Steiner Schools? Any experience of them?

[Pastarito]

I am about to move house and I'm looking at schools for my two boys, 7 and 3.5.

I am considering the idea of a steiner school. Does anyone have their kids in steiner schools and if so, how is it?

My experience of schools and national ciriculum so far has been a bit mixed. DD1 goes to a supposedly good school in West London but I feel it doesn't cater for his learning style (quite touchy feely, very active/fidgety, gets concepts early but unable to transfer this in practise to his schoolwork etc). DS2 looks like he is developing in a similar way minus the fidgeting but he is young for his year group which brings other problems.

Any advice?

My cousin's children are at a Steiner school, but in Germany, where it is more of a mainstream option. Having spent quite a lot of time with them, I have become much more sceptical about the whole Steiner system.

There is quite a strong philosophy behind it which powerfully informs the teaching but which they are not particularly upfront about, so it is definitely worth doing your homework to make sure you're happy with that.

My nephews are bright little boys who were (IMO) disadvantaged by the fact that at age 8 they were unable to read, nor were allowed videos or audio tapes, or given alternative kinds of mental stimulation. Compared with my own kids and their classmates at their (not terribly middleclass) primary school, the steiner kids came across as impulsive, immature and quite aggressive.

I have also found that Steiner kids' artwork tends to be very 'samey' and recogniseably steiner in style, which makes me wonder about the so-called creativity at Steiner schools. By my nephews' accounts, a lot of the work they do involves copying the teacher's drawings or writing off the board hardly nurturing their inner creativity! There are also various rules about eg. different colours having different properties my nephews have refused to use the colour black because it is unnatural (apparently).

I know many people have good experiences of Steiner, but personally I wouldn't touch it with a ten-foot pole for a child of average or above ability unless I had exhausted all other options. If you do want to go ahead, make sure you do your research. \link{http://www.waldorfcritics.org/\This} is a website which collates various criticisms that people have made of the Steiner-Waldorf system.

thanks sibdoms and getback. Will look at the 3 local(ish) ones.

Mind you that website looks as barking as some of the more extreme Steiner views. It's a bit um patriotic (??!)

malory - norse gods for 7 yrs! wow.
my side of the family is pretty barking - might push ds 's over the edge! Will do my research but I find MN very useful.

Hi,
I think it depends on the child whether the reading & writing . My son who's almost 5 is asking me to write words for him, and attempting it for himself, so in my case might be a bad thing, and hold him back from what he naturally wants to learn.
Frogs is spot on too about the art work looking samey- it does all have a similar style to it.
Colours have a huge impact yes- steiner believes the colour a child choses depicts their personality ( my ds1 is a red- impulsive fiery, strong willed and confident).
Its fairy expensive too.
Look at different schools and their ethos- they do differ and some are weirder than others !! :)
About the teacher training, they are qualified teachers, that have done additional waldorf steiner training.
Good Luck with it- theres lots to learn.
MV

I agree with frogs completely (also having second-hand experience of the Steiner system). Particularly being so late at teaching them to read just seems mad now that I have a 6 year old who adores books and gets so much out of them. Why would depriving her of this be beneficial?
And yes, the art work all seems to have to comply to anthroposophical rules and it all looks the same.
The schools (in Germany at least) are also extremely authoritarian, with very large classes (this is according to my mum who is a director of education responsible for primary schools).

I remember being friends with anthroposophical children on holiday when I was 8 - the boy was highly agressive and the girl, who was about 14 at the time, was reading the same books as me.

They won't play competitive sports either. No football might be an issue for some. Apparently, God didn't give you feet to kick...

I don't like the artwork either. Very samey.

The 11 year old I know has only recently started to go to school full time too

MT - the Norse gods made me smile. I have heard about them. Did he make a lot of apple pies too?

And stained glass artwork ? :o

I was a teacher back in Nz and a couple of girls from the local Steiner school came into my class at 11 years old.

They were both lovely, polite girls, very good at Art and creative subjects but their reading, writing and maths were FAR below the standard of the most of the children, who had a wide range of academic ability.

They struggled to catch up and in the end I had to recommend private tutoring for them. It was a shame as their self-esteem suffered needlessly. They were both bright, but the gaps in their learning were just too big, by that stage, to cope with a mainstream school without lots of extra tuition.

They were extremely creative and imaginative though, which was fabulous.

Hello Pastarito.

I have not read the whole thread but thought I'd better tell you my experience. I have a handicapped older brother, who goes to a Steiner community and I cannot fault them. However as regards Steiner schools I think you have to be very careful.

For a start, as one person at least mentioned, you do often end up with the same class teacher for 4 years or more and if you should happen not to get on with them there appears to be very little that can be done about it.

