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Original poster

Senior school - options if you’re not well off

32 replies

Whattodoaboutschool · 17/02/2023 09:55

Hello I’ve name changed for this because I know there are people on here who know me and it’s quite outing.

Anyway DD is year 5. She’s a bright child, engaged and happy, but whilst she excels at some things (art and sport and creative writing) she really really struggles with things like maths.

There are 3 potential state high schools near us. Two are poor and I am even more worried that she may be in the lower sets for some subjects where I’m aware that pupil behaviour is extremely poor. The one I would consider is over subscribed and out of catchment and I think it’s unlikely we get a place (although I will try).

I had always intended to try and coach her thought the 11 + but it’s been clear for a while that even if we were do that, the grammar school wouldn’t be the right fit. And I want her to have a positive school experience as much as possible.

in a perfect world I’d send her to a lovely independent near by but I can’t afford it atm. We can’t move house for a while either unfortunately.

There is an Avanti school, which I don’t know much about.

Has anyone any suggestions for options I haven’t thought about?

thank you

OP posts:
clary · 17/02/2023 11:01

I mean OP if you don’t have the money for private school, your options are home educate or state school. If you don’t like the state school nearest you, you can put a preferred one top of your list (and put your local one on there too as a fallback). If you don’t get in, you can appeal. Some appeals succeed, though they need to be based on what the appealed-for school can offer (clubs or subjects for instance – our child has learned German from a relative and it is offered at the school; your child plays clarinet and there is an orchestra at the school), rather than what you don’t like about the offered school.

You can also move to be nearer the preferred school - is that an option? Otherwise you can encourage your dd to learn resilience and appreciate that in life, there will be disruption and she should learn how to deal with it. And support her and her eventual secondary school and her learning there in any way you can.

skramblin · 17/02/2023 13:03

There's no need to announce a name change - people do it all the time. It would have been more anonymous if you'd done it quietly. Then you could have named the schools and/or area and got some more specific feedback.

Fairislefandango · 17/02/2023 13:21

It might be worth looking at the Avanti school, because it sounds like your other options are either bad or unattainable. I'd never heard of Avanti, but on Googling it, a MN thread came up here. Mixed reviews, but some very positive.

icanneverthinkofnc · 17/02/2023 13:42

Does the independent near you have bursaries. My DC attended indies although we were low income/ benefits. Might be worth a look.

Dotcheck · 17/02/2023 13:45

I think you’re dismissing the ‘poor’ schools out of hand. Poor because of ofsted reports?
Schools sometimes stream according to class personality as well. Have you attended any of their open evenings?

Hersetta427 · 17/02/2023 19:21

Really it doesn't sound like you have much of an option except state schools. If she really struggles with maths it maybe that she would be either unlikely to pass the 11+ to get into a grammer or pass the entrance exams at the independent school at a sufficiently high level to qualify for a bursary.

We have a new Avanti school opened in the last year in our town - people are saying it's excellent although the sen provision is non existent

lanthanum · 17/02/2023 23:33

If you were going to coach her for the 11+, could you instead coach her in maths with the medium-term aim of not being in the bottom sets, and the longer-term aim of getting a good GCSE grade? Have a growth mindset about it...

greenteafiend · 18/02/2023 09:11

OP, your girl sounds a bit like mine! Very artistic, good enough at most subjects but maths is weaker than her other subjects.

Have you had her tutored? It has massively helped my daughter. No tutoring is going to turn a non maths-y kid into one who is talented at maths, but if the aim is to get her through school with confidence and without tears, and get an OK score for maths in her exams at some point? Tutoring isn't free, but it's a lot less than private school fees.

I'd look seriously at the Avanti school. I think that if the other secondaries near you have a poor reputation for behavior, you're probably right to be a bit concerned about disruption in the lower maths set (awful boys spoiling every lesson etc.) Don't want to stereotype, but the cliche of Indian families caring about education and teaching their kids to respect teachers does have a grain of truth, based on my own experience of a school which had a majority of Indian families. Can you share what Avanti school it is, as I am seeing mixed reviews on Mumsnet depending on the school?

QuillBill · 18/02/2023 09:15

lanthanum · 17/02/2023 23:33

If you were going to coach her for the 11+, could you instead coach her in maths with the medium-term aim of not being in the bottom sets, and the longer-term aim of getting a good GCSE grade? Have a growth mindset about it...

This is a good idea. My dc go to a RI school but they have been absolutely fine. We don't live in a good area but my dc have thrived at school.

redskydelight · 19/02/2023 15:06

if you can't afford private then your option is basically to use a state school. By what measure are you judging your local schools to be poor? What do other people in your area do?

starpatch · 19/02/2023 19:24

Put her on the waiting list for the out of catchment school? Sounds like that is a bit of long shot though so meanwhile she would have to start at one of the others?

snowtrees · 20/02/2023 00:19

Don't get sucked in. State is fine

crazycrofter · 20/02/2023 11:11

Home education may be a third option, depending on your circumstances. And if you wanted a middle ground there are online schools that are cheaper than independent schools, and take up less of the day so that you’ve got time to pursue other interests, such as creative stuff. Or some home educators take a pick and mix approach of tuition (either online or in person) for Maths and English, and child led for other stuff.

florafloss · 20/02/2023 11:15

I have never heard of an Avanti school and I used to be a teacher. If you have decided grammar is not a good fit and you don't want to move you would have to choose the state schools and maybe consider getting a tutor for maths so she doesn't end up in the bottom sets. Maths is a subject where one to one tuition Is hugely beneficial.

