Positive examples of co parenting

[Boudiccabitch]

Hi, husband and I are having real difficulties as a couple. We always have had to work at it and in a lot of ways we're incompatible. We still can get on in some ways. We have two young children.
Sometimes I think that we could split and be friends. Do after school dinners, holidays, Christmas and birthdays as a family.
I want to know if this is doable or completely unrealistic. I know people get new partners and this can make things difficult.
All opinions and examples welcome.

Yes, thank you for this post and highlighting lots to me. I appreciate he would also need to he his real base. And he would also have his time with them. I would just want it to free and open the idea of spending time together.
Othe posts say this would be confusing. But if he had his protected time, I had mine, but we both still collaborated on the family as a whole. Even though we have hard times, we are a good team and seem to agree on parenting most of the time.
Surely its less confusing that children have time spent as a loving family unit sometimes but mum and dad are just friends now. Surely that makes more sense than mum and dad used to be together but now they no longer see each other and the kid's lives are split in two?

I think you are unable to be realistic just now because you are not experiencing what divorce and separation is. It entails emotional separation from your partner and you are no longer on the same team. You can’t count on him seeing things your way once you have split. You cannot know how you yourself will feel after a split. A divorce is painful and sore and you can’t agree strict guidelines prior to it and assume they will be obediently followed.

I now have a good divorce. But it was painful getting here. You might be amazed and hurt that he moves on too fast, finds a new partner and what he wants changes. Very few people would want to spend their precious holiday allowance with the person they find unliveable with and have chosen to divorce from three years after having divorced. Few people would choose to have no new relationships and not move on so they can hang out with the person who has rejected them as a life partner. It’s just not realistic. Planning divorce is different from living it. You can’t plan the outcome. You need to go in with an open mind and know that both of you will change throughout the process but but you’ll both keep your kids at the forefront and do everything you can to make things good for them.

Every kid hopes for their parents to get back together. My coparenting relationship is very high conflict, after an abusive relationship... my 6 year old still wishes his parents coukd get back together and live together. Very normal for kids, even though my eldest remembers how awful it was. And he is told frequently by his dad that dad can't stand mum, we do not talk in front of the kids at all (awful i know).

So the two women I mention said you need to have a change in boundaries for a long term positive relationship. If the only thing that changes is the living arrangements, words alone aren't always going to speak to a child's wishes. Also, the friction of when changes happen when a new partner joins the situation can really affect the kids and cause resentment for them with the new partner.

Most people have said the same thing about what makes a good co parenting relationship. It is both space and boundaries.

When you split you will stop being one family and become 2 families. Your children will be at the centre of both families and the extent to which you intersect will need to be mutually agreed. But your family form will have changed and the way both families function will diverge.

The whole point of ending a relationship, which is painful and expensive, is that you have the autonomy to decide where to eat, go on holiday and who you spend Christmas with. That won’t include accommodating the preferences of someone who is incompatible with you.

What you are proposing is just not a thing. It does sound weirdly intrusive and controlling and is most likely to cause conflict and acrimony when it doesn’t work.

Ok I understand. Just one thing gets to me, when you say you're not on the same team. I don't get this because surely you should always be on the same team regarding your children. In agreement with most things. The foundations of your parenting should not be shaken. Nothing terrible has happened between us, we have always been united in parenting. Why does that have to change? Why can't significant new partners be invited to the unit, not to parent but to be welcome. I know it sounds idealistic but if the new partner is becoming involved with a coparent, they have to understand that they will be involved with the family. And if not then they can see them when not with the children?

I have seen other posters mentioning that they are still able to share wole family together, and the children benefit from this. Often new partners become involved. I don't understand how it is so black and white you just split an divide completely. I don't understand how that is healthy for the children. I'm not trying to control, I believe he would not want to lose all family time. I think we could be friends, just not married. Why because it doesn't fit the mold is it not possible and positive?

I think you just need to be realistic about the reality that divorce means change, and that you can only dictate your own reaction to that change, not his. It’s very easy for you both to feel certain and to say right now what you want to do, but that will change, once you’ve no longer got the confines of the marriage - it just will. You’ve the idea of new partners being peripheral people happy to float on the sidelines of your “family time” and being welcomed in on your terms - and you might try to have future relationships on those terms, but you’ve no control over whether your ex will feel the same way. As a couple of other posters have pointed out: your ex could meet a new partner and have further children. And then they’ll want holidays and Christmas together with their family, and they probably won’t want you there.

It’s also worth acknowledging that you haven’t even begun the divorce process yet. You’ve a tough couple of years ahead of you, even if you’re on good terms now and are determined to go through it as amicably as possible. There will be inevitable disagreements and probably arguments over the financial settlement. The likelihood of you both being in a mind to spend a jolly family Christmas together, when you’re in the middle of disputing with each other over a house sale and house equity and pension splitting and who gets the prized possessions and the one who feels as though they’re being shafted by the other is incredibly bitter about it all, is pretty slim.

