Help!!! Anyone else out there with VERY bright children????

[Bafreem]

Hi
I have a 4 yr old (D.O.B.14.11.02) that can read,write (basically), swim without assistance,learning French (rapidly), ride ponies, beat me at chess and asks questions like "what makes the street lights turn on and off?" "If space goes on forever, what is beyond that?" "what is soil made of, because plants can grow in it and we can't ?"
My 2 yr old can count to 15 and knows all the alphabet/colours/animals etc. can jump and hop on either leg. (D.O.B.28.1.04)
I also have another....Crawling at six months and already using 'sign' to say hungrey/thirsty/attention required...

*hhelllpp!!! - anyone out there with the same???
Help required regarding state schooling, keeping them occupied and particulary, integration with other children.
cheers
Bafreem ( nickname is what my daughter called me before she could prenounce catherine or mummy!):

About 12 years ago Tots TV was good for this (Is it on currently?) My preschoolers learnt how streetlamps work, how things grow and many more exciting facts. And as Tilly was French, they even leartn it bilingually.

Yes, Tots TV is on Cbeebies channel atm, or videos are very cheap if you can be bothered to scour car boot sales/ebay/charity shops.

I HATE that French-speaking puppet! I switch it off when it comes on and mutter swear words in Spanish.

Oh, we pick up our Spanish from Barney the dinosaur! Multilingual lot my kids.

Piffle, what has made me furious over the last few years is that while ds has been stretched academically (most of the time) he was expected to have the physical, organisational and social skills of the children that were with him, or as one teacher said to me, 'we have special needs support for dspraxic children, but your child can hardly be described as having special needs, can he?'

While I am keep to see G and T children supported, I wouldn't want them to get support that had been set asside for children with SEN. There is little enough provision for them as it is, and any that comes as a result in a SEN statement should go to the statemented child....as a point of law. the provision for that child is a legal requirement

My dd could read and write by the time she was 3.5yrs. She really was astounding. Mostly, this was down to her being seriously poorly and spending much of her first 3 years in and out of hospital, so the times she was cinfined to bed, I read to her. She was assessed by her nursery school at age 4 and shown to have a reading age of 7.8 iirc.

MB is right - in my dd's case she has levelled off. She is now 14 and about to choose her options. She is still exceptional at English, always has been but struggles with maths. According to her teachers she is above average but not really exceptional anymore at anything else. If she wants to do well at something, she has to revise and work hard. Up until about the age of 10, she did brilliantly at everything without even breaking sweat.

It dismays me that parents can't talk about their kids being bright without having the piss ripped out of them or others looking down their noses at them. It isn't always about boasting - it's about getting the best out of your child, and just because they are at the other end of the SN spectrum, doesn't mean they don't have educational needs that need meeting.

I always had to push for more/harder work for my dd when she was younger - now it's all I can do to get her face out of mtv.

Quite a good point MartianBishop.
I have a 3yr old dd who gets extensive DEN support for her condition (Noonan Syndrome) which I am eternally grateful for and appreciate beyond belief.
It should also run however that provisoin is able to be afforded for all special educational needs. I really had enormous problems at two of my ds's 3 primary schools for their lack of provision for even able students let alone any child that was G+T.
I do concede that many bright children learn more easily and that SEN children often do not, and even other children learn at a slower rate and deserve as much input and support to keep them on the learning range as bright kids deserve to be extended.
It's a bit of a never ending circle of focussing of short resources though
Tbh I took on most of the work myself to extend ds. Now at grammar school, I can sit back as they are making him do as mucha s he needs
I could talk for hours but I'm going out for dinner
Hoorah

I have a boy with Noonans syndrome in my A level biology group piffle. He took a year off for some surgery and is finishing this year....smashing kid.

Hope you have a wonderful night out

martianbishop, I absolutely wasn't suggesting that any SEN resource should have been available for my son, of course not! All I meant was that when he was criticised for (for example) poor presentation and handwriting for the 66th time, I pointed out that he was struggling as a lefthander and to get down everything in his head, that's when I got told that no allowances would be made for him, and no help given. I think (in fact, I know) that the teacher thought that we had had him moved up a year, when in fact it was done in his first week of reception after baseline assessment and presented to us newbie school parents as a fait accompli. Now I think it was done because it was easier to teach him that way, and to hell with the social consequences for him, but that's just my view!

Sorry sorry sorry everyone, always difficult to avoid a rant on sensitive subjects! -

All children should be supported, trouble is you have 30 in the class and you end up teaching to the middle

Shouldn't happen, but it does.

"we have special needs support for dspraxic children, but your child can hardly be described as having special needs, can he?'

Notoriously difficult to get the SN of a dyspraxic child met. I've come across a suicidal dyspraxic child (whilst teaching) because she couldn't get support. Yes, support the bright able children as well, but don't assume that children with SN get their needs met just like that- the majority in mainstream schools do not.

just offhand Jimjams I cannot think of a single child on the SEN reg for dyspraxia alone. I know it is often a co-morbid condition, but even so, it makes you think....

