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Eton & WinColl Scholars - KS / Election results?

41 replies

Mum8008 · 25/05/2019 21:20

Does anyone know what kind of scholarship exam results lead to Kings Scholars at Eton or Scholars College at WinColl? (How many As or Bs are usual for someone selected?)

OP posts:
BasiliskStare · 07/06/2019 20:41

Ds ( commoner ) got 5 As and 2 Bs in Winchester entrance - but he did not apply for election - I believe it was considered decent. Scholars by and large do not get money. & Ds was happier living in a boarding house than College. As I remember there was not a thing which would be the equivalent of KS ( i.e. fees paid). So as a PP says when DS was there ( Wincoll ) it was more bursary / means tested if needed.

WombatChocolate · 09/06/2019 16:30

I think I agree with those who pint out that when a child is genuinely clever and intellectually curious, they are able to exhibit it and gain the coveted places and experiencing them is generally then a great stimulus rather than burden.

Difficulties come when parents of relatively bright but not super bright and particularly not intellectually curious children feel that somehow these coveted places should be available to them as their child is relatively bright and they have paid fees a day/or tutors for years and are willing to keep paying. It's similar with Oxbridge entry when people feel sure that just because their child has a string of good GCSEs they must be Oxbridge material and sure of a place, without a thought for the fact that said child has never in their life actively chosen of their own free will to read about/engage with a subject due to genuine enthusiasm and interest.

BasiliskStare · 09/06/2019 17:44

@Wombatchocolat - very interesting post

peteneras · 11/06/2019 18:37

”More outsider curiosity questions here. . .”

Apologies for the delayed response, IsThisYourSanderling, meaning to write earlier but overtaken by events beyond my control.

Not all prep schools actively prepare their brightest boys for the KS exams – in fact, not all prep schools know how to prepare their (brightest) boys for these exams. If you’d looked back in the last few decades you’d see a great proportion of successful KS’s come from just a handful of the same prep schools. Occasionally, obscure prep schools here and there may spring up a surprise or two but these are very few and far in between. Over the years, I’ve seen people particularly in London, trying to cash in on this aspect of educational opportunity by advertising themselves to be “specialist” KS tutors. To date, I’ve not seen a single KS emerging from this route.

”Also, do any boys apply that aren't already at expensive schools?”

In the present era, roughly about 150’ish boys apply to sit the KS exams annually. A sizeable proportion come from overseas particularly from East and S.E. Asia e.g. China, Korea, Thailand, Singapore, etc. But expatriate boys from the Middle East and some native Eastern European boys have shown great interests and competed in the past and perhaps even today. Most of these overseas boys would have attended the overseas prep schools (junior branches of UK senior public schools) that had sprung up like wild fire there in the last 20 or so years. For sure, these schools are not cheap – I know most UK senior public schools are registered charities but their charitable intentions do not extend to educate overseas boys.

The rest of the KS applicants would almost certainly be coming exclusively from UK prep schools with perhaps one or two exceptions.

peteneras · 11/06/2019 18:58

"It sounds like they (outsiders) would be at a considerable disadvantage?”

That’s exactly right, IsThisYourSanderling, in fact, outsiders don’t get a look-in, never mind a “considerable disadvantage”.

To better understand the above, and to save myself from repeating what I wrote on another thread a fortnight ago regarding the same subject, here’s an excerpt:

The two Eton scholarships I mentioned were not quite the same. DS first won the 'Junior Scholarship' at the age of ten - a scholarship specifically designed for state school kids (4 places) - which guaranteed him a place at Eton to go there at the age of 13. He would be pulled out from his state primary school to go to a prep school of my choice (but working closely with Eton and only to one of their many "approved" prep schools). I thought I wanted the local highly reputable Highgate School because it was near me but Eton's immediate reply was, "No - Highgate is not suitable". I was then given a list of some of the UK's (now I know) premier prep schools to consider, both boarding and day. We finally decided full boarding at a top Berkshire prep school.

The 'Junior Scholarship' is now replaced by the 'New Foundation Scholarship' when successful boys go straight to Eton from their state school(s) at the age of 13. Eton don't sponsor the 3-year prep school element any more in order to distribute the funds more widely, e.g. Sixth Form Scholarships, etc.. . .

