Black and Tans / Yup the Ra

[BATIRA]

Hi - how do you feel about references to the Black and Tans, singing Come Out Ye Black and Tans, shouting “yup the RA” in a professional workplace?

Re age I was wondering if it's foolish 20 year olds who don't understand history, or if it's 60 year olds who are hardened "volunteers".
I'm assuming it's men though 🤔

But yes, regardless of age the workplace is not an appropriate setting for these songs

It’s a thing at the moment isn’t it? Amongst some younger people, I am told.

Joe Duffy's show has made it into a big thing now.

Completely inappropriate anywhere, workplace or otherwise. The late John Hume was spot on about songs of this nature:

"There is another problem which concerns us specifically.....and that is the mythology of violence with which our particular political tradition has grown up.

Violence has been glorified by anti-Unionists throughout Irish history. Songs have been sung about it; the ballads have been sung about it. Is it any wonder that if we sing the songs of violence and glorify violence young people take us at our word and believe that when they take up a gun they are committing acts of patriotism?

Therefore, it is not enough to blame young people who are involved in the Provisional I.R.A. We must examine the whole political ethos, of our society and eradicate from it all traces of glorification of violence."

- John Hume in the Northern Ireland Assembly 1973

You have a point @DownNative.
Do you think the July 12th celebrations should likewise be banned in the interests of peace?

I wonder what his feelings on copy and paste were 🤔

I'd have no problem with that myself since I'm not a Protestant. 🤷‍♂️

Yet we hear from the Shinners it should be made a public holiday....don't we?

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/sf-leader-backs-the-twelfth-as-public-holiday-in-united-ireland-1.4711946

Not sure what point you were trying to make in regards to the OP other than assuming I'm a Protestant who celebrates 12th July.

The British Army killed a lot of civilians too. Are they also terrorists?

Nobody should be singing black and tans /uo the ra songs in a workplace. Especially if there is an English woman working there.

Have people no cop on.

If she came in singing "up the British army - go and shoot all the bastards" something like that - would you think thats acceptable.

Its terrorism and inciting hate.

Given the OP has ignored all questions about context and how this arose, there's a chance that it isn't.

I do think some young Irish people seem to be into shouting up the ra ,when drunk at parties, without really thinking it through. They think of its in a song.

When if they stopped to think about it, they would see it's definitel not something yo should say in a workplace.

@StephanieSuperpowers its in a professional workplace. If the context matters does that mean there are circumstances when it would be ok and others where it isn’t? I’m genuinely trying to understand.

You’re curiously reticent about it all. Almost as though you were trying to draw people out.

trying to draw people out
Come out ye ???

I don’t think this it is acceptable to be shouting up the RA in a professional workplace, no. There really is terrible ignorance about the reality of the IRA’s actions, these days.

Literal lol.

Up The RA is never an acceptable thing to say.

I do wonder if there's a link between the increase in people in ROI (young people in particular) carrying on like this and Sinn Fein increasingly being viewed as a respectable party.

I think it's a bit like Prince Harry dressing as a nazi and thinking it's just something funny to do without thinking of how it could make someone else feel.

I'm almost 40 and this was a song we always sang back in my early 20's. Musicians would even sing it in pubs so it's definitely not something new.

I think my reticence is down to a real nervousness of what would happen if anyone from work spotted the thread and realised it was me. It’s probably outing enough already but I’m hoping not.
Also, I am trying to understand the politics / sensitivity around this more. My history lessons didn’t cover any any of the UKs history with Ireland at all so moving here I was pretty clueless. I have read around the topic now but that doesn’t teach cultural understanding. I honestly didn’t know if I was being unreasonable and after the awful things the English did, it would be seen here as fair game.
I’m grateful to people answering this thread and helping me understand.

after the awful things the English did, it would be seen here as fair game
Not at all. You are not responsible for what happened in the past and terrorist slogans are not acceptable. However if this was a once off thing after EP then there was probably no malice intended. If it's continuous and you feel it's aimed at you then you need to get HR involved.

Well I think if you overheard some people talking about electric picnic and they'd seen the Wolfe Tones doing celtic symphony and they were saying that everyone was saying ooh ah up the RA, or if they were talking about that event because it was in the news, that's a bit different to what you're apparently suggesting, which is that everyone in a professional workplace suddenly broke out into a chant for no reason.

The fact that you heard yup rather than up suggests that you're not really engaging with your Irish colleagues or the local culture very much. It's very common for people to say up Mayo or Waterford or whatever.

The fact that you heard yup rather than up suggests that you're not really engaging with your Irish colleagues or the local culture very much. It's very common for people to say up Mayo or Waterford or whatever.

Nonsense. OP doesn't come across that way at all.

End of the day OP praising a terrorist organisation isn't ok at work!

Wel, of you had the tv or radio tuned to any Irish station throughout the summer, you would hear the up whatever team frequently.

And ooh an up the RA at electric picnic/a festival in Derry was discussed at exhaustive length on all media, including newspapers and online media. But apparently it all sailed by the OP? It doesn't sound that engaged to me.