Current guidelines are irresponsible

[Rookiemistake]

I am on my second bout of Covid in 8 months despite being fully vaccinated. I have been ill both times, pretty incapacitated for two days and a bit more functional for the last three. Regardless, it has been disruptive and I am healthy with no underlying conditions. My teen ds has also had it for the first time. He was similar to me and about to start mocks for his A Levels.

Talking to someone the other day and they said it'll be like flu and we'll learn to live with it. It's not like flu. I'm 43 and I've had flu twice in my whole life yet I've already had this twice in less than a year.

I have stayed at home and will do until I either test negative or reach 10 days and am not symptomatic. However, I could if I choose, just go around as normal. My ds was allowed back into school after three days if he felt well. He didn't go but he could have as he was feeling much better by day 4. He would have still been spreading it and there are kids at school and on his bus in the middle of their GCSE's. I just think we are being entirely irresponsible. This is not a cold.

I'm not advocating a full lockdown but I think there needs to be more stringent controls if people are knowingly positive.

What do others think?

Flu was worse for me. I couldn’t get out of bed. Covid wasn’t pleasant and I struggled with my breathing at one point, but I’d rather have Covid to be honest.

there needs to be more stringent controls if people are knowingly positive.

Then why not introduce those controls for people who might have Epstein Barr, RSV, Chickenpox, flu (+ dozen others I forget about)? I mean fine if society decides to do that, but it's going to cost an absolute fortune to do successfully.

I await the dystopian novel when people test themselves every morning for 50 different germs before they are allowed to step outside.

Yanbu. New Covid variants keep emerging and there’s no real plan about the long term future of managing this virus.

Those who are in high risk occupations or CEV are left to work it out for themselves.

If you’re self employed or don’t have sick pay you either lose money by isolating or you carry on whilst infectious.

There’s no scientific definition of long Covid and no real treatment path.

Healthcare is still badly affected and we will all be affected by long waiting lists for treatments. I suspect this will enable the current govt to privatise the NHS.

Masks, social distancing, testing, tracking should be standard but people are resistant. Ideally sick pay should be offered but it’s expensive..

Covid is still very new to science and we’re faced with new variants every few months. We don’t know how these variants will behave in the future. Will one come along which will be more dangerous? It’s a very different virus to the ones you mention and there are limited treatments for Long Covid. It doesn’t seem sensible to just let it rip.

Who takes paracetamol every 4 hours, just in case they get a headache?

Someone who is highly likely to be hospitalised if they get a headache would do that.

My DF is eighty years old with COPD and borderline diabetes. Having a vaccine every few months probably makes the difference between Covid putting him in bed or putting him in hospital. You're damn right he's going to trot up for a booster vaccine whenever he's invited and is perfectly happy to do that indefinitely.

I'm fifty and female. Nobody's invited me for any more jabs yet but if I'm invited for an annual booster along with my autumn flu jab then I'll be more than happy to go.

It’s not deadly now though, it’s time
to get on with life. You can test and isolate if you wish, I don’t know anyone at all still doing this.

Tellthe families of the hundreds of thousands that have died that it's a 'minor virus'

For the love of the pixies I wish people would stop trotting out the "tell the families" crap. Stop using families like mine for point-scoring, we're not a hive mind. Whilst Covid killed my mum, it presented as no worse than a heavy cold to a great many people. I have no issue with people making their own choices wrt isolating or not, just because I lost someone I loved.

I could have written this myself.
And the only people who I know who are always getting covid have all been jabbed.

I agree with you OP.

100% this. YANBU

That you are deluding yourself.

There is neither the public appetite nor the resources for controls like the ones you advocate for here. Even if it were clear that less harm would be caused by them, which it's not.

In order for any controls to have any point, you'd have to reintroduce universally available free tests. Otherwise people simply won't do it. Pay to test so you can be stuck on SSP for two weeks? Yeah, right. So free testing access would be needed and that would have to be funded.

Reintroducing free tests would then return us to the situation we had until earlier this year, when we had a system that theoretically meant people could be legally obliged to isolate without any guarantee of sufficient financial support to keep fed and housed. That system was so shit, and so unsustainable after nearly two years of it that it was widely ignored. Testing and isolation as universal concepts were being broken down by the time we got rid of them anyway. Some people were doing it, sure, but many more had simply opted out.

There are a lot of reasons why testing and isolation measures are no longer going to be accepted and adhered to across society, and you won't be able to reintroduce them all simply by bringing back legislation. Even if you have a good reason why you'd like to.

The wider population should no longer have
to face restrictions. It’s ludicrous to think otherwise.