My in laws did a very amicable co-parenting situation. They had no idea, but despite their best intentions and efforts to explain, my husband spent his whole childhoood thinking they were on the brink of getting back together, until his Dad announced he was getting married and having a baby with a new partner. It was devastating to him. Don’t underestimate how kids’ brains work, and how they fill in the gaps of situations they don’t fully understand.

So, I know I'm being seen as naive here. I think the divorce, though painful wouldn't be too awful. He's very respectful, I don't think he or I would be grabby. We'd listen to what each other wants and try to accommodate. We're half and half in the house, both financially stable. Neither has a large pension.
I know things will change. But you can only plan for how things will be for now. Your intentions and values as co-parents. I get he may meet someone else who has a family, we'd work that out then. I'd respect his needs. For me, I think if I had a new partner I'd be totally happy to see them and celebrate not on the actual day as I'd be able to put that aside for the sake of the kids.

Isn't it better to have a lovely, albeit very different family unit, and tell the children often that we still love each other, we're friends but will never get back together. Mention that one of us may find someone else to be with but you, the children will always be our centre.
Isn't the better than having two very divided families, mum and dad don't really talk or spend time with each other. Even though they used to live together. How is that a good model?
Surely children would feel so confused at how two adults who've made a family can be strangers.

We’re currently in the midst of an amicable split and whilst holidays will be separate, we do intend to do things jointly for some birthdays and Christmas etc and I can’t see that being a problem. Ex has no other family so when we are alternating Xmas day I don’t imagine leaving him to eat on his own. My close friend still has some occasion meals with her ex and he has a new family. They do things like graduation etc together. But their split wasn’t for anything “bad” either.

We are almost 48 and 53 though and have no intentions of being in other significant relationships while DD is small (almost 6). I can’t imagine anything worse than living with someone elses kids so that is out of the question for me. I’m quite happy to stay permanently single, as is ex. So we don’t expect clashes caused from new relationships. I’m not saying we will remain celibate either-but I absolutely don’t want another partner.

My own divorced parents were amicable enough to do joint significant events together so it absolutely can work. But we won’t be doing 2 week holidays. There needs to be a clear boundary but it’s up to you both what that is.

Thanks for this, glad to hear it's going alright. How has your child taken it and how did you feel growing up like this?

Go to mediation together. Talk honestly and openly. Allow somebody else to ask and guide you through the often difficult and uncomfortable questions. Listen to each other. Establish whether you both have equal appetite for and commitment to what you’re proposing, and that your ex isn’t simply giving it lip service or glossing over the negatives. Establish what you each hope for in your new lives after divorce.

I get he may meet someone else who has a family, we'd work that out then.

In a rational adult mind, thinking you’d be in control of the process, this sounds fine. But from your DC’s perspective, this is going to feel like having their parents divorce twice. They go through the initial trauma and upheaval of you separating, of not seeing both of you every day, of having two different homes, and two different routines, but expecting the family holidays and trips and dinners and celebrations. They get secure in this new normal. Then one day - very possibly sooner than you are currently imagining, very possibly not on your terms - either because of a new partner or because one or both of you have decided that the arrangement just isn’t working out, you have to sit them down again and explain that the new life and security they’ve gotten used to isn’t going to be happening anymore. No, dad won’t be coming on holiday like usual. No, mum isn’t allowed in dad’s house for dinner any more. No, you’ll be with dad and his new partner this Christmas, but you’ll see mum the day after, and have Christmas with her next year. If you feel they won’t be able to comprehend how two people who made a family can’t be best friends, consider how they’ll make sense of that, having thought that you could and were.

I think if it’s liveable and possible to make better, stay and try to work it out. As soon as you separate, you do just that. There will be other partners, other pulls. I’ve got friends that did “family stuff” with their ex post split, but it never lasts. Separation and divorce is a big rip. It's a big leap to make if life is bobbling along ok.

It's not about being best friends, that's not what I'm proposing. It's about showing warmth and understanding to each other, still spending time as a respectful family unit.
I really appreciate what you're saying and I don't want it to come across as though I'm arguing. It allows me to see a different perspective.
I just feel it's so cynical and expecting the worst when some people surely do work this all out together.
We get on with each of our families and I'm sure we'd still want to see them from time to time. I meet his family and nephews when he's not there. We enjoy that time together.

Yes because I'm getting from this either have a cold split and suffer with that, better to stay. Sacrifice my want to ever have that kind of relationship for myself. Just do it when they're grown

How many people do you know that have the set up you are envisioning? That should tell you how difficult it is as it would be highly unusual for it to work long term successfully.

Your first stumbling block is that you can see it being so amicable because you're the one that wants to separate. Unless he's also literally thinking the exact same thing (which is unlikely at the exact same time) then it's unlikely to work at all because he'll either be angry at the split, or it'll destroy his mental health playing house but you not wanting to be married to him.

