Council Tax - Fairer Share Campaign

[backslashruby]

I'd be interested to know what people think of this, especially considering rumours that the 25% single person's discount may be abolished.

fairershare.org.uk/

The main points are:

Council tax, Stamp Duty and Bedroom Tax would be abolished and replaced with a Proportional Property Tax

Annual and automated valuations*

Exemptions would end

Based on .48% of property value but .96% for overseas investors

Landlord pays, not tenant (but I could not find any reference to social housing tenants)

They claim 75% of households would see a reduction but any increases are capped at £100 per month (but they do not say if this is transitional in any way and the reduction is based on the full Council Tax so not necessarily a reduction for single householders)

Rises annually by average rise in property values over last 3 years but would stay same or reduce if property values stagnate or fall.

• The full explanation is;

• The existing Valuation Office Agency (VOA) will continue to be responsible for valuation, though under our system most valuations will derive from actual sales data and recent changes to house values in your area. We believe the government could use the wealth of data it already has to build an algorithm similar to those used by websites like Zoopla and Rightmove in making their estimates. Such a system would allow each and every home to be accurately valued based on its unique characteristics.

Personally I would be paying roughly the same as I am paying now but most of the houses in my street are occupied by more than 1 person so they would all get reduced bills.

My main reservations are:

They are a bit vague, or naive even, about valuations being accurate although presumably you could appeal

I do not believe that bills would stay static/fall in line with house prices

High house price increases would mean large increases in bills

Tenants are the ones using local services so should pay the tax themselves

What do you think?

Also taxing by property "value" means somebody renting a 1 bedroom flat in London or parts of the SE pays more than a owner occupier in a 3 bedroom house in another part of the UK.

And as I've said, it's not as if loads of people from London and the SE can all upsticks and move. Pack in their jobs, leave vulnerable family who need care, etc. And for those on the lowest incomes they need local connection for eligibility social housing.

But also if loads of people moved elsewhere, then house prices would increase where they moved, and there'd be added pressure on jobs - and local services.... meaning council tax would increase there.

If local taxes have to stay (I'd prefer nationally funded public services and an end to postcode lotteries), a better change would be to make it based on income and assets (assets not including the home lived in).

It most definitely is not my website 😁and I'm not actually in favour of it myself, I just wanted to know if it has popular support. (I live in England so didn't clock that it wasn't just including english properties. My bad).

I realised that, so edited!

@PandoraSox I'd actually posted before your edit so all good.

Not sounding that popular then................. And to clarify, I'm not in favour of it myself.

Ours would be the same as we pay now at .48% of property value so it seems we are paying our "fair share".

It would have to be centrally collected and distributed per head to each local authority otherwise some areas would be quids in whereas areas with cheap housing would be completely impoverished.

We believe the government could use the wealth of data it already has to build an algorithm similar to those used by websites like Zoopla and Rightmove in making their estimates.

And there is the worry! The algorithms those websites use are awful - my next-door neighbour has been in her house for over 50 years - they value her house at about 40% of its real value - the 9 houses in our street are all very different values - so how would the sale of any one of them provide a guide to the others? Most sell every 25-30 years also making it hard to assess...

yes, it can work on a Barrats development where there are 1000 identical properties and houses selling every few moths - you can understand reasonably accurately where the value sits - but even then it is affected in term of sales price by anything from decor to configuration inside to location within the estate to how well the next-door neighbours maintain their garden!

the concept is as flawed as any other 😁

So basically it would harm both people in the south and the north. A bad idea all round, I'd say.

The many low income people in the south already struggle to afford a home, let alone council tax. And I know from people in London that public services there are pretty much non existent (they're not much better in my area actually, which isn't London).

And then there's your point about the NE.

A much better change imo would be a local tax based on income, but essential public services funded nationally - with good standards of service and good access wherever in the UK. The local income tax could either go into the national "pot" for these services or be used for non essential but good to have services.

Re London. It has the highest house prices in the UK - but also one of the highest levels of deprivation. (Yes there's some very wealthy people there but it's a city of extreme inequality). Also some of the lowest wages
https://www.timeout.com/london/news/the-five-lowest-paid-areas-in-the-uk-are-all-in-london-022424

My mum is recently widowed and just into the boundary of not getting winter fuel allowance anymore. She also has stage 4 cancer. To slap her with the loss of her single person council tax discount is just wicked. I have 2 autistic siblings, both living alone (separately). They'd get slapped by it as well. One of them is a teacher with barely enough money to run his flat anyway. This government hates people who have worked hard - even for modest achievements - like a flat, a full state pension etc.