More importantly, while on a primary level it may be ideal, the sad truth is that the Steiner ethos runs contrary to the mainstream and I have known some very angry and resentful teenagers who have been sent to these schools. They feel "behind" their contemporaries and feel "different", which as you can imagine, for a teenager (and these days younger children) is the worst thing imaginable. They are also perceived as different by their peers who go to "normal" schools. It's kind of like being brave enough to give your kid a really weird name - while the system in itself may be perfect, how will the children in it deal with the wider community of which it is not a part? One girl I knew insisted her parents move her to a mainstream school but her anger at being made to go to a Steiner school has never really let up.

Just some food for thought!

In Italy they have the same class teacher for the whole of their primary education (or so my dh says. Dh swears by this and was horrified when he saw that over here the teacher changes every year.

It is a bit concerning that the kids you taught are below their peers in reading, maths and english, tango. I imagined that learning to read later meant that it just didn't take as long to go through the learning stage.

It has taken my ds1 from reception to yr2 to get to ORT stage 10 and into 'proper' reading for pleasure and I understand that on the continent where in some countries they teach reading later, they learn faster and reach the same level as our 7 yr olds in just 6 months. (But on the other hand I also know the argument about English being a more complex language to learn to read than say German or Italian).

Still, why would kids at Steiner schools be behind in maths?

At our local steiner school kids have the same teacher for all of their primary education - one look at the teacher DS1 would have had and it was a definite no-no. I also thought that if you didn't life the lifestyle it would be hard for your kids - the disgust/distain on the face of the woman showing us round when I asked about computers would have been funny if I hadn't thought it showed real ignorance. I personally feel that we have to help our children cope as best they can in the world in which they live - we should educate the whole child for the real world, not a world that existed years ago. I did eventually send DS1 to an "alternative" school which had lots of pros and cons, but Steiner definitely wasn't for us.

I have a friend who sent his son to a steiner school 2 years ago. Since then his financial circumstances have changed a lot and he and his girlfriend really struggle to cover the school fees. Because he's been there 2 years, though, he's behind where he'd be in an ordinary school and they don't feel they can move him because of the harm it will cause. That said he is turning into a very articulate and confident little boy who will happily start a conversation with anyone regardless of how old they are.

Just wanted to add that the curriculum is spread out more, so some weeks he goes to school on a Saturday. He also finishes at different times on different days so childcare has been a bit of a 'mare for them to organise.

Good for 'special needs' kids.

My friend has a child who is not quite statemented, but near it. Could not cope in mainstream school, but is fine at Steiner school.

Agree from secondhand experience that if you think you might move them back into a mainstream school at some stage it can cause a lot of difficulties. Probably works best if the child has been immersed in the whole Steiner ethos from an early age and therefore doesn't hanker after tv, computers, plastic toys, etc. Re the reading age, a relative who knows a lot about this topic says that there is a lot of research to show if you don't teach a child to read until they are 7, they learn faster. However, as an avid early reader, I would hate to deprive a child of the pleasure of reading at an earlier age, just because of the philosophy of some guy who lived a long time ago... Also don't agree with the blanket ban on plastic toys - what's wrong with lego??

I can only comment from the other side as have no experience of Steiner. My ds is 6 and he goes to a Catholic school, although we are not Catholic, this is a very good school. I think you have to keep your options open and look at and research as many as possible. I am sure you will make your decision based on which school suits the children most.
My friend is German and they don't start school until 7. I agree with this in some ways as my lad is energetic to day the least! However, he is a clever little thing and his reading has really taken off. He still complains that school is boring though!! Unfortunately, sometimes it is hard when the teacher is changing year by year as they don't always bond.It would be awful if they didn't like the teacher and were stuck with them for 7 years! He is still very confident and will equally converse with all ages.
All children are different and will learn at their own pace, so as long as you feel your school is supporting and nurturing your child, thats the most important thing.
Good luck

Hi
I have looked at a stiener school for my son who is currently just two. We had been looking for a playgroup which they have there and ideally wanted a playgroup that would lead on to a school so h could move with some friends. However whilst I love the idea of him developing his creativity and social skills in the early years we just did not like the teacher. Instead we have found a local pre-school which teaches through play and experince with no signs of worksheets or testing.

I am still open minded about whether to send him to the kindergarten at four instead of mainstream school as I belive four is too yung to start a formal sit down education. I have cared for children who have given up learning at the age of five because they say they can't do it.

I too am concerned that it is all based on one blokes ideas a hundred years ago as some of them seem very wacky. I just wish this sort of schooling was available without the wackyness or religious side to it.

The school we visted had quite small classes so this wasn't a concern.

does anyone know of a website or a resource of alternative schooling in the uk? im keen to start researching even tho ds is only 4 months...sounds ridiculous i know but i just dont trust mainstream education to fulfil kids' potential.
px