Care home bills

[HeadacheEarthquake]

Hi there- my MIL's DM (divorced, and exH deceased) is being released after being sectioned for 6 months and has to go into a care home, but the NHS will only provide £700 of the £1600 needed on average locally. She has dementia.

We are in West Sussex if that helps.

I was wondering if anyone had managed to get extra help with this kind of thing via charities or other avenues, my MIL is on it but we have also got other family members in hospital/bereaved/needing help and it's all stacking up.

If I could give her any suggestions it would be great to help her get her thoughts organised and research in order.

Thanks for reading, it's so stressful for us as a family as you will know if you've been here.

We’ll be in this. situation soon with my dad when his savings run out.

He’ll just have to go into a LA funded home.

Which I am dreading as he was in one at first for respite care while he was being assessed (I didn’t know what I was doing).

It was dire. But we can’t top up any fees so there will be no choice.

If she has no £ of her own then it's up to the NHS/Social Services to find care they deem meets her needs. What is the £700 funding - is this the nursing portion of a nursing home?

And they will find £700 and take everything else she had coming in , e.g any pensions to top up to what the care home charges for full funded people who don’t have their own money and leave her £24 ish pounds a week for her own use - toiletries etc.

Fund, not find.

Is the £700 from a continuous healthcare assessment? If it isn’t, it’s worth applying for thought can be a frustrating and difficult process. I think quite a few people applying for dementia reasons only get results after appealing and sometimes by getting lawyers involved. Info here www.ageuk.org.uk/information-advice/health-wellbeing/health-services/nhs-continuing-healthcare/

The council has to provide at least one suitable care home option that does not require any top up. If it hasn't done so you need to point this out. Top ups are intended to be optional.

Wow ok I will look into this Thankyou, if there should be an option then they'll have to come up with it

Yes it's from her assessment as dementia and discharge plan I'll look on here Thankyou

I will check re pension, she doesn't have any equity after selling house and gifting it to another child frustratingly

It's what the NHS have allocated her and I assume that's on a means test of her daughter - we were expecting full funding so it's been a shock for MIL

What will be your plan? What's LA funding?

Local authority can go back and see where equity/ savings has gone. there is no time limit on how fare back they can go.

If she has sold a property and gifted the money this may be considered as deprivation of assets by some councils.

Local authority sorry yes xx

Yes absolutely. In our LA they ask on the financial assessment form whether property has been owned previously.

This is useful thankyou!

I think you need to clarify what that £700 is. Also when you say sectioned which part of the act? If their aftercare is directly related to having been sectioned it should be fully funded.

www.mind.org.uk/information-support/legal-rights/leaving-hospital/section-117-aftercare/

You need to clarify this as many professionals do not put this through properly and many people have been wrongly charged for their care. I worked in an LA where they had to refund a lot of care charges and interest for this reason and where there were a lot of issues with their NHS colleagues for not submitting the correct paperwork for the authority to know not to charge.

Give Age Concern a ring. They were absolutely brilliant when we were in this position last year with DF, and really know everything you'd need to know. If there's a medical need there is more money that you can apply for through the health authority but I know you'll get all the info from Age Concern.

Age uk have very helpful fact sheets on their website covering all these issues I recommend downloading the relevant ones. Ch funding comes from the nhs but it is the social services department of your local authority who would be responsible for finding a home that they can fully fund. They cannot take into account the income of anyone else although there is the possibility of deprivation of assets because of the gift to the son/daughter.

Oh and also our Age Concern lady was able to sit in meetings with us via Zoom, she took notes and when all the health care professionals had left would explain everything and tell us if it was right or wrong. It was eye opening.

I'm a bit out of date so I might be wrong but...

Care homes are funded by the local authority not NHs. If you have been allocated NHS money this is the nursing element of any care home. Not the residential care element if you see what I mean. It means they think she has medical needs over and above just being an older person who can't manage at home anymore.

So I would think you need to talk to the social care folks at the council as they are required to meet the residential element of care home costs - Subject to the individual having no assets and as someone said above contributing the majority of her income (less a small portion for toiletries, hair cuts etc).

What you might find easier is to visit the care homes you think would be appropriate (near to people who will visit etc.). Be aware that a placement for someone with dementia requires a nursing home with a dementia specialism, not a standard residential home. The manager of the home will be able to explain exactly what the funding you have been allocated will cover. They will also be able to explain where any other funding need to come from - who to speak to at the local authority etc. They will know whether there is a top up required - but it will not be in the order of the finances you describe above. The local authority are required to provide options that done need top up, and noone is required to provide top up so the family should not be forced into it if its not sustainable and you cannot clearly see what you will get for the money over an alternative provision.

Good luck to your MIL. It is a stressful time.

Noone other than the person requiring care is means tested for social care- family are not required to pay so her daughters finances should not come into it.

Do speak to the home about this. If your dad has been there for a significant period of time and it would be detrimental to his health to move him - they/you can argue the case with the local authority such that they take over the top up. There are time limits for when this applies that vary but definitely worth asking.

Had this with DP's DF. If the MIL's DM was sectioned under a section 3, she will be discharged under section 117 which requires the health authority to pay for aftercare for life. There may be a local limit. If that amount isn't enough to cover local homes, then money can be put to the fees from family contribution, the patients occupational and state pension, attendance allowance. Your MIL needs to alert the health authority and local authority social services that she has given the proceeds of her house sale away and it will be up to them to chase for deliberate deprivation of assets.

The health authority let us choose the home and DF's pensions topped up the fees. Not sure what happens if the HA awarded amount will be pay for fees and the patient only has their state pension & attendance allowance to fall back on. We used the Aged UK website and phone line service to help us with the financial situation. Because it's a section 117 discharge it's up to the health authority & local authority to sort it. Please whatever you do, don't offer to top up the fees until they have sorted themselves out - if you pick up the bill there's no incentive for them to do so and you are then tied to to topping up ad infinitum

This post is correct