Op I was talking to a few divorced people about their set ups (we’re having huge problems and are in talks). With one her daughter didn’t want to leave her on her own while they went to the dad’s and what had until then been relatively easy went south as the children started fighting amongst themselves (and they were young enough, ten twelve and thirteen). This led to the dh telling my friend to convince her to go and next thing THEY'RE fighting and now all communication is like mud between them and they argue the semantics of everything. They have a court order now which says all children must visit the other’s house and that they can’t be brought away on holidays on birthdays or Christmas, new years etc.

If you want to split, split, but your kids will not come out of it fully unscathed. They will be happier if you’re bad together and split, but definitely think about it, nobody I have spoken to has said what you hear on mn about it being the best thing they ever did, they say it had to be done but life is tough.

You can “argue” all you like! MN is a sounding board for thoughts and working through them. It’s a really difficult time for you, you’re trying to make sense of how things are going to look, and naturally you’re desperately wanting to hold on to what you really want - which is not to miss out on any of the really special times with your DC which divorced parents have to divide up and negotiate between themselves on. All this is an entirely normal place to be in and to feel at this stage of considering separation.

It isn’t a binary between a dead cold split, and continuing to behave like a nuclear family. You can still be friendly. You can be involved co-parents who have each other’s backs and each want the other to be happy because you care about each other, and because your DC deserve happy parents. You’ll talk to each other and know what’s going on. You’ll be a united front showing up together at the things which affect you both: school parents’ evenings, performances, when the hockey team the DC play on is playing a big game etc. The DC can know that they don’t have to shy away from talking positively about dad around mum or mum around dad. You help the DC pick out the nicest card to give you each on Mother’s / Father’s Days. You’ll still speak to their grandparents and their cousins and may continue to see these relatives sometimes, too, because you like them. You might occasionally go out together for something special like DC’s birthdays. That’s a more achievable aspiration, which manages both of your expectations from the off. In later years things may well develop; but you aren’t setting yourselves up for the automatic expectation, likely to fail, of trying to continue to be one family.

Ps I have to add when dh and I started not getting along it was shocking how quickly his family backed away, and shocking how much it irritated him that I’d want them to have contact with me. This despite his mum nearly being like a close second to my own mum and me always dropping in, them dropping over etc. My friend who has the same relationship with her ils said they texted her and said they were disappointed she hadn’t worked harder at keeping the family together!!

This is part of the issue for me OP with your style of thinking.

Of the families we know who have separated I would say 95% of them said the same as you right now OP, it’ll be fine, we still like each other, families get on etc. In the VAST majority of cases though actual separation and divorce changes everything, it changes the way families interact, it changes someone you’ve known for decades into a stranger. That’s the risk of it.

My friend has the most amicable divorce ever

They did 50/50 from the start, her son Jack had 2 homes, 2 bedrooms and everything he needed in both.

She & her ex had a joint account where they both paid the same set amount every month. That way if Jack needed new trousers or trainers or a school trip it was paid for by whoever had him at the time. So costs were 50/50

They went out every year on his birthday as a family. They spent every Christmas morning together & went their separate ways at lunchtime. Whoevers turn in was to have Scott that Christmas would have him from just before lunch until the same time Boxing Day. They also did things like went to school shows etc together

Her ex had a new partner first. And their coparenting style was explained to her from the outset.

Scott is now in his mid 20s but his family birthday traditions continued adding in his step mum as time went on.

My friend and her ex went to his graduation together. Their respective partners met them afterwards and they went out for a meal with the respective Granny's and Grandpa's too

The way they've co parented is amazing and I absolutely take my hat off to them. Its not easy, but it definitely can be done

We’re still in the same house so DD as hasn’t fully registered it yet but we live separately within the house if that makes sense and take it in turns to have responsibility for DD. So for example we are in summer hols and have taken 50% of the time off each and on the days we each have her the other person doesn’t really do any parenting (out of the house all day etc). We won’t likely be in separate houses much before next Easter for various reasons. We get our Conditional
order in a few weeks though so divorce is fairly far through.

DD hates the arguing and she is used to 50/50 parenting already (we did roughly 50/50 all her life really once I was back at work) so I think she will be ok. But it will have an impact obviously.

I was teenage when my parents divorced and it was absolutely fine just very sad at the time, spoke to my dad daily and saw him roughly half the week and could see whichever parent whenever I wanted. I didn’t want them back together. They were brilliant parents but dreadful as a couple. They are really close now though in their old age-still go in holidays! Which is a bit odd but they like it. When I visit with DD I usually stay at Dad’s because it’s bigger and mum comes over to stay too while we are there so they are co-grandparenting! 🤣 but they are unusual.

Ex and I are almost friends, not quite as there’s a lot of resentment and anger too but we had to draw a line as DD was living in a quietly toxic environment and I am 1000% sure that once the divorce is done we will all be happier once the dust settles.