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Covid

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Original poster

How is everyone feeling about the new “targeted approach” that is being muttered about now?

60 replies

Waynemanor · 09/01/2022 15:24

I think they are hinting that only clinically vulnerable and elderly will be vaccinated? There seem to be experts coming out saying it is not practical (or necessary) to do population wild vaccinations in the future.
i have had two vaccines and booster myself and being told my immunity will wane now after 10 weeks is obviously disappointing. Admittedly I don’t really want to be boosted every 3 months but I am apprehensive about getting covid with zero protection from vaccine. Do we really know that omicron is milder? Or is it just because there are a lot of people with immunity now from either natural infection or vaccines? Once the vaccine immunity fades will it still be potentially dangerous to contract Covid? Just wondering what others thoughts are at this stage

OP posts:

MarshaBradyo · 09/01/2022 17:21

Re vaccinating the rest of the world are we approaching a time when it’s not as useful?

People will have had omicron or other, we still see high transmission with high vaccination rates - see Aus

How much does vaccine reduce mutation when there are high cases v natural immunity?

I feel like the we’re not safe until everyone is lacks scrutiny but maybe someone can talk through elements

Waxonwaxoff0 · 09/01/2022 17:24

Fine by me. I only got vaccinated so my life wouldn't be restricted, not because I'm worried about Covid.

Chloemol · 09/01/2022 17:27

It should be treated in the same way as the flu vaccine, so if you are entitled to the flu jab you get a covid one

rainrainraincamedowndowndown · 09/01/2022 17:30

If they take that approach, I hope they will offer it to the people who wants it but not in vulnerable/elderly category too. I haven't caught covid yet, as well as my family. I would like to keep it that way, or at least protected against it and long covid if I ever catch it. Recent studies has shown that the the vaccine reduces the chances of long covid and things like mis-c, so it's worth taking it, imo, until we know the long term effects of covid even if we may have it mild.

theemperorhasnoclothes · 09/01/2022 17:35

Omicron isn't milder than wild type covid - the one we locked down for in 2020, it's milder than Delta but Delta was more severe than Alpha which was more severe than wild type.

I think Omicron is about 50% more severe than wild type. Plus, obviously, more transmissible.

Covid is not the flu, even Omicron is not the flu. Covid is not the flu even with flu vaccines for vulnerable people - there are about 40x more deaths from covid than from flu even with the vaccine.

Omicron may be more severe for young children.

England particularly is a massive outlier worldwide compared to other 'rich' countries in the way we're approaching covid. We will have a more disabled, sicker population with worse quality of life.

Whitefire · 09/01/2022 17:40

@FourTeaFallOut

Presumably it will fall along the lines of flu vaccine eligibility? Seems sensible.

Yes this makes the most sense, with the opportunity for a private vaccine at Boots the same as for the flu one.

treeflowercat · 09/01/2022 17:46

@Waynemanor

Admittedly I don’t really want to be boosted every 3 months but I am apprehensive about getting covid with zero protection from vaccine.

This is scaremongering nonsense. No one credible scientist is saying that vaccines wane to zero protection. Vaccines appear to give long term protection against severe disease. The waning just means you're more likely to catch it, not that you'll be hospitalised or killed by it.

treeflowercat · 09/01/2022 17:49

@theemperorhasnoclothes

Omicron isn't milder than wild type covid - the one we locked down for in 2020, it's milder than Delta but Delta was more severe than Alpha which was more severe than wild type.

I think Omicron is about 50% more severe than wild type. Plus, obviously, more transmissible.

Covid is not the flu, even Omicron is not the flu. Covid is not the flu even with flu vaccines for vulnerable people - there are about 40x more deaths from covid than from flu even with the vaccine.

Omicron may be more severe for young children.

England particularly is a massive outlier worldwide compared to other 'rich' countries in the way we're approaching covid. We will have a more disabled, sicker population with worse quality of life.

You're comparing Covid with flu pre vaccine and pre antivirals. We've moved on from March 2020, though it seems some don't really want to do that, and seem to kind of revel in the dangers of Covid and don't want to face up to the fact that we've made big strides in dealing with it.

