people come into the profession. The system is under so much pressure I feel so sorry for teachers. I always thank them whenever I get the chance.

Because Year 1 isn't important???

(KS1 teacher)

Also your argument is bollocks because it would be better to have an NQT with great subject knowledge and supportive staff anyway. It doesn't have to be either or.

Also to the person who posted that PGCE is a waste of time - that maybe in your opinion. But I've mentored primary teaching degree students this year and they were all utterly dire. The unis will pump them out to say they've trained XXX amount of teachers but I can absolutely guarantee that not one of the ones I've seen this year will make it as a teacher. Absolutely no work ethic for a start.

I have been a class teacher mentor for PGCE students and I struggle to recognise the year as "useless". It is quite incredible to watch trainee students grow. We have also had PGCE students who have realised during the year that school life is not for them.

PGCE students are in my classroom and I observe them formally every week (but informally all the time) and give them areas to practise and work on. Their development over the time they are with me is amazing. They also have time to observe me and many other experienced teachers over the school. We have a list of teachers who are strongest in many different aspects and try to get them to see all of those, plus a range of year groups, experiencing lots of school trips, etc.

The new ECT process is time-consuming but means early year teachers now, post PGCE, have two more years of being observed and mentored with opportunity to see other teachers ,too.