How exactly do you know that your DC should go to grammar school?

[plus3]

Sorry for the ridiculous question, but I am going slightly bonkers.

DS is in yr 4 and has unspecified learning difficulties - mainly with attention and processing instructions. He is bright & remembers incredibly well. Literacy & science are his favourite subjects, and thinks he struggles with Maths but is actually above average. He craves structure and routine

My problem is that I am aware of some children in his class already doing extra work out of school (such as explore & kumon etc) and I now feel like I am letting him down hugely.

Should we be jumping on the treadmill of extra work etc to give him an even playing field? I don't really believe in excesses coaching to pass the 11+

So how do we tell if Grammer could be the place for him? When I have spoken to school, they always imply that academically he will be fine (whatever that means)

Sorry if this long & rambling, it all seems so very competitive around here (Bucks) thanks.

[plus3]

alcofrolic am feeling slightly less insane about it now!
LaQueen exactly - it is the whole,yes they are quite clever, but is that enough? Having not been to Grammar school myself, I have no point of reference. But also, they are so young. My attitude to education changed in transition from primary to secondary. I went from enjoying school to loving it academically. Who knows? If I was under huge pressure at a Grammar it may have been different.

[TalkinPeace2]

LaQueen
hmmm, that is a tricky situation for you.
In an area with good comps they could both thrive in the same school -
but if you are in a grammar area I assume you'll have to either fit a square peg into a round hole, or pray that the secondary modern (for that is what the other schools truly are) will have enough to stimulate her ....

[alcofrolic]

All depends on the catchment secondary modern talking......

(... which is why, on one hand, I was pleased that ds got into a grammar school, whilst on the other, as an arty, dreamy, virtually comatose child, it didn't really suit him (or his teachers) at all!) Thank goodness all that's over!

[seeker]

At grammar school, the expectation is that you will not get Cs at GCSE. yYou need to think whether this is the sort of expectation that would suit your dd.

[breadandbutterfly]

If you have a child who enjoys academic challenges they will relish being with other bright kids and being given harder work as they would get at a grammar school. It's a fairly good indication, I think, if they enjoy doing practice VR/NVR papers etc - if they view this as fun, then the chances are they're the kind of kid who'll enjoy grammar schools - if they can't be arsed, and have no interest in learning new stuff, then it might not be for them?

[breadandbutterfly]

The danger with a bright but unmotivated kid at a comp, even a good one, is that they will not have the 'push' from the school nor the iner motivation so simply fail to achieve what they are capable of - my dh falls into this category.

[WinterStepThisWay]

breadandbutterfly you have just described my DS. However, we have just moved to Kent and I'm finding it impossible to find a tutor as nobody will share what they know with a newcomer.

[TalkinPeace2]

breadandbutterfly
that somewhat depends on the comp - some I know of realise that bright but lazy kids can result in belting VA scores ....

[alcofrolic]

bread I think it's a misconception that GSs 'push' children. Fairly bright children land on the threshold in Y7 and achieve 99% A-C grades (no surprise there). As they have creamed off 30% of the brightest children in the area, grammar schools can be fairly complacent about achieving their results.

I wonder how they'll fare against the new Ofsted framework which focusses on progress, not attainment.

[breadandbutterfly]

True, Talkin, - but do these comps exist in Bucks alongside grammars?

Winter - you really don't need a tutor - this is aimed at 11 year olds - youcan tutor just fine yourself.

[TalkinPeace2]

VA at grammars is often not great
and when DH has worked at them, the staff comment to him that at least half the kids are not really up to it but were tutored through the test

[Yellowtip]

Well I've always just entered all of my DC into the test without overthinking it - or at least with thinking that if they do get in, they should be fine. My DC have very different approaches to work and are clearly of different ability academically, but I'm not prepared to cut off a chance by being too precious. I just don't get that grammars are hugely pressurizing - maybe I'm wrong. I think it's mostly parents who are guilty of that.

[alcofrolic]

How true talking. A local grammar has a remedial maths group. (11+ is VR.)

It's such an unfair system, becoming more and more dependent on parents being able to pay for tutors, because otherwise (to paraphrase plus), they 'feel like they are letting their children down hugely'.

[TalkinPeace2]

LaQueen
I'm lucky DD is uber motivated, DS is not - I can avoid comparing them because of the sex thing
and as we live in a comp county its never been an issue

alcofrolic
sadly Grammars as they now exist are a nasty MC ghetto of tutored kids - NOT the egalitarian driver of social mobility that Daily Telegraph readers remember them!

[Yellowtip]

Talkin what exactly is your personal experience of contemporary grammars? Are your DC at one? Do you teach at one? Are you a governor of one? Have you recently been educated at one?

'a nasty MC ghetto of tutored kids' indeed. That is not a universal truth, that's for sure.

[Yellowtip]

LaQueen tutoring already competent kids simply means the parents are burning their money.

[TalkinPeace2]

LaQueen
not just round you .... DH goes to over 100 schools a year all over the UK of every type
his views of grammar schools are unprintable

we bought a house in the catchment of a dire school, but were able to send our kids to the next comp along
if we'd turned out to be in a grammar area I suspect we WOULD have moved