Pls explain the UK (high) school system to a foreigner

[EminSydney]

Hi there from Oz
DH's looking at an opportunity to move to his company's London office so I am researching about the school system for our 2 boys. Older one is 14 years (Oz high school year 8) and the younger is 12 years (year 6 in Oz primary).

So far it has been a bit brain-boggling. We are looking mainly at state schools, and I have come to understand there are selective state schools after children sit for the 11+ exams.
My kids both sat for selective school entry exams here in Oz as well, but whether or not they can get into a UK selective school is a different question. I'm just going to start by looking for a good school.

I need some help to get a better understanding how to look for a good school.

(((If there are mums who have gone through moving to the UK with high school kids, please share how you navigated through putting them into the state system)))

1. I saw this on a post but couldnt understand how to read it.

2022 GCSE results of current school:
99% 9-4 (A-C), 71% 9-7(A-A), 43% 9-8 (A*).

What does 9-4 (A-C) mean??

2. I know the UK school year starts in September. Which year would my son go to if he is 15 years old in Sept 2024? Are the years which they would study determined solely by age?
   In Oz, parents have a choice to send their kids to Kinder when they turn 5 or turning 5. So there are children who are a year younger than others in the same school year. Mine both attended Kinder after they've turned 5 which makes them older than some of their peers in the same class.
   So when they go into a UK school, they might actually have to skip a year if entry is according to age? Not sure how it would impact them academically as the 2 curriculums could be very different...

3. Does a local state school have to take them in if we live in the area no matter when and what? (this applies to where we currently are in Australia)
   Is it possible to start any time during the year at all?

Thanks for your time reading this!

I'm also on a thread with the OP in the cost of living section about moving to the U.K.
Would someone be able to confirm if her ds is 15 when he arrives in 2024, say he wants to go to uni in 2027 would he be classed as an international student with those fees so it would be better if he went to study in Australia where his passport is from?

Generally, individuals must be resident and 'settled' in the UK on 'the first day of the first academic year' of their course to be eligible for home student status. With some exceptions, they must also have been 'ordinarily resident' in the UK for the three years before that date.

https://commonslibrary.parliament.uk/eligibility-for-home-fee-status-and-student-support-in-england/

I used to work in a school. My experience of our kids moving to a different LA is that the allocation process could take weeks (sometimes literally months) when it went through the LA. Whereas direct applications to schools could be done in days (we sometimes had a child start within 1 or 2 days of applying). Depends on how good the LA are of course.

@tennissquare to be fair if he is coming when he is 15 he would want to be in the year below so he can do the full GCSE course. It isn't rare in London to have children from abroad to be put in the year below so they can do full GCSE or A level courses.

My nephew moved to London from abroad at 15. More than half the school year had gone and they said the syllabus was different so he had to start year 10 the following September when age wise he should have been starting year 11. It was frustrating for him as he felt he was ahead (attended private school abroad) and found things fairly easy here.

You ideally need to have some idea of where you want to move in London then start factoring schools in. The school run in the morning makes traffic awful and a seemingly short distance can take a long time to travel if needing bus/ car.

I would contact school's directly (as well as local authority) to enquire about spaces even if you have to apply through the local authority.

Can you delay the move until your sim is year 12 age as you will find it nigh on impossible to get a school to take him in Y11. He would also have a limited choice of subject options as the option blocks will be full at schools by then.
If he could go straight to 6th form ie delay it would be much better all round with better choices available.

It might be worth looking on the council websites for the areas you are looking at as there is usually plenty of information on those regarding applying for school places.

The uni fees question is based on "place of usual domicile" rather than passport. If the student has been living "normally" in England on a perm basis (not just for the purposes of education aka at boarding school) then they would likely qualify for home fees. If they have only been here temporarily (for example, if the parent only has a contract for X years) then it gets a bit more complicated and each uni will determine whether they are home or overseas for fees. Then they will also need to apply to Student Finance England to see if they meet their residency criteria (which is similar but not completely identical) if they want access to government funding for home fees. I've known situations where students have been classes as home by some universities and international by others but rejected for student finance so even if they're classed as home by the university they have to self fund.

Then they'd also need to check out the funding requirements for Australia as I have no idea whether they'd be classed as home or international (or if there's such a thing) as obviously there could be something similar to the situation here where they aren't automatically classed as home just due to their passport.

I’m not a huge private school advocate but I would be checking out this option for 15 yr old to see if they could help them settle quickly and adapt to GCSE syllabus.

Tbh it will be tough on your oldest due to proximity in taking exams.

To add to what I said above, a lot of fee statuses are determined by looking at residence over the period of the last 3 years so it may potentially be "easier" for the oldest to take a gap year then apply as then they will fulfil any 3 year residency requirements, but regardless I'd certainly advise talking to the student fees team before applying to any UK and Australian universities as each situation is different.

If your partner's company were paying school fees as part of the transfer package it would make things a lot simpler for you, is that something he can explore?

The state sector is tricky, although its a bit easier with the numbers of families exiting London over recent years. I would forget grammar, they are mostly in the suburbs and places coming up are extremely unlikely.

As others have said, there is no obligation for local council to find you a state place until you have a permanent address here and then you will be at the mercy of which schools have vacancies and even in the state sector the popular schools are going to have wait lists. In all likelihood you will need to take whats offered and then sit on a waitlist till places come up elsewhere (and you can go down as well as up a list based on the schools admissions criteria).

You will have an extra struggle if its a yr11 place you need as its halfway through the GCSE course and schools will be reluctant to take on someone who has no knowledge of the syllabus.

I work in this area and this would be a very challenging move for your son, in terms of the time if the move and the systems he is moving between. If you can, wait and move when he is entering year 12.

