Large class sizes Vs combined age groups

[hughiebooey]

We are sending our DC to the local state school and cannot decide which might be best.

Option A
Primary school based within a town, 340 children, approx 30-32 per class. It seems there are usually 1 teacher and 2 assistants for that number. There (seemed) to be lots more going on within those schools, I guess because of the number of children, but DD is very shy and lacks confidence so I wonder whether she will be overlooked in a large class like that.

Option B
Country school (we live rurally). It is a very home-from-home feel. 97 children in total. As such, they combine age groups, so reception and year one together; years 2 and 3 together etc. Again seems lovely but unsure of a smaller, country school, but as above, given DD's personality I wonder whether this would suit her better? I get the feeling a lot of middle class families send their kids here. I know 2x doctors and a vet that send their children plus the percentage on free school meals is low. I asked the headmistress when we spoke whether the combined years means the older lot are held back etc, she said they almost disregard the age and teach them based on ability. If they are easily mastering the easier work then they can do what the older lot are doing etc.

I intend to put them into a private secondary schooling.

Any help gratefully received as I am really, really torn!

Which school did you prefer OP, when you were walking round? Was there one you felt would suit your DC better?

This is the only question that is worth asking. All my school decisions for my DC were essentially based on gut feeling. Did you like the head teachers of both schools? Did s/he seem dynamic and share your values? What were the children like who showed you round? Did they seem happy and busy? Did they have good manners? (Hold doors open for you etc)? Were they chatty and confident without being brash and pushy? How were the children generally behaving around the school and playground? All of those things are things that only you can answer.

If your in-year application means that you might end up with a pig in a poke, I'd go down the private route now, if you possibly can.

We went with A, moved him to B and then moved him again to a mix of A and B. He's thrived. A was too big for ds and B was too small.

It depends if a larger school mixes classes each year or not. In this case they would have to as 340 is just over 1.5 classes per year, but some two form entry schools don't mix up the classes each year. So children may only form friendship groups from a pool of 30 children anyway. In a half form entry school the children would be likely to get to know the children both in the year above and below as well as their own year.

We went for B - with the extra benefit of it being 200 yards from our house v a drive away.

I did 5 years as a governor there as well. Funding always an issue, waiting for pupil numbers in April was always a bit mail biting as it affected our TA provision for the September

I also found that they grew out of the small friendship groups by Y6, and the latter half of Y6 was problematic with both my elder ones as they were so ready to spread their wings away.

My youngest is currently Y5 so we shall see what happens next year.

My niece and nephew go to a 3FE primary school and my SIL raves about the extra opportunities available due to extra funding.

Swings and roundabouts, we've been lucky with our small school but the definitely have their disadvantages

I would do option B and if you can, move them in Year 3 to a private prep.

@thing47 thanks - it is one of those counter intuitive things so perhaps not a suprise!

They have 16 I think (so smaller than her class now) in the current combined Recept and Y1 class. I think he said 8 in their current Reception, so I guess 10 in Y1.

That's tiny - that would make me even more concerned about the finances, to be honest.

How are the year groups spilt in the other school? 320 would suggest some split year group classes there too.

320 is still very small in the grand scheme of things.. my sons school has 500, my own school I teach at has 220. 220 is too small as it works out 1 massive class for each year (except from P1 where ratios are smaller so we have 2 tiny P1 classes and then they’re chucked together in P2 anyway)

Wow that's far too small. 8 in your year is a really small group to make friends in. Ideally larger group gives more options for friendships and interests. As they get older in particular its good to have friends you can relate to.

Having lots more going on in the larger school is really good too. Especially in a year or two.

On paper I'd say A definitely by a mile. (Having had experience of both types)however distance could also be a factor - being local counts for a lot. As does the feel you get looking round (feel for if the kids are happy and active that is. Not a feel for if doctors send their kids there. 🙄. A final thing might be before/after school provision if you're working.

Just to say, in mixed year groups your child will make friends with children in other years - just because there's only 8 in the year group doesn't mean they can only be friends with those 8. My DC know everyone in the school & have friends across the year groups rather than siloing them into just their year groups.

