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Can't afford to keep the house warm - £800 p/m?!

162 replies

CinnamonSwirl82 · 19/01/2023 11:58

I'm cold, I'm miserable, I'm skint.

Tried heating the house to maintain 18 across the day and it cost £25. Even turning it on for an hour in the morning (doesn't heat anything) and an hour in the evening pre-bed costs us £15 a day. We keep all the lights off, everything is turned off at the plug and we now just use the biofuel fireplace for heat/light in the evening. All for the cheap price of £11 a day.

I'm feeling absolutely miserable that I have to sit in a cold, dark house and spend £350 p/m for the pleasure of it. Thats over £4k per year. It's only myself and my partner so we don't need to keep the house warm for kids and we can sit in the dark with a couple of candles/fireplace. We live in a 3 bed semi 1970s build.

How is this right? Where on earth did the government pull their figure of £2.5k bill for the average family from? We're less than the average family living in the average home.

I'm contemplating getting in to debt just so it doesn't feel like my nose is going to fall off my face and my joints stop hurting 😭

OP posts:
Thread gallery
7
NewBootsAndRanty · 19/01/2023 15:04

GasPanic · 19/01/2023 14:52

OP used 28 kWh yesterday.

Sky box uses 30W, which is 24*0.03 kWh per day = 0.72 kWh per day.

So unless she is running (28/0.72)=39 Sky boxes simultaneously then they can't explain why she is using so much electric.

I'm in a 1 bed flat on my own, but that's more than my usage for the whole of last week including 3 lots of washing and tumble drying.

NewBootsAndRanty · 19/01/2023 15:06

@CinnamonSwirl82
Download the app on
loop.homes/ to get an accurate view of your usage.

CinnamonSwirl82 · 19/01/2023 15:09

GasPanic · 19/01/2023 14:52

OP used 28 kWh yesterday.

Sky box uses 30W, which is 24*0.03 kWh per day = 0.72 kWh per day.

So unless she is running (28/0.72)=39 Sky boxes simultaneously then they can't explain why she is using so much electric.

@GasPanic we have Sky Q too so maybe 35 boxes 🤣 or 25 if we include the TVs.

@hedgehoglurker fridge freezer is less than 6 months old. I looked it up and it uses the equivalent of 40p per day.

We don't have any exotic pet heaters. Just run a 750w heater for a few hours max during the night to bring the room to a decent temp for the rest of the day. They're not 'exotic' in the sense of lizards, etc, but they're certainly not the equivalent of a dog.

Probably powering their hot tub!

OP posts:
needastrongoneagain · 19/01/2023 15:16

Good post @larkstar

GasPanic · 19/01/2023 15:17

OP you need to check your actual usage on the meter. Once you have that, if it doesn't compare with what the smart meter is saying you can go to the supplier and explain that there is a discrepancy and they will probably take you more seriously.

Everything else is a distraction, no matter how much TV you watch.

If you need any help on how to do it let me know.

CinnamonSwirl82 · 19/01/2023 15:18

NewBootsAndRanty · 19/01/2023 15:06

@CinnamonSwirl82
Download the app on
loop.homes/ to get an accurate view of your usage.

@NewBootsAndRanty just downloaded this! Takes a couple of days to register but I'll definitely take a look at it once it's done

OP posts:
ElBandito · 19/01/2023 15:20

If the underfloor heating was put in when the house was built I suspect it's electric, not water. Houses like this often have an economy meter. If you aren't using the UF heating then you really need to come off economy 7.

Having said that there is something very, very wrong. You are using more electricity than we do in a 5 bed house, even on our very highest usage days.

Onwayoutsoon · 19/01/2023 15:32

Four bed house - all rads on 6.30am - 10pm at night - usual cooker washing machine usage etc - thermostat set at 20 degrees, highest day ever on that last cold snap we had was £17 - usually it’s around £8.50/£10 per day currently this winter - I hope you get it sorted soon, your bones aching must be terrible and not good for you at all 😕

CinnamonSwirl82 · 19/01/2023 17:13

larkstar · 19/01/2023 15:03

You're paying for sky...and complaining you can't afford to heat your house - do you need to re-evaluate your priorities and think hard about what you are spending your money on?

