To just not get it with Ireland reopening

[Ahnowcomon]

I have just read that npht are very concerned re delta variant and that indoor dining etc opening might be put back. I just don't understand , if the older and vulnerable are vaccinated with both doses how this could end up being again a huge problem?
They actually said schools might not open in September if this variant becomes prevalent..
Even if people do contract the virus after two doses then surely they aren't going to be able to become as sick to need hospitalisation or if so very rarely.
And also if it continues to be delayed , September when schools begin -not a good time , winter-not a good time as too many ppl will need boosters, Christmas-again not a good time.
Is that it then , they just stay closed? Also Germany, France, Spain, Italy etc all have indoor dining (and yes they prob also have more outdoor dining), all these countries have the delta variant also.
I just don't get it tbh..BTW it makes pretty much no difference to us as we rarely eat out but feel hugely for the businesses.

We are going away next year for a few months and taking kids out of school, thought about it before anyway and this has helped us make the desision. We have family in other countries in Europe, watching how in Ireland the schools kept closed for 8 months was shocking to me, in Spain and France they prioritised education. I also don't understand how they were able to open again when we still had the various variants and it was still rampant in the community.. I'm assuming it was all down ro movement of ppl.
However I have family working in hospitals who say the delays in diagnosis in children with special needs and the shutting of schools for students with sn and lack of respite has been a disaster for many familes and these are ppl who are well used to working up close and personal with ppl even while unvaccinated.
I am glad Ireland protected people and everyone has been very compliant but it's very very important to give the public hope. I actually don't see it tbh as this isn't going to go, honestly wouldn't be surprised if schools are shut on and off again next year again!!
What about when there's new variants, when the hospitals become overcrowded during the winter ? Will they keep shutting down things? The majority of pubs and restaurants in our town are still closed and the hotels here are absolutely packed with prices of up to 800 per night for two ppl It must be be hard for those other business owners to watch.

The UK has had indoor dining for months now and the hypocrisy here of the packed hotels , full of ppl in restaurants and bars, how does what make any sense? I honestly don't see when it can end, there will always be a new problem, a new variant, our hospitals are obviously incredibly vulnerable. I can actually seriously see schools closing again...

I presume it's because the Irish Health System is really shite
^ this is what I'm starting to think. Well, obviously we knew it anyway but it must be even worse than we thought. The line all along was to flatten the curve so that the hospitals didn't get overwhelmed. They are NOT overwhelmed and yet still haven't resumed normal service. I know the hack didn't help either. But it's a real indictment of how bad our system is, if we can't cope at this stage.

It's very hard to be positive but we have to be, otherwise we'll crack up. I'm back to taking each week at a time now, and really making a conscious effort to not dwell on any of it. Please God we'll come out the other side soon.

@TurquoiseBaubles

OuiOuiKitty, the issue I have with the sudden announcement is that pharmacies got no warning and there is no central way of registering. So my son, for example, is on the waiting list of 7 different pharmacies, which is a complete waste of time for everyone.

The way it was announced gave young people the impression they could be vaccinated in pharmacies from this week. In reality about 3% of them will be which will make no statistical difference to rates of infection but is causing huge anger among my son's peers many of whom work in hospitality and entertainment and have been out of proper work for over a year.

But some have been vaccinated in pharmacies this week. Nobody ever said all 18-34yo will be vaccinated next week if they want, they didn't even say that all 18-34yo will be accommodated this way in the next few months. I'm not sure why anyone would think otherwise? It was always really clear that it was limited, especially in the first week, at least it was if you bothered to read beyond headlines to what was actually said.

It would take time to set up a central system, so you can either sit on various waiting lists(which they were directly asked not to do btw) or wait for a central system for pharmacies, at least this way some people will get theirs in the next few weeks. A central system for pharmacies would take far longer than that to get up and running.

Then there is also registration through the portal opening for vaccination with AZ or Jansson too at mass vaccination centres.

It's not like nothing is being done at all, we have all had to wait(well most of us) for vaccinations. If you would rather that everyone just had to wait through the portal then that's your choice I suppose.

watching how in Ireland the schools kept closed for 8 months was shocking to me, in Spain and France they prioritised education

Slightly disingenuous including school holidays in your calculation of 8 months...

The initial shutdown was a bit of a disaster for my ds as most teachers did shag all. They threw a bit of work at them via email and that was it. The second lockdown was very different though. They all taught the full timetable. Ok, it was different to in class teaching but some of the teachers actually taught much better in the online environment.

