Please or to access all these features

Add post

Watch this thread

Save thread

Start a new thread

Flip thread

Hide thread

My feed

Active Unanswered threads

Getting started FAQ's

Unanswered threads Acronyms Talk guidelines

Hide shortcut buttons

Talk

Education

Join the discussion on our Education forum.

Flip

1 2 3

Original poster

Update on the child promotion thread. We're seething

71 replies

northender · 03/10/2006 20:24

OK today ds has come home from school having spent the whole day in with Yr1 (meeting is not until tomorrow). He now thinks Reception is "boring".
I now know who the other children are and none of them are friends that he's talked about, in fact one is a boy who I've heard from ds and other parents is a bit of a bully. So much for social relationships being considered.
Any opinions would be welcome as dh and I are seething and have to face this meeting tomorrow morning with other parents who we suspect will be in favour of it.

OP posts:

bakedpotatooooowoooh · 04/10/2006 11:04

I think this is astonishing.
Have you rung chair of governors?
School sec should give you number.
Ours in this situation would be brilliant, I hope yours is.
I would not give up.
This thing about having to repeat year 3... wha-aat?
And ring LEA.
Don't write letters, this is too urgent.

QueenPeaHead · 04/10/2006 11:04

they can't put him up if yuo don't agree to it.
so don't agree to it.
simple as.

(well I know it isn't simple, it is v stressful etc and I appreciate that, but honestly if you say "no my child is remaining in his age-appropriate class" there is sweet FA they can do about it)

tiptoes · 04/10/2006 11:10

Hi northender-Don't feel downhearted.
Did you get the feeling the other parents were ok with this?

If you still feel uneasy about this speak to the LEA as others have suggested and also parent partnership in your area should be able to guide you.
As Queenpeahead said don't worry about coming across as a stroppy parent.
I pointed out in the meeting about my ds's placement with ds's head that I don't want to be known as a mother with a bad reputation in school for making a fuss but my DS comes first and I could not ignore my instincts and just allow this to happen.

It is not your DS's problem that they have got the numbers for the class sizes wrong so why should he suffer for it.

nettie · 04/10/2006 11:11

Foxinsocks the school are allowed to admit over 30, it depends on how many they're aloowed in each year group, no in each class.

Key stage 1 classes can't be bigger than 30, but some schools can admit upto 45, or 60 depending on what the LEA set them as a limit, you can't turn down a child if you have spaces in a year group.

Hope that makes it a bit clearier.

SoupDragon · 04/10/2006 11:12

"They will stay in the class ahead until Yr3 which they will repeat and rejoin their original class"

What a load of b*llocks" Just how bored is he going to be in Y3 when he has to repeat all the stuff he's learnt already?? DS1 is in Y3 and he's learning about Romans - if he were to repeat this year he'd have to do it all over again!

I would definitely refuse to let this happen to my child on that basis alone. They've screwed up but your child shouldn't suffer because of it.

foxinsocks · 04/10/2006 11:13

so if they admit 45, what do they do with the extra 15?

(dd and ds's school is a 3 class entry so year groups of 90 with 30 in each class)

foxinsocks · 04/10/2006 11:14

sorry, that was for nettie, just wondering!

I'm just amazed they were allowed to admit 35 in the first place - that means they knew the 5 would have to go into another year group but someone in the LEA must have given them to go ahead to do it that way.

SoupDragon · 04/10/2006 11:14

From a social point of view, he's partially bonded as a class with thereception year, will then fully bond with the year group above for 3 years and then be expected to bond with the original class again when he'll probably perceive them as being "babyish" What a pile of poo.

SoupDragon · 04/10/2006 11:16

foxinsocks, I wonder if they hoped 5 would drop out and there wouldn't be a problem. It does happen.

foxinsocks · 04/10/2006 11:19

mmm we are in London so maybe it is different here (as the LEA do all the admissions on a central basis) - so if you have 30 places, you send out 30 letters

it just sounds like (from her meeting) that they knew in advance they had 5 extra places in yr1 so filled them up with reception children

I can't see why they just didn't leave them open (the places).

Do they get funded per pupil? if so, it may be because of that.

SoupDragon · 04/10/2006 11:22

I agree FiS - I think they planned on shoving 5 of the new intake into Y1 right from the start. The "hoping 5 would drop out" thoery is the only one I can think of whereby it wasn't meant to happen.

Gobbledispook · 04/10/2006 11:24

I would just completely refuse. How can they make you agree to it? Can they honestly force you to accept it?

I would be absolutely livid.

If he was in a mixed class but still following the foundation stage curriculum I might be less bothered but I would not be happy about him having to actually repeat a year somewhere down the line.

Our school takes 70 so in infants there is one class that has 10 reception with 20 yr 1 children and then there is a class with 10 yr 1 and 20 yr 2. After that they are all same yr classes. No child repeats a year though. The mixed reception/yr 1 the reception children do foundation stage adn the yr 1's do yr 1 stuff.

nettie · 04/10/2006 11:24

Don't know!

