Why is private education so taboo now?

[DoMyBest]

When I was younger I was privately educated as were most of my friends. Now we all have children and almost all of them have decided to send their children to state schools. Whilst for most of them it was a question of money, for others it really wasn't: they believe that every child should have the same educational opportunities and if parents like them start giving their kids exclusive treatment then the system won't work. Some of these parents chose local 'outstanding' state schools, but one couple with enough money to buy every private school in town admirably chose their worst local state school and work hard to improve it.

I listen to these stories with interest, sometimes admiration but mostly respect for their choices & views.

So it's with some alarm, now we have chosen a private school for our son, do discover the hatred this decision engenders. Private education has, it would seem, become taboo.

So here's my question: is it morally right for people to get angry with parents who privately educate their children?

[DoMyBest]

Wordfactory, interesting answer one mother gave me for choosing state over private (which she could afford) was admirably honest: 'I don't want to sound like a pushy mum, but they stand a better chance of gettingvinto oxbridge if they've been at a state school'. She was nevertheless kind enough not to judge me on my choice of private.

[rabbitstew]

middleclassonbursary - that's amazing. I would have thought going from Malaysian peasant-class to Ivy League educated professional class in one generation would be considered highly remarkable by any standards, English, American or Malaysian, and a teensy bit ridiculous to hold that up as achievable by the overwhelming majority of the world population, or to hold it against the rest of the world population for failing to achieve it.

[DoMyBest]

HolidayCriminal, I understand why you might guess I'm bragging about my kids going to private schools (otherwise why would people react so angrilly, right?!). But I only tell them if they specifically ask, and then almost apologetically (which am not proud of, but as I said private education seems to be more taboo now than ever).

[rabbitstew]

(achievable for)

[rockybalboa]

No, it's not taboo but does unfortunately give rise to a strangely blinkered attitude in some of those who decide to privately educate. My god-daughter is going to private school. Her mother sought my opinion about what sort of bike to buy her. I suggested Isla Bike and said lots of children at DC's (state) school have them as do we and many friends. Friend actually said "what, people who send their children to state school buy £300 bikes for their children?" with a look of utter disbelief on her face. I changed the subject before I said something rude.

[redskyatnight]

You could equally ask if it is morally right for people to get angry with parents who choose state schools for their children.

Because I've experienced that attitude. (mostly notably from DParents who seem to consider my sending the DC to state school to be akin to child abuse).

[middlescallonbursary]

rabbit maybe exceptional but I assure you that's what they've done they see education as the only route out of grinding poverty. I agree it's not possible for all to do it to this level but my point is that we need the best in all fields to aim for, to show how things can be done and that aspiration and dedication is not money dependent.
The culture for many in countries like Malaysia is to achieve what ever your circumstances.

[HolidayCriminal]

Actually, if you want me to guess (and it is guessing, I don't know you from Eve), I wondered if you were saying horrible things about state ed, or unkind things about the sort of parents who would send their children to state schools, or how you wouldn't touch your local state school with a barge pole, or how you want your children to avoid plebs (I could go on).

So not bragging, more like snobbery.

[boomoohoo]

Op in answer to your question, yes it is 'morally right' to express yourself if u feel strongly about something. If you feel attacked though pull the people up on it, tell them u feel judged / whatever. Or, distance yourself from people that have different politics and ideals than u.

[boomoohoo]

Middle - but you get that we all don't start from the same place, have the same opportunities, don't you? You only have to look at the backgrounds of the Oxbridge attendees to see that

[rabbitstew]

So, the burning question, DoMyBest. Why have you chosen a private school for your ds?

[middleclassonbursary]

boom of course I get it but you stated up thread that a certain "level of competition" is what wrong with the world and causes mental health problems. I think excellence be it independent schools, horse riding, sewing or in all other works of life sets a gold standard that we can all that's all as in institutions and individuals, admire, aim for, adapt to our circumstances learn from and be inspired by. Therefore we need the elite.
You accuse me of being middle class in my outlook and experiences fair enough but anyone can have dedication and aspiration what ever their back ground it's one of the few things in life that are free.
My worry is that unlike independent schools some state schools have low aspirations for many of their pupils, especially those from disadvantaged background and as a governor of two schools this was my experience.

[DoMyBest]

Rabbitstew (great name) that's a whole different debate which I'd rather not get drawn in on for fear of being lynched :)

[rabbitstew]

Spoil sport.

[Playfortoday]

I think OP you also have to recognise that you're implicitly judging the state schools as 'not good enough' for your child which your friends might rankle against. I'm sure you don't do it deliberately, necessarily, but it feels very undermining to those who feel that the local school is good enough for their children.

My neighbour told me there was no point looking round the primary that my children go to 'because it's an inner city state school'. I asked her what she meant by that and she got arsey and said who was I to judge her for her choices. She didn't see that I felt she was judging my choices by saying that the school she could see from her window wasn't even worth spending an hour looking round because it was clearly so crap.

