Page 2 | Why 'supervised' child contact?

Orchidflower1 · 28/12/2020 14:32

Social workers are sooo thinly stretched they would not set up supervised contact unless it was needed.

Sorry op but there is something VERY wrong to need it. What’s making it even clearer is his denial about it.

Original poster

NewShoesRub · 28/12/2020 14:34

@Topseyt sorry to hear that. It's very sad to think of a situation like that where the mother is afraid of her own son.

Lots of you (all of you!) are saying there is some kind of abuse. Thank you for your time in replying and I hope it hasn't brought up bad memories in your own experiences you have shared.

What I wanted from this thread was some confidence to be able to urge my parents to stay neutral, remind them there will be more to this than meets the eye and for them not to be suckered in to supporting a man who is being harmful.

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2bazookas · 28/12/2020 14:37

That will be for the physical safety and mental well being of the child, following evidence of harm or intimidation by the father.

"moved out with their DC (6) without as much as discussing with him. It was quite a shock (according to him).

Maybe she  said nothing in order to protect herself and the child from further abuse.

Itscontroversial · 28/12/2020 14:38

Me and my ex split suddenly when he was arrested for sex offences against minors. Initially he had no contact other than letters or emails (i.e. nothing live). Now he has supervised contact only as social services are still to be convinced he is not a risk. However he is entitled to some contact ultimately, the threshold for stopping all contact is extremely high. I don't necessarily agree, it's the law. This man will certainly know why (my ex has it in writing) and trying to blame his ex is despicable. As a pp said you can't just impose supervised contact to spite your someone, there has to be a good reason and it is done via the relevant authorities.

Original poster

NewShoesRub · 28/12/2020 14:46

Sorry you went through that @Itscontroversial it sounds hideous and devastating for you and your family.

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Bluntness100 · 28/12/2020 14:56

Good cor her in getting out and being able to do it without him finding out. No one knows exactly why these children are at risk from him but sounds like it was domestic violence if she’s left suddenly without warning.

Lemonpiano · 28/12/2020 14:57

she got a new flat etc sorted and moved out with their DC (6) without as much as discussing with him

My friend has been told he can only have 'supervised' contact with his son

I am very surprised that your first thought wasn't "domestic abuse".

GlowingOrb · 28/12/2020 15:01

The bar for supervised access is very high. Children are sent to their abusers for visitation all the time. If supervised access is in place, either the mother got very lucky at being able to provide enough evidence or this man is a monster. The family should be supporting him by suggesting a good therapist and that he make a commitment to making his supervised visits as good as possible.

SimonJT · 28/12/2020 15:03

The child could be at risk, or he hasn’t actually bothered to parent before so can’t be trusted to providr appropriate care.

pinkdragons · 28/12/2020 15:06

I volunteer in a contact centre.
Helping support the children and facilitate the parental visit.

Almost always it is due to domestic abuse of some kind. Police involved etc.

Sometimes we've hosted families who were a flight risk. Parent trying to take the kid away.

And occasionally threat from other family members who the parent might bring them in to contact with. This had been sexual abuse in all the cases I've seen, sadly.

Original poster

NewShoesRub · 28/12/2020 15:16

Thanks for the insight @pinkdragons

My first thought was 'well what has done?' but this tale has been relayed to me secondhand by my parents (who are trying to support their friends who are very upset) who have got the info from the highly edited version their son has told them.

The story was presented to me as Poor 'friend' has been through such an awful time... which the more I think about it now the madder I get that we all got suckered in and have likely been manipulated. At least I was questioning it and saying 'well there must be more to this' and 'try and stay neutral you never know' etc.

Now I'm Rereading all these comments and getting furious.

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RitaEllen · 28/12/2020 15:22

Obviously I can’t make judgment as I don’t know the full facts of the situation, only to say I’m sure he does know why he has supervised contact.

However, whilst it may be a common abuse tactic to say the Ex Wife is mentally unstable sometimes this is also the truth. My poor brother who wouldn’t hurt a fly had very difficult times with his Ex (diagnosed EUPD). Eventually he left her as he could no longer cope with her behaviour, in retaliation she reported him to social services, told anyone who would listen that he was an abusive drug addict, and told the police he had child pornography. All his computers/phones etc were seized for over a year until the allegations were proven false. No idea where she is now but I’ve not seen my nephew in almost 3 years. It’s heartbreaking. I guess I just wanted to put it out there that it’s not always the man.

Lemonpiano · 28/12/2020 15:25

@RitaEllen

Obviously I can’t make judgment as I don’t know the full facts of the situation, only to say I’m sure he does know why he has supervised contact.

However, whilst it may be a common abuse tactic to say the Ex Wife is mentally unstable sometimes this is also the truth. My poor brother who wouldn’t hurt a fly had very difficult times with his Ex (diagnosed EUPD). Eventually he left her as he could no longer cope with her behaviour, in retaliation she reported him to social services, told anyone who would listen that he was an abusive drug addict, and told the police he had child pornography. All his computers/phones etc were seized for over a year until the allegations were proven false. No idea where she is now but I’ve not seen my nephew in almost 3 years. It’s heartbreaking. I guess I just wanted to put it out there that it’s not always the man.

The critical difference being: Eventually he left her.

She didn't have to flee secretly with her child to find safety from him.

Bluntness100 · 28/12/2020 15:27

No one in their right mind thinks this man was ordered to have supervised contact only by a court and he’s no idea why.

I’d not urge my parents to remain neutral unless talking to his parents. But I’d urge them to accept that this order is in place because he is a risk to the children.