A lot of lives were saved by the cautious approach but I do think, with the level of vaccination (over 50% of adults fully vaccinated, 67% partially vaccinated), it is time to move on.

I support a relatively cautious re-opening. So continue with masks and some level of social distancing but open up all indoor stuff. We definitely need to start to move on and see does the vaccination programme work at keeping hospitalisations and deaths down.

One of the biggest concerns of opening up too fast is long covid. A Donegal GP claimed approximately 50% of his patients who have had covid have suffered from long covid. It seems to hit young people particularly.

I'm not including the school holidays!! Our school was closed over the lockdowns for 8 months, we had no online classes. Absolutely not disingenuous at all.

@Ahnowcomon

I'm not including the school holidays!! Our school was closed over the lockdowns for 8 months, we had no online classes. Absolutely not disingenuous at all.

So that means your school was closed for 3 months more than the official school closures (assuming primary)? Was that because of local cases or something? Lack of online classes was a total disgrace.

Schools were closed from mid march to the end of the school year so 3 months for primary, 2 months for secondary (I'm excluding the easter break).

Second closure was from january to march/april depending on the class, starting from 1st march for leaving certs and younger primary. All primaries were back by 15th March and final secondary schools back 15th April (which included the easter break).

So for primary - 3 months in 2020 plus 1.5 to 2 months in 2021. That's a max of 5 months.

Secondary - 2 months in 2020 and a max of 2.5 months (excluding mid-term and easter) so a maximum of 4.5 months.

All primary, 3 and half months in 2020 and 4 months in total 2021 excluding holidays so 7 and a half months in total. We had no online lessons at all. The parents covered the syllabus. This is a fact. I think the school is fantastic when open. Tbh it's given us the catalyst to travel while our kids are young so there are good points to come out as I honestly wouldn't be surprised at more school closures so good time to make plans and I'm sure we aren't the only ones.

Just checked the exact dates, our classes didn't go back until mid April after Easter so January, February, March, some of April=3 and half months, then 2020, we finished mid March, April, May, June=3 and half months. 7 months in total.
It's a long time and nowhere close to how long schools were closed in France or Spain despite them having the exact same issues.
I think pp are right though, our health system is obviously very vulnerable and they have invested in it in other European countries.

@Ahnowcomon

Just checked the exact dates, our classes didn't go back until mid April after Easter so January, February, March, some of April=3 and half months, then 2020, we finished mid March, April, May, June=3 and half months. 7 months in total. It's a long time and nowhere close to how long schools were closed in France or Spain despite them having the exact same issues. I think pp are right though, our health system is obviously very vulnerable and they have invested in it in other European countries.

If your primary school kids didn't go back until mid april, they were obviously contravening the government rules as all primary schools were meant to be open on March 15th.

Even if that was the case, you are still including holidays. 2020 - deduct easter holidays so approximately 3 months. 2021 - deduct mid-term, easter and beginning of january so at least 3 weeks. Even if your school went back later than they were told to go back (see twitter.com/AudreyCarville/status/1368937169369391108 ), it's still less than 3 months in 2021 but if they went back when they were meant to, assuming older classes, as younger ones were back March 1st, it was 2 months. So that's 5 months.

5 months is still crap and completely unacceptable that they did no online teaching. My youngest was in leaving cert so he missed 2 months in 2020, with no teaching and 1.5 months in 2021 with teaching. I'm only grateful it wasn't my dd doing the leaving as she would have totally stressed out. At least ds is chilled and isn't looking for massive points.

And yes, our health service is woefully underfunded. You would hope they might improve it after this but I have my doubts.

Our school sent an email on a Sunday night and parents were expected to do the work with them for the week. We were both working too.

@3luckystars

Our school sent an email on a Sunday night and parents were expected to do the work with them for the week. We were both working too.

I was very glad not to have primary school children. The complete lack of effort by so many teachers in the first lockdown was appalling.

I know primary school is a bit different, particularly the younger classes, but for older primary and secondary, there was no excuse. Yes, I know some had small children themselves but if that was the case, they could have recorded classes and put them up online or produced guided documents for the lesson.

All third level moved online, pretty much immediately. I taught live from day 1 using teams. Colleagues with small children recorded a session offline and uploaded it. It's not rocket science.

The problem was, it was left at the discretion of the schools. One of the schools near us ran to their normal timetable with online classes within a couple of weeks of the lockdown. Our school left it up to the teachers and when I queried the lack of engagement, I was told it was a GDPR and child protection issue (their answer to everything). Except I'm very familiar with GDPR...