Landlubber2019 · 20/02/2023 11:15

Go look at the local stare schools and consider extra tuition for maths. What does your daughter want? I wouldn't consider private unless you can very comfortably afford it (including future increases as needed).

3WildOnes · 20/02/2023 11:16

Would you qualify for a bursary to an independent?

backinthebox · 20/02/2023 11:22

Counting myself among the poor people here. My kids go to the local state school. DD is predicted mostly 9s at GCSE and aiming for Cambridge. Imagine how much better she’d be if we could afford to pay for something we can’t afford to pay for! While we are on the subject of wanting something we can’t afford, I’d like a holiday to the Maldives please. Does anyone know how I can get a grant? I’d rather not go to the places poor people go.

3WildOnes · 20/02/2023 11:34

@backinthebox But there literally are grants (well, bursaries) for people to access private education when they can't afford it.

Kokeshi123 · 20/02/2023 13:59

backinthebox · 20/02/2023 11:22

Counting myself among the poor people here. My kids go to the local state school. DD is predicted mostly 9s at GCSE and aiming for Cambridge. Imagine how much better she’d be if we could afford to pay for something we can’t afford to pay for! While we are on the subject of wanting something we can’t afford, I’d like a holiday to the Maldives please. Does anyone know how I can get a grant? I’d rather not go to the places poor people go.

Oh behave. The OP has reasonable worries about poor behavior in her local options; she's not trying to avoid poor people.

sixfoot · 20/02/2023 14:16

We went through all this, local state has been fine. Gone from needs improvement - good - outstanding under two new heads. My two Bright kids are challenged AND can walk to school with all their friends.

Yes, some bad behaviour from peers but that’s life. friends who’ve gone private have realised you can’t buy your way out of the teen years, they are universal

agree with a PP - don’t get sucked in. Is mainly marketing and relies on parental fear.

snowtrees · 21/02/2023 00:16

backinthebox · 20/02/2023 11:22

Counting myself among the poor people here. My kids go to the local state school. DD is predicted mostly 9s at GCSE and aiming for Cambridge. Imagine how much better she’d be if we could afford to pay for something we can’t afford to pay for! While we are on the subject of wanting something we can’t afford, I’d like a holiday to the Maldives please. Does anyone know how I can get a grant? I’d rather not go to the places poor people go.

This made me laugh😂 me too.
I'm comfortable but defo not rich. I can afford to pay for school trips for my DC. But yes wouldn't dream of asking for a grant for rich kids privileges.

Original poster
Whattodoaboutschool · 21/02/2023 17:00

Thanks everyone for your feedback.

To be clear.
I’m not trying to ask for a bursary for private school.
We are paying for a private maths tutor.
I’m also not discounting all the state schools. Only the ones that have issues like county lines, gang related violence etc. where I have adults friends who have or do teach there.
A state school can be great. It’s can also be awful. Just like an independent.
I’m not trying to opt out of the teenage years.
We all work hard and make choices about where we go on holidays and what we teach our children, finance is just one factor we use as a decision maker. I would like her to go to a school with helps her achieve. And not somewhere where her any achievements are ‘despite’ the school. As was my experience at a state high school.

thank you to those with helpful ideas and those with reassuring experiences.

OP posts:
Original poster
Whattodoaboutschool · 21/02/2023 17:05

I’m also not looking to avoid ‘poor people’

I’m looking for an environment where it is possible to learn, and where the teacher isn’t just enlisted in crowd control while other students are disruptive or throwing chairs or picking in the kids who actually want to learn. Students heading to Cambridge probably don’t experience this to the same level as kids in the lower sets.

OP posts:
Original poster
Whattodoaboutschool · 21/02/2023 17:11

In my local area there has been a significant move to independent from people who can afford it. And moving house for some that can’t. And some thriving at the state school (mostly those in higher sets) and some parents having awful problems. Really scary stuff. Some parents have taken their children out of high school and await a place elsewhere. But obviously by this point they are known and the problematic influences have their teeth into them. So it’s very hard to get them away properly

OP posts:
MyNameIsErinQuin · 21/02/2023 17:15

greenteafiend · 18/02/2023 09:11

OP, your girl sounds a bit like mine! Very artistic, good enough at most subjects but maths is weaker than her other subjects.

Have you had her tutored? It has massively helped my daughter. No tutoring is going to turn a non maths-y kid into one who is talented at maths, but if the aim is to get her through school with confidence and without tears, and get an OK score for maths in her exams at some point? Tutoring isn't free, but it's a lot less than private school fees.

I'd look seriously at the Avanti school. I think that if the other secondaries near you have a poor reputation for behavior, you're probably right to be a bit concerned about disruption in the lower maths set (awful boys spoiling every lesson etc.) Don't want to stereotype, but the cliche of Indian families caring about education and teaching their kids to respect teachers does have a grain of truth, based on my own experience of a school which had a majority of Indian families. Can you share what Avanti school it is, as I am seeing mixed reviews on Mumsnet depending on the school?

@greenteafiend why awful boys spoiling lessons! There are plenty of girls who are disruptive as well..,