Bluntness100 · 28/12/2020 15:29

She didn't have to flee secretly with her child to find safety from him

And he wasn’t claiming he didn’t know why he had supervised access ordered, if that’s what you’re saying occured.

RitaEllen · 28/12/2020 15:35

Yes, I agree his Ex doesn’t tell people he left her, she makes out that she fled from him. I guess it just still surprises me to this day the number of people who believe her lies and I can’t help but feel it’s because she is the female in the relationship. People don’t tend to think of a woman as being abusive. It just stuck a chord with me the OP saying “he has said that his ex would often act irrationally and then be really apologetic. This definitely sounds like something a guy would say who is trying to make out it's her with the problem not him. Hmmmm.” As in my brothers case that was the truth.

Although in this case I think him saying he doesn’t know why visits are supervised is a red flag

Bluntness100 · 28/12/2020 15:39

Rita, I think you’re derailing, your brothers story is very different. He left her, he was honest about the accusations etc.

This is a different animal totally.

Original poster

NewShoesRub · 28/12/2020 15:45

I take your point @RitaEllen. I'm not actually trying to get to the bottom of it or get all the details on what happened. I'm trying to get to a place where I can say to my parents with confidence that there is more to this than his version and he will know why he has to have supervised contact. In making out he doesn't know, he is showing himself to be lying - so what else could he be lying about, don't blindly believe him especially if this is impacting how HIS parents are feeling about their DIL.

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TicTac80 · 28/12/2020 15:48

When I applied to Court for a Prohibited Steps Order (stbxh had drug/alcohol problems, and from that, other destructive and abusive behaviour) to prevent unsupervised contact, the Judge saw the evidence (sadly lots of evidence) and granted the PSO for 12 months initially (he could only have supervised contact and there were a load of provisos etc), and also ordered a CAO be put in place with immediate effect that meant that the kids were to reside with me all the time, and stbxh wouldn’t be able to have the children overnight (even once the PSO finished).

Believe me that there is no way random people get forced into supervised contact for no good reason. It’s cost me over £3.5k in legal and Court fees to get things legally watertight and to protect my kids (I wish that I didn’t have to do this: it was a horrific time, but so was when I found out he’d been DUI with the kids in his car)...and there’s no way the Judge would have allowed it if he didn’t have clear evidence. Stbxh was notified of the reasons that he could only have supervised contact. He attended the Hearing, and he received copies of the Court Order.

If supervised contact was ordered, your family friend would have had to have seen the reasons for it. And the Court would have to been given good reason to order supervised contact.

RitaEllen · 28/12/2020 15:53

Sorry not meaning to derail. Just don’t think it’s true that it always means 100% that he has done something wrong. Like a PP said “Believe me that there is no way random people get forced into supervised contact for no good reason.” - I don’t think this is true.

But I definitely think he knows why and the fact he is not being open and honest suggests he has something to hide

LadyPenelope68 · 28/12/2020 15:58

There are concerns about his relationship with/behaviour towards the children if the contact is supervised. It will have been explained to him fully why the contact has to be supervised, so if he’s suggesting he doesn’t know why, the. He’s not being honest.

LadyPenelope68 · 28/12/2020 15:59

It’s also quite likely that Social Services are involved as well if there’s supervised contact.

Cleverpolly3 · 28/12/2020 17:06

@RitaEllen

Sorry not meaning to derail. Just don’t think it’s true that it always means 100% that he has done something wrong. Like a PP said “Believe me that there is no way random people get forced into supervised contact for no good reason.” - I don’t think this is true.

But I definitely think he knows why and the fact he is not being open and honest suggests he has something to hide

Contact is not supervised for nothing. End of. The threshold for it is serious and it is all about risk to the children or harm they are deemed to have suffered or be at risk of.

If I were the OP I would smell BS. He will know. Even if he seeks to dismiss or minimise it he will know.

It will be likely something to do with the child since sadly violence against women doesn’t seem to matter half as much as it should.

TicTac80 · 28/12/2020 17:16

I had to show clear proof to the Court, Social Services, the schools/childcare settings as to why I was asking for supervised contact. I couldn’t just make it up (that would have been morally
wrong not to mention illegal), or simply tell the schools/childcare settings not to allow stbxh to take the kids if he showed up. It had to be sorted through Court before the schools would be able to stop stbxh taking the children. And I had to apply to Court, be allowed to actually have the initial and second hearings for the PSO and show solid evidence of stbxh’s behaviour before they would grant a PSO.

It wasn’t granted because of a whim, or because I woke up on the wrong side of the bed, or because I was just pissed off with stbxh. The Court wouldn’t have allowed it to get that far! Maybe the Court and Judge who dealt with my case were unique, and maybe other Courts and Judges do actually force innocent people into supervised contact for no good reason.

But this is no small undertaking to do: not in emotional/mental load, time or money. I’m still paying it off. It was a horrific experience and not not one I would have gone into if there was any other way that I could have kept my children safe and still allow contact. In an ideal world, stbxh wouldn’t have had these problems or display abusive behaviours, and he would have been able to safely look after the children.

OP, in your case, I've no doubt he knows only too well why supervised contact has been granted. He just doesn’t want to say.

TicTac80 · 28/12/2020 17:20

PS the behaviours he displayed towards me (verbal, physical abuse) wouldn’t have made a jot of difference to the Court. It was the behaviours he showed that proved he couldn’t properly keep the children safe that meant a PSO was granted.