Where is the real world evidence that masks as people actually wear and use them are an effective tool to curb the transmission of Omicron variants? Earlier strains in the pandemic that weren't as contagious, yes there was some reasonable evidence. That's not been the case with Omicron.

It would be better for any official advice to be that those who are worried and/or vulnerable should be wearing FFP3 masks, the sort that actually protect the wearer. I'd also like to see financial support offered for lower income vulnerable people who might not be able to afford them otherwise. A much better use of state funds than bringing back free universal testing, which would have to happen if renewed covid isolation rules were to be anything other than pointless.

I’ve had 3 jabs, worked with it on a ward, lived life out and about and worn masks when cases were high and never had it. So kinda disproves your theory there.

Our family have managed to dodge Covid for the last 2 years. However DH tested positive on Thursday and is coughing a lot and I've had a temperature of 38.2 - 39.1 since yesterday although was still testing negative yesterday.

We've cancelled our holiday as we were going with another couple and social distancing wasn't going to be possible. It was also quite an active holiday so we didn't think we'd be up to it. The holiday company were quite happy for us to go but equally willing to transfer the booking to another date - which we have done.
Do I think we should return to the isolation restrictions we had previously? - absolutely not.

Nope. I have no interest in any kind of restrictions. Covid is not going anywhere, so should we have measures in place forever?!

No this is ridiculous now. Thankfully I haven’t experienced anyone irl that has any serious concerns around covid for months and months. Including several who have been terrified throughout.

if you’re really ill then stay at home, same as you would with any bug.

This is an important question too. Where is the off ramp going to be? Or is the proposal that we don't have one?

It’s not a theory. It’s my own personal observations.

I've had covid five times, including twice so far this year. I currently have symptoms again (since Friday). I usually test three times a week but am currently testing daily, so far not positive but last time I had it I didn't test positive for a week after symptoms began so that's not a guarantee that I'm negative.

I'm five times vaccinated but am immunosuppressed, meaning the vaccines don't work as well (I don't get a good immune response) so I still catch it easily. Thankfully so far I've never been so ill I need hospital care, although the last time I had it in March I tested positive for almost four weeks and was very unwell.

However. During the second lockdown my mental health was so bad I was self harming for the first time in decades and contemplated suicide daily.

I also know that people cannot simply isolate whenever they have symptoms, or even if they test positive. Many employers insist staff come into work even if they're positive if they're well enough. I know people who have been on disciplinaries for not coming in while testing positive, and also people who have had to resort to using food banks and got into debt because they haven't been able to earn due to isolating.

Enough, now. So many sacrifices have been made. If I want to protect myself I'll do what I can to do so, just as I always used to in flu season, for example. Yes, the next infection I get (possibly the one I have right now) could be the one that sends me to hospital. But that's the shit thing about being immunosuppressed. So many things have the potential to cause harm. Covid is just another one to add to the list.

It's not that I'm not scared or worried - I am. But I'm also realistic enough to know that blanket restrictions are not the right course of action.

You’ve had flu more than twice in your life, you just haven’t felt particularly ill with it. This is where we’ll eventually get to with covid. Sounds like you were unlucky/react badly to it. I don’t know anyone whose second bout has been worse than a mild cold.

As I am sure you are aware, the vast majority of deaths occured in elderly people or those with underlying conditions

While I don't advocate further lockdowns, one of the most depressing things about the pandemic has been realising just how expendable many people think those who are vulnerable/older/live with underlying health conditions are.

Wrt to 'underlying conditions' - don't forget that millions of young, otherwise healthy people live with things like diabetes or autoimmune conditions. They have families, jobs, people who rely on them, full social lives and so on. Their conditions are often controlled by medication to the point where you might not even know they had a health condition in the first place.

Then along came covid and they had to shield, and were far more likely to die of what was a minor illness for many if they caught it.

It's been deeply traumatising for many people who lived full, normal lives pre-pandemic. And that's compounded by the narrative that only those with underlying conditions die from it. Only, as if we were lesser, somehow.

I wouldn't say older people or ones with underlying health conditions are more dispensable. It's just people understand they're more likely to get ill with Covid, as they would with flu. Most people stayed home for 2 years, never did this for flu or other illnesses.

@blebbleb why did most people stay home for two years?

Probably true. Most people will get flu once every five years or so.

But there's a huge difference in disease burden between that and getting Covid several times every year.

Recent strains are so enormously contagious that I honestly doubt that any feasible measures could have much of an impact on transmission. At this point the bottleneck for most people is their personal immunity. But saying that there's not a lot we can do doesn't make it OK.

The best news is that the latest pills can bring people with compromised immune systems the same protection that other people get from vaccines.

The other good news is that progress is still being made with new nasal vaccines to reduce transmission.