At least it's given us loads of confidence with homeschooling, I am a qualified teacher but work in adult education. We actually found the homeschooling ok and two of our kids actually came on loads, it was a interesting insight into how much was being covered in general. It was a struggle with work but I'm pt and could cover most of it. It's really changed things though, we have no hesitation about taking them out of school now, actually it's given us the confidence and they might learn a European language hopefully too!

we had no online classes

OP my primary school children had no live online classes in the second lockdown but had a very structured programme of online work to complete. In their case via Google classroom.

My secondary school child had live classes all day. Which she could manage herself.

I was profoundly grateful that the younger two didn't. (A decision agreed by all the primary schools in our area, sensibly) as I couldn't have coped. They would have needed supervision, I'm a single parent with no support, with a very busy job which involved me being online a huge amount.

Even with the structured daily work, my middle child did fine, overall. My younger one grew more & more disengaged.

All third level moved online, pretty much immediately. I taught live from day 1 using teams.

For the first time ever on MN, I'm wondering if I know someone! I also have a teaching role at 3rd level 🧐😅 you know how small the sector is!

I agree with you about 1st lockdown. Very very little happened, and absolutely more could have. Ultimately my primary school kids did ok, not perfect, but they've a great school. My DD at second level was a disaster - no live classes, barely any recorded classes, randomly assigned work, never checked, and no engagement. It was shocking.

However, after the feedback they got, they were much better in January 2021, tho appalling at assessment, no exams, no proper in-class assessments. The report was ridiculous.

I'm a huge supporter of teachers in general. One thing I absolutely learnt (and I knew it before but really know it now!) how important school is for my primary school kids etc. Especially my youngest who just seemed to go backwards by March. A few weeks back & the spark was back in him, his brain seemed to work again. I would nearly say he was depressed by the time he went back ...

@Ahnowcomon

At least it's given us loads of confidence with homeschooling, I am a qualified teacher but work in adult education. We actually found the homeschooling ok and two of our kids actually came on loads, it was a interesting insight into how much was being covered in general. It was a struggle with work but I'm pt and could cover most of it. It's really changed things though, we have no hesitation about taking them out of school now, actually it's given us the confidence and they might learn a European language hopefully too!

Best of luck with your trip, sounds amazing.

@EarringsandLipstick

All third level moved online, pretty much immediately. I taught live from day 1 using teams.

For the first time ever on MN, I'm wondering if I know someone! I also have a teaching role at 3rd level 🧐😅 you know how small the sector is!

I agree with you about 1st lockdown. Very very little happened, and absolutely more could have. Ultimately my primary school kids did ok, not perfect, but they've a great school. My DD at second level was a disaster - no live classes, barely any recorded classes, randomly assigned work, never checked, and no engagement. It was shocking.

However, after the feedback they got, they were much better in January 2021, tho appalling at assessment, no exams, no proper in-class assessments. The report was ridiculous.

I'm a huge supporter of teachers in general. One thing I absolutely learnt (and I knew it before but really know it now!) how important school is for my primary school kids etc. Especially my youngest who just seemed to go backwards by March. A few weeks back & the spark was back in him, his brain seemed to work again. I would nearly say he was depressed by the time he went back ...

Very small sector. Hmm....

@Ahnowcomon

At least it's given us loads of confidence with homeschooling, I am a qualified teacher but work in adult education. We actually found the homeschooling ok and two of our kids actually came on loads, it was a interesting insight into how much was being covered in general. It was a struggle with work but I'm pt and could cover most of it. It's really changed things though, we have no hesitation about taking them out of school now, actually it's given us the confidence and they might learn a European language hopefully too!

Sounds brilliant. Where are you planning on going?

@EarringsandLipstick

we had no online classes

OP my primary school children had no live online classes in the second lockdown but had a very structured programme of online work to complete. In their case via Google classroom.

My secondary school child had live classes all day. Which she could manage herself.

I was profoundly grateful that the younger two didn't. (A decision agreed by all the primary schools in our area, sensibly) as I couldn't have coped. They would have needed supervision, I'm a single parent with no support, with a very busy job which involved me being online a huge amount.

Even with the structured daily work, my middle child did fine, overall. My younger one grew more & more disengaged.

Sounds like your schools did well in the second lockdown. I agree with you re younger kids - live classes would have been a nightmare for working parents. I'd say from 4th or 5th they'd have managed though.

Mind you, I could be remembering my kids' capabilities through rose tinted glasses. Youngest is 18.