You came for advice. Unequivocally - something does not stack up - something is wrong - you are overlooking something. Do you want to reduce your bills or not? You're going to have to accept that you are going to have to look harder to get to the bottom of this - and maybe explain a bit more about your house.

It seems like you don't have a clue about where to start looking - you've mentioned lights and laptops and miscellaneous things that generally use very little energy. OK - one question - is your laptop several years old? Does it basically run flat pretty quickly when you disconnect it from the mains? It could be that your laptop battery is so dead that it's continually charging - you might be better off taking the battery out and just running it off the mains...anyway.

Are you sure your underfloor heating "system" is off - just because you can't feel it producing any heat - isn't there an electric pump in the system that circulates the water - is that actually running? Do you know where it is - can you hear it running?

If you've looked at any of the other threads - it's been mentioned by me and a couple of others - an old fridge/freezer could be using a lot more electricity than you think - can you hear it rumbling into life on a regular basis? At night? The pump (compressor) circulates the coolant IF the thermocouple (which might also need to be checked) tells it to operate because the F/F is not cold enough - the compressor turns the coolant gas back into liquid and the liquid is circulated - the liquid uses heat (takes heat) from the contents of the fridge and evaporates - this is fine normally but a big problem, a common problem in many old appliances because the coolant has leaked out of the system - the F/F keep operating to circulate a small amount of coolant around the F/F to try and keep the contents cool. My 25 yo F/F was using 25-30% of all my electricity - I used a power measuring plug to check how much it was using - I replaced it and it paid for itself in 18 months.

Things like washing machines. dishwashers, tumble driers, electric showers, electric ovens - these are what you should be looking at. Check the basics:-

Washing machine - we use it on 30C programs (or 40C if we really need to) - typical wash time is 42mins. Once a week - only 2 adults - both of us recently retired so home most days.

Dishwasher - lowest temp - ours is 35C. Twice a week.

Fridge - ours on the highest temp possible 5C

Freezer - ours is on the highest temp possible -18C

I use my oven as little as possible - once a week is accurate. If I do put it on - I shove a load of potatoes in too and leave them to cook in the heat left in the oven after I've turned it off.

People overlook the fact that your gas boiler also uses electricity - when was the last time you had that serviced? The more often your boiler kicks into life, the more electricity it will use - it's not a huge amount but enough for me to notice in my daily electricity readings that it's been a cold day.

You and I can live in the same design of house with the same boiler and the thermostats set to the same temp (say 18C) yet mine might use far less gas to heat that your simply because my house is better insulated - your boiler might be turning on and burning gas to keep pushing your thermostat back up to 18C several times more often than mine so of course your will be using a lot more gas than me; insulation does matter - it's not just about the temperature you set the thermostat to. Have you thought about your insulation? I currently have foil bubble wrap (the sort you normally put behind radiators) Velcro'd to a number of windows and doors - it's ugly but I'd rather not give the money to energy companies and spent it on something else so I'm making an effort to save what I can.

I'm with Shell and their rates are:-
Unit rate per kWh: Elec - 36.448p
Unit rate per kWh: Gas - 10.344p
Standing charge: Elec - 48.59p per day
Standing charge: Gas - 28.48p per day

Dec Elec usage - £78.84 (excluding standing daily charge) / 31 days = £2.54/day
Dec Gas usage - £166.28 (excluding standing daily charge) / 31 days = £5.36/day
Total = £245.12

Dec - Elec standing charge = 31 x £0.4859 = £15.06
Dec - Gas standing charge = 31 x £0.2848 = £8.83
Total = £23.89

Total for Dec = £269.01

My situation is very similar to @7yearsbadluck who said:-

I WFH and live in a 4 bed 1960's semi and have the heating on 18 degrees for 3-4 hours a day (doesn't get below 16 degrees in the daytime)... exactly the same for me: 1960's semi - it's never higher than 18C - mine is on most of the day - but if I can stand it at 17C or 16C - because I'm wearing warm clothes (Marino wool bae layers!), busy in the house or been in the garden or walking the dog etc - then I turn it down. It's put down to 15C at night - not that it come son unless it's exceptionally cold overnight - it was -5C a couple of nights back - I heard the boiler kick in then some time in the middle of the night.