When private school using parents say things like 'we had to go private because my child's just so bright/sensitive/talented' you must see that it might come across a little badly. They are judging just as much as being judged.

[Xpatmama88]

Boom, even people starts at the same place, have the same opportunities, but the most important point you missed is ability. You can't assume everyone has the same abilities. I hope to believe Oxbridge attendees have the high standard and ability they needed to succeed in their courses, and the selection process by the tutors are fair.
We choose to sent our DCs to top independent school ( very selective one) because they have abilities that other schools find it difficult to accommodate. My DD started reading at 3 in her little nursery school, and off to our local CoE school at 4 1/2, she was reading the highest brand book in the classroom, the teacher and classroom assistant just bemused, and did not know what to do with her whereas most of the other children in class were still learning their A, B, C.
We were lucky in a way as DH was offered a job overseas, so we took the opportunity, we were able to experience education system in Far East, and then we noticed the different, the high standard, and students could learn at their own pace. She did well, always top in her class.
When we returned to UK we chose to send her to one of the very well known selective independent school, just to see whether she had the ability to get in, through 6 hours entrance exams (she was 9 then). She got in, when she was there, I then realised the standard was so high, I'm pleased she could mix with group of girls who had similar ability as her.
Many years later, seeing her gaining a 1st, and on her way to a medical career, what can I say? I'm sure other people will say she will do as well if she goes to other school, but we can't see in a parallel universe if that really happen! And is my child future, I will not take a bet on that.

[Crosseyedcat]

Playfortoday - on the other hand you get people saying that they wouldn't send their child to X school because everyone is stuck up/snobbish etc etc [also not OK??]

[areyoutheregoditsmemargaret]

Private schools used to be relatively affordable, now they're not. So the middle classes are bigging up the state system, because they have no other choice. Which is a good thing. However, OP, you're perfectly entitled to your choice, whyever you made it, so ignore the "haters" and it'll all die down.

[DoMyBest]

Playgortoday, I understand that patronising comments about how private schools are better would annoy people (I don't do that). But I wonder if the argument about parents feeling 'implicitly' that a decision to send a child to private undermines state can't be taken further: if a parent buys a child a state of the art bicycle does that implicitely undermine another parent's choice to buy a cheaper one? And does that give the parents of the cheaper bike the right to get angry about the more expensive model? Especially if they believe the cheaper model's just as good, if not better? And (taking the argument further) why do we care what choices others make (be it for their children, or not)? I'm curious, interested in others' choices. But, fundamentally, its their life, their family, their decision isn't it?

[Taz1212]

Private education is definitely taboo in my little world. DH and his extended family are completely against it and whilst DH has come round to my the decision to go private, his family can't seem to resist making little digs at every opportunity.

What I have found very bizarre is the attitudes of other mothers in the playground. DD is still at a state school and as soon as we made the decision to go private for DS, loads of people changed around me. I mostly keep to myself. However over the past year I have on the one hand had some people make verbal negative comments to me, but at the same time there are mothers who suddenly find me very appealing as a potential friend and want to talk about DS' school all the time! It's all very strange. I'm no different and it seems so oddly important to some people.

[JaneinReading]

It's the other way round around here. No one on our road sends children to state schools. it's unheard of. Same in our family - all we siblings only ever went to private schools and all 9 cousins in the next generation go to or went to private schools only.

Also it's morally wrong to pick a state school if you could afford to pay or get off your bottom and get a job to earn the fees. If you don't pay when you could you are stealing money from the mouths of the poor. It is morally wrong to take a state school place you don't need. The moral high ground is with the private school parents and by the way it is not true that state schoolers find it easier to get good university places. 50% of Oxbridge places go to privates whereas only 8% of children are at private schools.

[pointythings]

I think it's incredibly rude to judge people on their choice of school. I'm one of those who wouldn't send their children private even if we won the Lottery - but if our schools were really dire I would home ed, so would still be opting out and choosing to be judged by those who are so inclined. In an ideal world we would have a system where everyone could have access to a good education irrespective of wealth, but that isn't the world we live in. I don't think you can change a dire school from the inside. Apparently success at school depends on parental involvement, so supportive parents with a child at an awful school would be able to help their child reach their potential, but to think that a whole school culture can be changed by parents strikes me as a bit naive.

[DoMyBest]

JaneinReading that's the first time I've heard the argument that if you could afford private you are morally obliged not to go state or you're stealing 'from the mouths of the poor'. It's an interesting argument, but doesn't it make those who have the choice to go private (via burseries or not) damned if they do (stealing a place from someone who needs it more) damned if they don't (reinforcing elitism and innequality)?

[Mintyy]

I laughed out loud at JaneinReading.