Since this is a thread about education, a polite educational reminder that there is not a UK wide educational system and most posters are saying UK, with regard to school term dates and starting ages when they actually mean England and Wales. Scotland is completely different, not relevant to the OP of course in London, but other people may end up reading this thread for whom this distinction could be more important.

I wasn't clear from your post when you are thinking of moving? The easiest time to move in the school year is September. Ideally your eldest would have done year 10 and 11 before taking GCSEs in the May/June of Year 11. Moving straight into Year 11 would be extremely tough. Year 10 is for those who turn 15 between 1st September and 31st August; Year 11 is for those who will turn 16 between 1st September and 31st August. Schools maybe prepared to let him start at Year 10, even if he is older. Otherwise starting at Year 12 (year he turns 17) might be better as students start a new pathway for years 12 and 13.

I would look at what sorts of areas you would like to move to and then Google search school admissions for that area. London is divided into boroughs so you would search eg London borough of Camden school admissions. They will have a website with admission details and Contact numbers Contact them about which schools have spaces in the relevant year groups. If you want to live outside of London then the local authority will be the county council (eg Essex, Surrey).

Logistically I would think it would be harder to move into a selective state school but the school admissions team should be able to advise you further. Even the London boroughs which have some grammar schools still have a wide selection of non-grammar schools.

I think it is a tricky transition., Where in Australia are you?
we moved the other way and kept DS basically in the same school year he would be in UK- starting 3 months later- he's 13 and in year 8 and would be in the same year in uk- your son would be in at least a year above
The syllabusses are very different and our son is doing work at a lower standard i would say than his friends at school in UK There's no school certificate where we are- so no equivalent of GCSEs- so we think we'd have to move for GSCEs or stay to after school leaving - the concern I have with GSCEs is that many schools start the courses at year 9.
One thing i wish we'd sort of is have him do IB here so that there would be a straightforward switch- is that an option? if not for your eldest but maybe for the younger?

Just telling it like it is @MayBlossom23 !

I'm Australian so understand how acutely different the UK system is. It's useful for the OP to know that her child will be arriving into a system that includes high-stakes exams in Year 11 because those exams don't exist in Australia. The exams that matter over there are only taken at 18, not at 16 and 18.

Wow, amazing amount of very helpful insights. I can't thank everyone who has contributed enough. THANK YOU!
It's a lot to take in and digest, and we will slowly.
Definitely will heed the advice of not fooling around moving them during their critical years, even if it means not being able to move just yet.

I feel like the Oz curriculum is too relaxed and am worried they will not be able to cope with the GCSEs. I, myself have taken the 'O' and 'A' levels back in the day and still get nightmares of how gruelling the exams were.

Re where we will live, since the preferred office is in Aldershot at the moment (there are talks of them merging with the central London office, and new location is unsure atm), I have been researching areas around Fleet and Farnborough areas where housing is more affordable than say, farnham and other nice areas in Surrey.

I have been seeing recommendations for Alton but it seems bit far out?

Not sure about Woking or Guildford areas for living yet but have seen these names pop up in some posts.

True enough that the systems are different @Throughabushbackwards - but it's not true to say that a child will only get into a good uni if they have straight 9s at GCSE.

They might not get into the most elite universities, but plenty of RG level unis won't worry about slightly patchier grades, especially where there are mitigating circumstances like this and the child is coming from an ordinary London comprehensive. My daughter has a mix of 7s and 8s and one 5 at GCSE and has been offered all five RG universities she applied to for her subject, including Bristol, Leeds & Edinburgh.

Or the child could take a year off and apply to the best of the best with proven A-level results in hand.

In any case, you're missing the point as OP isn't asking about universities, but schools. it's not a great time to move a 15 year old into the English education system, but it is what it is.

@EminSydney the areas you are looking at do not have grammar schools so no need to worry about those. You'd be considering private or state schools.
I would say Alton is on the smaller side but housing more affordable. Has a decent secondary school and 6th form college. It's a nice area and again lots of lovely countryside.

@EminSydney just to add, our local secondary start GCSE's in year 9. due to the amount of content they now need to cover. DS currently taking his and has 22 exams, so definitely something to consider with respect to the ages of your kids and what school year they would be entering.

You could also consider international schools, as it is a tricky age to transfer in as everyone mentions. It might make things easier, at least for your older one. For example they have an American school here. Not sure about an Aussie one. But perhaps American might be easier transition?

Grade 9-4 is the passmark, 9 being the top end of the scale. Age 15 in September next year means he would be year 9 in September 2023. Year 9 is probably an easier entry point that 10 when most gcse courses start. Allocated year is determined by age group in first instance, with deferral exceptions made on request for summer born earlier in the system. LA has to allocate your dc a place but that could be some distance away if local schools are full. You can go on waiting lists and appeal but this would take time.

And yes you can start during the academic year, the application you make at any point after year 7 has started will be "In Year".

Another thing to be aware of is that there are no school 6th forms where you are planning to live - schools only go to year 11 (the GCSE year). After that those who want to do A-levels (rather than going for an apprenticeship or starting work) go to a sixth form college for years 12 and 13. The ones in Farnham, Farnborough and Alton are all highly regarded. Sixth form college is a good stepping stone to university - no daft uniform, first name terms with tutors, students treated in a much more "adult" way, however it is not always suitable for students lacking maturity or self-discipline.

EminSydney do you mean your DS's birthday is in September?

Or do you mean he will already be 15 by September i.e. his birthday is in August or earlier in the year?

Because the answer makes quite a difference, school year-wise as it's the difference between starting GSCEs at the beginning, or part way through.

I can see some posters are giving you advice on the basis that they've interpreted your post as saying your DS's birthday is in September, but I'm not sure if that's correct or not?