The 2nd Eton scholarship that DS won was the 'King's Scholarship' when aged 13 just before he entered Eton. This pot of scholarship funds is entirely separate from all other Eton's funding pots - each pot serving a specific purpose it is designed for. Again, the KS itself can be a 100% (or more) scholarship for the boy's entire career at Eton.

As explained above, at least 2 or 3 (if not all 4) of the Junior Scholarship winners would eventually go on to win the KS three years later after having left their state schools to attend prep schools. But since the introduction of the New Foundation Scholarship after having scrapped the JS in the mid-2000’s, none of the NFS winners that I know of to date had won the KS. In other words, nobody from the state sector that I know of got a look-in of the King’s Scholarship.

I remember at the time of the proposal of scrapping the JS, the Master-in-College (Housemaster of the KS’s) and their team were fighting tooth and nail against the powers that be about this new proposal for this very reason – that it would be the end of the road for state school boys as far as the KS is concerned.

”Are the scholarships means tested or more of a status thing for those who can already afford the fees anyway?”

The JS/NFS was/is understood to be a 100% or more scholarship. ‘More’ because winners will be given two sets of uniform and many other allowances e.g. free music lessons, pocket money, etc should there be a need for them. Parents are still given a bursary form to fill but at the end of the day, it’s up to you to tell Eton how much you can afford or none at all as the case may be in which case you’ll be given ‘more’ than the 100% scholarship. There are currently more than 70 boys who don’t pay a bean at Eton!

The KS has a very slightly different rule (maybe Eton knows most winners are well off because they predominantly come from prep schools). Until about 15 years ago, winners automatically get a remission of 50% off school fees; then this was reduced to 25% a few years later; and then further reduced to the current 10%. In all this time at whatever rate the remission might be, the 100% or ‘more’ scholarship as above can still apply whenever there is a need for them. Conversely, wealthier parents are requested to give up part or all of the scholarship if they do not need them and still retain the status of a scholar. The KS is a foundation scholarship for “70 poor scholars” but in modern times, I know of some who live in literally the UK’s most expensive postcodes e.g. Belgravia and surround, etc.

FiveofUs123 · 24/06/2019 22:36

You don't need to be a KS to get a fee reduction at Eton. You get your son in, and then you declare your financial circumstances.

nolanscrack · 25/06/2019 09:10

Lots of very bright boys want nothing to do with College or being a KS,they wouldnt mind the slightly better food but thats about it.They certainly dont want the pressure that comes from being a ks,theyd much rather get an OS and live in a normal house,dont forget most years Eton will send over 5 times as many boys to Oxbridge as there are Kings Scholars,indeed many boys get Oxbridge offers and never even got an OS,just as not all KS boys get in to Oxbridge.

Eton has a very good(but could be better)bursary pot,if a boy is bright enough but fees would be a problem ,then they will do all they can to help,once at school no one knows or cares who has a bursary

Pretty sure that at least one KS is NFS

The make up of college is very different to an Oppi house ,it certainly wouldnt have suited us or our boys

StripeyChina · 25/06/2019 21:18

I know an Old Wykhamist who was a Scholar (some years back)
He said it was the most intellectually challenging environment he has ever been in (inc Cambridge, Treasury and Int Maths Olympiad).
We visited recently and he was stunned to see that the list of boys is no longer in 'rank order' (much muttering about the place going to the dogs). Eton was referred to as: 't'other place' and felt to be intellectually inferior. There is certainly more than a little arrogance.
How typical (or up to date) that is I cannot say.

Genevieva · 26/06/2019 00:04

peternas, your insight is fascinating. Originally (and until well into the 20th century) the King's Scholars did not pay fees because they are part of the foundation of the school. It is probably because of the reasons you describe that the distinction between scholarship (accolade for achievement) and bursary (means tested financial support) became necessary.

A few people have mention the social feel in College being different. Surely, they are still a bunch of teenage boys mucking in together. Is it really that different?

TonTonMacoute · 28/06/2019 18:29

A few people have mention the social feel in College being different. Surely, they are still a bunch of teenage boys mucking in together. Is it really that different?