Look - it's horrible to be cold and worried about the bills but you've got to find out where all the electric and gas (and heat) is going because - your bills/usage seem higher than you can account for - unless there is a problem with your meter (unlikely IMHO - I used to work as an electronics and software engineer for companies that made electricity meters!) or with your billing information/meter readings. Is a previous debt being recovered on your bill for instance?

Can you get an electrician to come in and look at your usage and try to pinpoint where the electricty is being used?

@larkstar

You're paying for sky...and complaining you can't afford to heat your house - do you need to re-evaluate your priorities and think hard about what you are spending your money on?

  • Sky is £42 a month. I WFH - I need internet. Our TV package costs £20 and includes Netflix so we don't pay for any other subscriptions. What we pay is minimal compared to what most people pay just for their internet alone. If I heated the house to a constant 18 it would cost £800 a month. I don't think cutting out sky is going to benefit me in any way, unless I want to start spending at least £50 a week on petrol to drive in to the office because I've no way of working.

You came for advice. Unequivocally - something does not stack up - something is wrong - you are overlooking something. Do you want to reduce your bills or not? You're going to have to accept that you are going to have to look harder to get to the bottom of this - and maybe explain a bit more about your house.

  • That's why I'm asking. Something is wrong and I know it is

It seems like you don't have a clue about where to start looking - you've mentioned lights and laptops and miscellaneous things that generally use very little energy. OK - one question - is your laptop several years old? Does it basically run flat pretty quickly when you disconnect it from the mains? It could be that your laptop battery is so dead that it's continually charging - you might be better off taking the battery out and just running it off the mains...anyway.

  • it's a year old work laptop. I charge it up in the morning whilst working then it lasts the remainder of the day. It then doesn't get plugged back in until the next morning.

Are you sure your underfloor heating "system" is off - just because you can't feel it producing any heat - isn't there an electric pump in the system that circulates the water - is that actually running? Do you know where it is - can you hear it running?

  • Yes. I've switched it off at the fuse.

If you've looked at any of the other threads - it's been mentioned by me and a couple of others - an old fridge/freezer could be using a lot more electricity than you think - can you hear it rumbling into life on a regular basis? At night? The pump (compressor) circulates the coolant IF the thermocouple (which might also need to be checked) tells it to operate because the F/F is not cold enough - the compressor turns the coolant gas back into liquid and the liquid is circulated - the liquid uses heat (takes heat) from the contents of the fridge and evaporates - this is fine normally but a big problem, a common problem in many old appliances because the coolant has leaked out of the system - the F/F keep operating to circulate a small amount of coolant around the F/F to try and keep the contents cool. My 25 yo F/F was using 25-30% of all my electricity - I used a power measuring plug to check how much it was using - I replaced it and it paid for itself in 18 months.

  • the fridge is 6 months old. It's set to -19 on the freezer and 4 on the fridge - manufacturers recommended temp. I've looked it up and it uses 40p a day (from the Beko website). Never hear it rumbling in to life. Just never hear it.

Things like washing machines. dishwashers, tumble driers, electric showers, electric ovens - these are what you should be looking at. Check the basics:-

Washing machine - we use it on 30C programs (or 40C if we really need to) - typical wash time is 42mins. Once a week - only 2 adults - both of us recently retired so home most days.

Dishwasher - lowest temp - ours is 35C. Twice a week.

Fridge - ours on the highest temp possible 5C

Freezer - ours is on the highest temp possible -18C

I use my oven as little as possible - once a week is accurate. If I do put it on - I shove a load of potatoes in too and leave them to cook in the heat left in the oven after I've turned it off.

  • washing machine doesn't go on until night. It goes on a 30 wash and in the morning it barely makes an impact on the meter. Dishwasher is always on eco mode and fully loaded. Never a half empty wash. Goes on every 2-3 days. Likewise we do washing once a week.