My DS has dyspraxia etc etfc

He is also G & T in English

And someone told me today he has double ended SEN

Having G & T needs and Dyspraxic needs

She said there are several cases she has seen of children being missed

And only one side of the scale met

The student I knew with dyspraxia made me so She needed her parents to fight and complain and they couldn't/wouldn't. TBH Call I think if schools were generally good at meeting the needs of dyspraxic children then your son would benefit as well as they could provide the same sort of help instinctively. Help for dyspraxia doesn't have to be pricey laptops it can be far simpler than that (and prob more effective). DS2 is (I think) left handed (and cack handed to boot) so we'll have all of this.

Often the case for things like AS as well Kanga- I know a very hf child who has gone in one term from doing quite well at school to a school refuser (she is attending for about 20 minutes atm kicking and screaming) Why? Change of SENCO who decided (single handedly and against all advice) to withdraw her support and make her 'independent'. That's progress. Makes me so

That is awful jimjams

DS does well at school acedemically apart from his slow processing

He is about to change to senior in sept, and it is same school DH teaches at, and the SENCO there is deffo brill

He is left handed and he has got a pen that helps with grip, as he has a strange grip of the thumb over the index finger

The organisation of senior school is going to be hard, with different books and classrooms

The physical and social side is going to be hardest just hoping there will be others like him and all his eccentric ways etc. And some of them not be co-ordinated

getbakin, you are SO right; ds is as uncoordinated physically as the two dyspraxic children who were in his year (we have changed schools now), even to the point that he can't kick a ball because he changes his mind about the foot half way through! But because he was always at the top academically, it has always been suggested that his problems are simply because he is cack handed and immature: in other words he should be showing other processing difficulties. But it doesn't seem fair that there are skills out there that would have /could have helped him improve that he doesn't have access to iyswim. I do appreciate that in the great scheme of things I don't have much to worry about, but one year ago I had a suicidal 11 year old throwing himself down a flight of stairs because he was so isolated at school, and I do feel that sometimes only lip service is paid to these children.

I agree callme with the things your son should be able to access- the only thing I disagree with is your belief that there are services easily available for dyspraxic (non gifted for want of a better word) children.

My son's SN are well and truly met, but that's because he's in a SLD/PMLD school with a very active PTA (helps with resourcing problems- the PTA has just refurbished the hydrotherapy pool for example, not the LEA, the PTA pays for the weekly trips into the community for the kids and cooking classes (both extremely important) not the LEA etc etc). My friend's with children who are high functioning but with SN and say statements are in many cases not having their needs met at all. My friend's child has a statement specifying 0.8 help- and yet the school has made a complete pigs ear of meeting her needs.

Yes the needs of all children should be met- I just meant its a misconcpetion that the needs of children with SN are met- in mainstream they are often not, nowhere near, whether recognised officially or not.

When my son was in mainstream he had a statement specifiying 6 visits of SALT a term- he recieved something like 3 in one year. The statement was meant to be a legal document- wasn't worth the paper it was written on when trying to access services.

actually that's not quite true- it was worth having the statement because after I threatened the LEA with the local govt obudsmen they agreed to fund ds1's private SALT to attend school, but that was a battle, and before that there had been a battle to ensure that SALT was in parts 2 and 3 of the statement (if it hadn't of been it wouldn't have secured any services at all). Help isn't easy to access in schools whether its for SN or G and T.

But I wasn't saying that there were services easily available for dyspraxic children, I was quoting a teacher at that particular school, where there was, and is a very extensive and well funded programme for dyspraxic children, including laptops and exam support. I am not stupid enough to believe that that level of support is the norm.

Exam support is usually 25% extra time and is easy to get for all sorts of things (private ed psychs report will do it usually- cynical? Moi?- used to be an exams officer and there was no distinction made between those who really needed extra time and those who didn't - that whole thing was a joke).

I'm never sure that the laptop thing is that great a help tbh.

I wasn't trying to say you were stupid- just pointing out that the supposed povision of resources (6 visits term of SALT sepcified in statemnt/0.8 in s statement in a friends case/ laptops whatever) often doesn't translate into actual useful support.

Bafreem

Hello

I think its important to allow children whatever their intelligence to just be kids as lomg as possible. Clever should be encouraged to play with children their own age, education is not everything. life skills are also just as important, being able to socialise with others etc.

I dont agree with pushing clever kids to sit exmas early etc. where does this get them? it separates them from others their age which is not always a good thing.

although it is important that they are stimulated and not bored at nursry and school. but alot of preschools work on children at different stages and you will find in one nursery all the two year olds will be doing activities suited to their needs.

you could maybe have a meeting with your nursery and school to make sure the teachers are doing this and your children could do ther activities outside school too but remember to allow them free time to relax and chill out where they do not have to perform, do not make a big deal about how clever they are or bring it to their attention too much, this could have a negative impact on their personalities andmakie mixing with other children different especially if they feel and are told they are superior. you can tell them they are special but so are all children in different ways.

my little girl could count to 20 at 2 in a couple of languages, she can recite lots of things as she has a fantastic memory. she has also asked me unanswerable questions since the age of two but it does not make me want to research into her further education.

my advice is to relax about it all.

your children are obviously doing great by themselves.

excuse all typing errors

tired and ill... must sleep