That's true. It's not radically different, but it is different. In fact I would say that several of the houses have a slightly different feel depending on the HM, and what his aims and priorities are.

peteneras · 22/09/2019 19:08

It's been a bit late this year but Eton has finally published the 2019 Election Roll on its website. Congratulations to the new KS's who entered College earlier this month.

True to form, as always it's the usual suspects that seem to dominate the Roll. Three prep schools between them secured almost half the 14 KS places with each school winning two spots making a total of 6 out of the 14 available - Dragon, Summer Fields and Westminster Under School. I note a couple of grammar school boys are knocking hard on the door with one actual success and the other gaining a lesser prize. Very well done indeed!

"A few people have mention the social feel in College being different. Surely, they are still a bunch of teenage boys mucking in together. Is it really that different?"

I don't know who these "few people" are but whoever they are, they clearly have not stepped foot anywhere near College. Even the school's official website said of KS's, "Every boy has his own study-bedroom, and apart from a few ceremonial differences,* his life at Eton follows the same structure and style as the rest of the school." So, No, they are no more different from all teenagers in this world barring the grey matter in the head department.

If people really want to know and stretch out the "differences" between College and the other 24 Oppidan houses, here's my list:

  1. The Food - This effectively is the most beneficial aspect to the individual boy throughout his entire career at Eton. The standard and quality of food at College can seriously embarrass that from the kitchen of a 5-star hotel's. I'm talking food rated Michelin-star here!

  2. The House - This is the only house located right smack in(side) the heart of the School and therefore, everything is within a stone's throw away. Boys will be especially grateful to enter the medieval front door within a minute or two after a grueling rugby match at the playing fields beside - no need to walk another half-a-mile to your house near the castle, for example.

  3. The Exterior - This may be medieval architecture but once inside, the house is thoroughly modern and up-to-date, catering for all modern day amenities and comforts including super-fast broadband connection to both intranet and Internet.

  4. Access to Chapel - All Collegers including the very youngest ones only attend the nearby College Chapel situated next door in the mornings as opposed to School Chapel further away near the music schools across the road which the youngest three blocks (years) of Oppidans attend due to limited spaces at the majestic College Chapel.

  5. Because College is a larger house compared to the other 24 Oppidan houses - 70 boys vs 50'ish - it therefore, has two of everything e.g. two assistant housemasters, two dames, etc but of course, only one housemaster, the Master-in-College.

  6. Visits & Parking - To the parents and guardians, this is perhaps the most significant advantage of having your sons at College. As you approach the School proper from the Slough Road, it is the little entrance on your left that you take and once inside you'll have literally acres and acres of open space - private Eton land, of course, - where you park your vehicle. The exact location also helps in a quick getaway after picking/dropping your sons - no need to jostle for parking spaces like they do at the cramped Oppidan houses.

  • But does anyone know what these ceremonial differences mentioned above are?
MrsPatmore · 03/10/2019 14:27

Mmm, we know one of the boys on the list - he is a natural statesman even at 13. I slightly regret not putting ds forward for this just to 'test the waters' as he was on a par academically with this boy (but, I must confess, didn't have as much social confidence). We unfortunately bowed to the 'who do you think you are' pressure. Hey ho...

Whattimedidyouseeherleave · 03/10/2019 15:13

Your post is very interesting @MrsPatmore . Did the pressure come from your prep school?

MrsPatmore · 03/10/2019 15:28

@Whattimedidyouseeherleave - no funnily enough. We would have been bursary candidates and the consensus from family and friends and my dh was that Eton was a 'step too far' (socially in particular). Boarding was the other issue as ds is shy and most definitely not an alpha male type. Looking back now though, the scholars College system would have suited him well - it seems the boys are quite cosseted! I'll be looking again for sixth form possibly.

Whattimedidyouseeherleave · 03/10/2019 16:11

That's such a shame @MrsPatmore. I hope your ds is happy at the school you decided on. You should also look at Winchester for 6th form.
Best of luck.

Sheetalsagarwal · 15/09/2023 19:51

Please could you share how your son prepared for the election. Any tips would be helpful. Thanks

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