It's gross. They aren't going for the super rich. They are going for ordinary citizens who have done the right thing.

Commit domestic violence = get out of prison early.
Be a teacher living alone in a little flat = pay more you bastard.
Be Keir Starmer = get £100k of freebies. Don't pay tax on it.

Just wrong.

I'm sorry your mum is caught up in it but they are going for the super rich.

Super rich pensioners for whom it made no sense whatsoever to get a fuel allowance. Most of the wealthiest people in the country are over 65.

I think more people should get help with energy bills though, and not just pensioners.

Do you really think they are going to spend a fortune on a new system and be content with the same take home?
No. It'll be used as a stick to put bills up.

Yep - one neighbour has just sold their identical house for £30k under valuation because they needed to sell ASAP (landlord selling their portfolio). Another is about to sell for even less because the place is falling down internally due to a huge water leak they've ignored for years and it's now been repossessed by the mortgage company.

These will cause us issues as we want to sell this next year but won't be giving away £30k+ discounts....

There's also the idiot opposite who has seen their sale fall through three times in a year as soon as the survey comes back - they've knocked into their garage and I am absolutely certain it's been done without building regs compliance. They are also claiming to include off road parking they don't own, so good luck to the new buyer...

The 25% Council Tax deduction is not ending. It is a rumour.

Also, releasing prisoners early would have happened whichever party got in power.

I'm uncomfortable with stamp duty being done away with. I bought my house more than 2 decades ago and paid the stamp duty at the time. I would be really angry to have to pay another tax in place of stamp duty now. I pay my council tax already. That is enough.

This government is simply a robber. Legalising ways to pick people's pockets.

I already pay so much council tax and receive next to nothing for it. A bin collected every 3 weeks. That's really it. I don't know what else the council do for me. They just rob me.

Nope, on the basis that we'll be taxed on property value.

Whilst property is an asset, it's also a home, it would be very difficult to move simply because we'll be priced out based on council tax.

Bedroom tax is for council tenants and right or wrong shouldn't be linked to council tax.

And Nope to landlord paying council tax, it's the tenant that uses services like bin collection.

Pretty much the same here although we're lucky we get a fairly good bin collection.

High council tax though and my council is known locally for crap services so it's not as if the money is being well spent on vulnerable people here.

I agree about stamp duty too. And it will inflate house prices even more.

Assuming it would even apply in Scotland as most things don't... I would absolutely love this as it would cut my monthly council tax (over 12 not 10) by two thirds.

The possibility of the abolition of single occupancy discount - eh. I don't think I'd agree with that, if anything it should be higher than 25%.

So people renting wouldn't pay council tax as it would be paid by the landlord?

The old Rates system was like that.

However I'm sure the landlords would just pass it on through increased rent.

"A non-variable amount wouldn't work unless they changed the way councils are funded - council budgets do not always reflect the sum total of property values in an area."

Absolutely. We live in Bucks, where the houses are expensive, but the council passes all they receive to central government. Yes, really. So there's diddly squat available for roads, social care etc. Unfortunately, too many people assume that because our council taxes are high, that the council is rich. It isn't. This could be a disaster for us.

I would love to see stamp duty reduced or eliminated altogether. It's the single most egregious tax we have, and has had a huge effect on the ability of people to move. It's had a huge effect on our economy because of this, and is a big reason behind escalating house prices.

During Covid, Sunak did the stamp duty holiday. The consequence was inflating already inflated house prices. Terrible for FTBs and also bad for people who need to move on from their starter home bought before children to a family home.

And the main housing problem in the UK is the shortage of social housing.

It was a short term effect during a time when few people wanted to move house. House prices would come down in the longer time with more fluidity in the market, as there would be more houses on the market. Currently, people have to factor in the SD cost into the house they are selling to ensure they can buy their next house. Without that cost, prices would come down quickly.

It’s like this in Canada, I’ve only ever seen it go up as property values go up.
only the actual home registered owner gets the initial bill. But I’m sure that cost is passed into renters (regardless of who the tenant (student pensioner etc).
the worse house on the best block will pay more due to higher value homes locally. A smattering of fixed up homes on a bad street will also drive up property value hence taxes.
It’s a good moneymaker for the city.