Our fabulous new built school was built on the scale of 45 in a year group, we argued this number as stupid with the LEA, but they insisted it was right for the area and stuck with it.

We have some year groups that are full and others that have as low as 19 in them. Personally I put it down to a setting an absoulute legal limit on class sizes and giving parents more choice in schools. Schools hands are tied, its all bureacracy. Bloody Tony Blair ( Rant over)

Just to clarify not teacher or anything, just a parent governor and we've had a similar problem to this last year.

SoupDragon · 04/10/2006 11:27

What's wrong with setting an legal limit on class size and giving parents more choice in schools???

nettie · 04/10/2006 11:30

It causes problems like this.

You can have a perfectly nice class of 30 children, Joe bloggs decides he doesn't like the school his childs at and applies for aplace at your school, you have a year group limit of 45, so have to admit him, where do you put him, class is full?

CountessDracula · 04/10/2006 11:32

I really don't understand that

If you have only one class and the max class size is 30, how can you have a year group limit of 45?

gladbag · 04/10/2006 12:14

I'm feel so cross on your behalf, mainly because of the lack of consultation. If the class is going to be run properly as a mixed age class, with specific consideration made for the Reception children, then it might not be all bad, but if they entend to simply slot these Reception children into an established Y1 class, treating them as accelarated Reception children following a Y1 curriculum, then I'd be livid. It's such an important year, and hugely important for all Reception aged children, whatever their academic ability.

Possible questions to ask are...

Will the children still be following the Foundation Stage curriculum, with the teacher planning learning experiences from the Early Learning Goals (specifically designed for Reception aged children, and a statutory requirement and right).

Will their learning still be planned from each of the six Foundation Stage statutory areas (Personal, emotional and social, Creative development etc) with equal status given to each area, or will they be following National Curriculum schemes of work (History, Geography, Science etc designed for Y1)

Will they still have access to learning through play, with sand/water/role play etc available to them, and learning in an outdoor environment? Is the Y1 classroom properly resources with these things, and appropriate Reception equipment (construction stuff, puppets, puzzles etc)

How do the school plan to cover things like phonics and numeracy teaching, where the YR and Y1 children will be at different stages?

If it really is a 'done deal' then you need to make sure they are doing it properly. I hope you get some reassurance soon.

SoupDragon · 04/10/2006 12:33

nettie, that's not a problem with setting a limit on class size, that's something wrong with setting a ludicrous "year group" size. I assume that they are meant to have 45 children split between 2 classes or a proper mixed YR/Y1 class.

Original poster

northender · 04/10/2006 12:40

Sorry to clarify they are not going to be doing Yr1 curriculum and our main issues now are not the academic side (until you come to repeating Yr3 of course!) but how unsettling socially and emotionally it will be. When they originally sent the letter out it said they would be with yr1 am and rec pm but this morning they said Mon-Thurs yr1 and Fri reception. I then questioned what would happen in year 2 if it would be a 4/1 day split and they fudged it so I suspect there will be fewer links with their own class.
I can't thank everyone enough for all your comments and support so far. After reading what's been written this morning I feel justified in ringing the LEA and will do that this afternoon.
Just feel so that such an exciting time has been turned into such a stressful and upsetting time. Luckily ds seems fine throughout

OP posts:

frogs · 04/10/2006 12:42

I'm not sure the class limits for infants are statutory anyway. Dd1 was in a class of 32 throughout her time in the infants, and ds's class size has fluctuated between 31 and 33. The year group inbetween had 34 throughout.

Original poster

northender · 04/10/2006 12:45

The main problem seems to have been that the max size is different for infants and juniors ie 30 & 35 so the school has their "set" intake at 35 so they can get max funding at jr level and decide that if they get 30+ in an intake they'll then decide how to deal with the extras for 3 years. In this case because they knew there were only 25 in the next year they didn't have to think of any other options.

OP posts:

nettie · 04/10/2006 12:49

They are stautory, your breaking the law if you don't apply with them. I asked that question to the chair of governors, looked at me like a total idiot, I only wanted to clarify the point, because IMO its better to get a slapped wrist of OFSTED for having to many in a class than putting small groups of children in antoher year group and getting complaints from parents, but no can do class sizes are statutory.

Hope you get some answers from the LEA, Northernor.

nettie · 04/10/2006 12:50

Sorry I mean northender

edam · 04/10/2006 12:51

Northender, they may be trying to present this as a done deal but I think you do have the right to say 'no' and stop them in their tracks. Hope the LEA confirms this.

foxinsocks · 04/10/2006 13:17

in the end northender, they've done it for their convenience - so they have the max number of children they can have in the juniors and I'm assuming more funding because of it (i.e. more funding than if they had taken 30 children - I don't know for sure that it works that way).

It does not seem to me that at any time they have considered the impact on the children.

Flip

1 2 3

Swipe left for the next trending thread