Interesting article in todays Guardian

[HelpfulMonkey]

www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2023/feb/06/covid-was-devastating-why-are-we-pretending-it-didnt-happen

There lots of debate on here so I thought people might find this interesting.
Does seem a lot of people want to brush Covid away and get on which is good, but it's also really important to know what actually went on and if anything dodgy happened so it can be avoided in future

@HelpfulMonkey

Real people as in people in every day life who speak freely and interact without the constraints on online communication, there is loads of censorship online.

Lots of people have an interest in controlling conversation online, MHRA, government, drug companies, people with a financial interest, the internet is a source of information for lots of people so if you can control that you can make money or get influence.

It's not a 'conspiracy', it's pretty obvious that lots of entities have an interest in manipulating the narrative in this area (even foreign governments trying to cause trouble as well) and there has been stuff in the papers about this: bigbrotherwatch.org.uk/2023/01/daily-mail-77th-brigade-spied-on-lockdown-critics/
It's a really interesting area:
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9100573/

There really isn't a great deal of censorship online - I'm not sure where you get that idea. Even in the 'Twitter Files' you've spoken of before didn't reveal a great deal. Even when the lockdowns were in operation, you could read plenty of criticism online.

There is no 'Big Brother' link doesn't have much substance beyond frightening headlines. The second link is interesting, but is specific to Russia. That is a quite different place to inhabit than, say, London.

The other point I'd note about the media is it is overwhelmingly controlled by the right-wing. Have you heard of Rupert Murdoch? Look up his media empire and then you might begin to see who is pulling the strings - and it is not the Left.

Sorry for the bold fail!

MeetPi you say there's nothing alarming in the BB report

if that's your view, of course you are entitled to it

but I did wonder if you read it. I was invited to the launch - I might not have done more than a quick scan if not for that invite. I find a lot to be concerned about but as I say, I appreciate others might not be worried.

bigbrotherwatch.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2023/01/Ministry-of-Truth-Big-Brother-Watch-290123.pdf

Just a heads up, the Covid & shame book mentioned upthread is free to read online under OA.

www.bloomsburycollections.com/book/covid-19-and-shame-political-emotions-and-public-health-in-the-uk/

I've read parts of it - not all, as it's a long report. It would be more useful without inflammatory language and obvious deep bias.

I'm not surprised by any of the pieces I have read. Social media was awash with all kinds of claims, and of course plenty of bad actors saw an opportunity to incentivise Covid or destabilise other countries. This is likely why units like CDU existed (if it did exist). Remember the claim 'Covid is just a cold!' That's Russian disinformation. Russian troll farms ran 24/7 spreading disinformation such as this. Deliberate misinformation from bad actors such as this delivered to vulnerable audiences is incredibly harmful.

This is a fascinating read about Covid disinformation - and its source - for balance.

journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0245900#pone.0245900.ref031

Thanks. I see MN gets a mention!

Yes, I've been banging on about this for ages on here - the expected rise in early-onset Parkinson's. People are so keen to shout "lockdown lover" if you mention any facts. I think we established ostriches don't actually put their heads in the sand, but since the first warnings and mentions of Covid in the media, right through the pandemic, and now - when the pandemic isn't actually over - people have shown a remarkable propensity to not want to believe it is happening, or might have any significant effect on them personally (only on the "expendables" in their minds, perhaps). This, from 2020:

www.abc.net.au/news/2020-09-23/covid-19-may-cause-parkinsons-disease-research-finds/12688384

For me, the country (and the world?) hasn't remotely come to terms with what went on during the pandemic. From my personal perspective, I'm talking about the enforced total isolation, the nightly dose of fear, the obsession with deaths, the way people turned on each other, the way that authority and business appeared to revel in their new powers, the insistence that the tiniest pleasure of freedom was somehow harming others.

It was utterly bizarre, and I think I've reason why people aren't talking about it is because they are completely embarrassed about their behaviour.

I'd expect there to be at least some people having shame responses and trauma responses, and obviously being reluctant to talk about it is common when experiencing those emotions.

Oh stop not this nonsense again, “lockdown light”.

there was nothing “light” about education and livelihoods being destroyed for months on end.

I was always opposed to any restrictions and think we should just have taken what came. All lockdown seems to have done is cost a fortune, cost lots of harm, and kicked the can down the road for the NHS.

one thing is for sure never again will the state tell me who I can and can’t have in my private dwellinghouse ever again.

I'm never very convinced by the argument that locking down earlier in 2020 could've made it shorter, because the easing of restrictions in the UK didn't track with deaths or hospital admissions at that time. Those had gone way down by May, but we remained locked down. Obviously ymmv as to whether this was a good thing or not, but it's something that does need to at least be acknowledged and factored into any discussion.

I was aware of this way back at the start of the pandemic. Viruses doing this stuff isn’t new. It was obviously a likely risk, and arguably almost impossible to avoid with a virus like this. It doesn’t mean that the way lockdowns and restrictions were handled was right or effective.

Public services were creaking before the pandemic and they're worse than ever now.

I know 3 people with Cancer that wasn't confirmed until the only treatment options are palliative. That's not from a lack of trying to get a diagnosis.

Other issues are more wooly. At the moment, it seems like my younger DC, late primary and early high school, haven't been too badly affected by the lockdowns. My DS 1, in his 20s, and my younger niece and nephews seem to have been much more affected.

My DS hasn't really been able to start a life of his own and the little ones really missed out with not having any pre school interactions.

The article is not about lockdown, and my response was not about lockdown.

Oh how interesting! This ties in with what my neurologist has been seeing (Covid is almost certainly implicated in my Parkinson’s, only just diagnosed as thought was ‘just’ long Covid causing my symptoms).

I have noticed that covid masks are doing a roaring trade with suspects going in court! Hats too, and protective eyewear. I wonder if those same people are usually so considerate! 😄