Yes, it's more like Scouts where children aren't just friends with the other children the same age as them

We sent both our DC to option B and have no regrets at all (both now teenagers). Eldest DC was v shy and when we visited option A I just felt she would be lost (was a two form entry). She started in a mixed class reception and Yr1 and had friends from both years. We were lucky in that it was a lovely environment with great teachers and she really thrived and grew in confidence. As a pp said all the kids knew each other.

We went to school B .. we had no school A.
Upside is everyone knows everyone and the TAs and children were lovely..
Downside is extra curricular is extremely limited. External sports teacher came in once a week. One hockey match a year for which dc1 was not picked as she did not go to local hockey club.. no netball club, no football club. Art and music also dire. Dc2 had 3 years in his class. He was 6 and the eldest child was 9. I was concerned he was exposed to older child's stuff before necessary. Academically both kids were bored.
We moved them both in yr 3 to a private school.
Give my time again if there was a bigger school I would choose that. Some years only had 5 children in them. Both our children were lucky and had 12 or more in their year. Choice of friends is very limited.

My child is in B, only 3 classes across whole school mixed age. I checked the financials and this school has a lot more money than the local school A (both A and B church schools no other choices locally) . I suspect as many of the pupils are sent there instead of private due to the class sizes so some parents donate a lot towards the fund raising. I love the fact the head greets every child at the start of school every day, they all play cross years unlike bigger schools. The downsides are that it can be a huge leap to secondary from such a small school, there so no breakfast club or after school provision. You have to pick which suits your child.

Do the schools offer wrap around care if you need it? Are there extracurricular activities?

There's a village school not too far from me with only 70odd pupils. People rave about it and it is a community school and does involve parenta in a lot which is lovely.

But. Even in my circles I know at least 2 it didn't work for (from 2 different years.)

1 felt she was picked on (looked a bit different) and didn't get on with the teacher but due to shared year groups would have her again the following year. There were only a few girls in her year and she wasnt "in" with them.

Another girl - mum still raves about how amazing the school is, but for several years before middle school also said how her daughter was excluded - only 4 girls in her year and the other 3 played as a 3. They taunted her throughout the school.

This is the real problem with very small schools. Great if your child is in that little group of 3 or whatever. Not so great if your child is the 1.

I moved DS1 from B to A and then his 3 siblings followed on. More resources, clubs, friendship options, teams etc. I think ultimately though it will depend on the quality of teaching, but we found the mixed year classes didn't stretch him enough, and the lack of sport/extracurricular activities and clubs was limiting.

I’d go for A- bigger school so more staff. At the village school you’ll have one teacher who’s head of key stage, as well as senco and curriculum lead for different subjects and possibly deputy head as well. Head will also be safeguarding lead and teach as well as all the other roles a head has.
My siblings went to a small village school and they didn’t sort my db’s dyslexia or access arrangements for SATs. Bigger schools have to be on the ball with this and all the other issues.

Which school would better suit your child? If they are shy the smaller school would suit them best.

Speaking as a parent of a very shy child, it didn't help her at all to be in an A school as there were more children for her to hide behind. She was never in any great friendship groups/drama clubs/sports teams as she happily hid at the back and let the other children do everything.

It was a huge frustration for me as she needed to be gently pushed out of her comfort zone but it never happened. She was quiet and academically within expected ability so was completely- and I mean completely - overlooked throughout primary school. (Her Y2 teacher didn't even know she could read as she'd always been put in a group to read - due to class size, 1-1 reading wasn't possible. Being shy she sat back and let the other children read out loud. The teacher was stunned when she saw the books she was reading in her reading diary. Note: this is NOT a teacher bashing post - the teacher was brilliant but coping with 36 children in the class; with several children with acute special needs).

My advice would be to put a shy child in B so they get the nurturing environment to thrive and a gentle push to try more things.

My daughter moved schools this year (due to relocation). Ours has about 100ish pupils over 7 years, with mixed year groups. She is in the lower class of their mixed group which is brilliant as she is working well beyond her current academic year, and this means she is able to join in with the older group for lots of things. In her old (much bigger) school she tended to get a bit forgotten as she never struggled with anything and never needed help, but they were too busy to find ways to stretch her.