People overlook the fact that your gas boiler also uses electricity - when was the last time you had that serviced? The more often your boiler kicks into life, the more electricity it will use - it's not a huge amount but enough for me to notice in my daily electricity readings that it's been a cold day.

  • Aug 2022. The whole house electrics were also checked (we bought and the previous owners were very thorough). Don't use it other than heating the water for a bath in the evening so it's not on and off during the day.

I do appreciate you taking the time to write all that out. This isn't the first house I've had and I know what I use and this is over 3x the amount I normally pay. It's only become an issue since getting those new meters installed.

OP posts:
NewBootsAndRanty · 19/01/2023 17:24

Your EPC certificate should show how many kwh for each fuel you should expect to use annually for heating/lighting/water.

NewBootsAndRanty · 19/01/2023 17:37

www.gov.uk/find-energy-certificate

HumourReplacementTherapy · 19/01/2023 17:49

Can you show a copy of your bill rather than your smart meter?

Pootle40 · 19/01/2023 18:24

It's got to be electric heating / heating water.......it has to be if everything else you've said is true and your bills show same usage as your in home display.

NewBootsAndRanty · 19/01/2023 18:25

re the Epc, i got that slightly wrong - it'll say how many kwh you're expected to use for space and water heating per year - it doesn't have anything for electric use specifically.

Calmdown14 · 19/01/2023 18:28

When you say it jumps up after a bath is that gas or electric?
If it's electric then it suggests you do have an immersion heater.

I've just used the hob and air fryer for half an hour each and the meter has gone up 2kwh if you need a comparison. TV and lights on at same time

RedRiverShore3 · 19/01/2023 18:30

What is your split with economy 7, it should it should be about 40% day, 60% night to be money saving. Is your meter changing correctly at the right times, check it isn't stuck on day rate or something like that

JorisBonson · 19/01/2023 18:37

Omg just ring them 🤦🏻‍♀️

RedRiverShore3 · 19/01/2023 18:42

JorisBonson · 19/01/2023 18:37

Omg just ring them 🤦🏻‍♀️

That's easier said than done if they are anything like British Gas

NewBootsAndRanty · 19/01/2023 18:45

Octopus are really easy to get hold of on the phone.

Op have you looked at your balance forecast on your account (online but not on the app)? It uses information from the past 12 mths - including previous tenants to work out your projected use.

JorisBonson · 19/01/2023 18:46

RedRiverShore3 · 19/01/2023 18:42

That's easier said than done if they are anything like British Gas

I'm with octopus (same as op) and they're great on the phone

Coconut212 · 19/01/2023 19:02

CinnamonSwirl82 · 19/01/2023 12:47

@Perfect28 on an economy 7 tariff. 44p per kWh electric during the day and 15p during the night (washing machine gets run during the night). One bill we had did include a government discount so I'm assuming we're paying 33p during the day.

Gas is 0.11p per kWh.

There’s your issue your on the wrong meter, economy 7 is used for electric storage heaters and not properties with gas central heating

Athenen0ctua · 19/01/2023 19:05

Coconut212 · 19/01/2023 19:02

There’s your issue your on the wrong meter, economy 7 is used for electric storage heaters and not properties with gas central heating

It can't just be that. I think they said they were using something like 27kwh in electric a day. That's incredibly high, the average is 8kwh.

TimeForMeToF1y · 19/01/2023 19:21

Coconut212 · 19/01/2023 19:02

There’s your issue your on the wrong meter, economy 7 is used for electric storage heaters and not properties with gas central heating

It's clearly not the issue The OPs told us what her usage and it's about three times higher than an average house. That's what needs to be addressed. Ignore the economy 7 and find out which is the problem appliance
But first of all, double check that your in home display is showing you the actual usage

RedRiverShore3 · 19/01/2023 19:23

Is the in house display correct, does it match the meter and the bill, have you checked from the actual meter. Is your gas being calculated properly, old meters are cubic feet, newer ones are cubic metres, yours should be metres.

RedRiverShore3 · 19/01/2023 19:27

What is your electric background OP, it's usually about 100, though ours is up to 200 because we have 2 fridges and 3 freezers - don't ask😬