MarshaBradyo · 09/01/2022 17:58

I agree with Tree. Some people will go on about being in the worst position for a long time.

Most will appreciate moving on.

Bobholll · 09/01/2022 18:03

It’s not only vaccines. The antiviral drugs coming through are incredible. If Pfizer’s is as effective as they claim, it’ll basically stop covid being deadly to the vast majority of the population.

BoPeeple · 09/01/2022 18:07

@theemperorhasnoclothes

Omicron isn't milder than wild type covid - the one we locked down for in 2020, it's milder than Delta but Delta was more severe than Alpha which was more severe than wild type.

I think Omicron is about 50% more severe than wild type. Plus, obviously, more transmissible.

Covid is not the flu, even Omicron is not the flu. Covid is not the flu even with flu vaccines for vulnerable people - there are about 40x more deaths from covid than from flu even with the vaccine.

Omicron may be more severe for young children.

England particularly is a massive outlier worldwide compared to other 'rich' countries in the way we're approaching covid. We will have a more disabled, sicker population with worse quality of life.

Not sure where to start with all of that. Have you checked any of it or is it just opinion?

No one here has said Omicron is like the flu. They’re saying the vaccines should be targeted at the same people who get the flu vaccine.

Original poster

Waynemanor · 09/01/2022 18:10

Sorry it wasn’t supposed to be scare mongering. The government are literally in the middle of a campaign to tell us that omicron largely evades immunity from 2 vaccines. I just checked the actual figure in an imperial study which says it is 19%

OP posts:

BoPeeple · 09/01/2022 18:10

@treeflowercat

Exactly! The hysteria was brought on by (irresponsible) reporting and Pfizer marketing that said the double-vaccinated had ‘zero’ protection against Omicron. It simply wasn’t true! T-cell response holds up really, really well against Omicron, which protects against severe disease.

containsnuts · 09/01/2022 18:24

@MarshaBradyo

Re vaccinating the rest of the world are we approaching a time when it’s not as useful?

People will have had omicron or other, we still see high transmission with high vaccination rates - see Aus

How much does vaccine reduce mutation when there are high cases v natural immunity?

I feel like the we’re not safe until everyone is lacks scrutiny but maybe someone can talk through elements

But the point is that vaccination prevents severe disease -something even more important for people living with limited means and without access to health care.

camperqueen54 · 09/01/2022 18:27

All this talk of milder. I had long covid for a year post infection it was completely debilitating. Just because someone isn't dying in hospital it doesn't mean that the unvaccinated won't suffer significantly.

OliveTree75 · 09/01/2022 18:28

I think Omicron is about 50% more severe than wild type. Plus, obviously, more transmissible

Well just because you think it doesn't make it true.

Lazypuppy · 09/01/2022 18:28

Finally! Pleased to see it finally being reported that we have to live with this, and also seen today the SAGE people who estimated 75k deaths a day by this point finally admitting threy were (obviously) wrong!

Quartz2208 · 09/01/2022 18:31

@Waynemanor

From infection - because on a large scale that is a bad thing because more people get it, more people spread it and the hospitalisations and deaths rise because a small percentage of a huge number is large!

But on a personal level having 3 now should prevent serious infection and hopefully the longer term long covid issues which for the average person should be enough

The impact now of continuing vaccines on a huge scales is probably greater than not - think of all the medical personal who are seconded into delivering them and the impact continue to do so will have.

So now it makes sense just to target those who are more at risk of severe illness

Whitefire · 09/01/2022 18:34

@camperqueen54

At the moment we have no idea of the long term effects of Omicron. It may be that it is similar figures to any post viral fatigue, or it may be higher, we simply don't know yet.

User3456 · 09/01/2022 18:35

Generally uneasy. The more it spreads the more likely we are to get yet more variants (we thought Delta would out compete everything else, yet here we are within the space of 6 weeks with Omicron). We don't know enough about long covid from Omicron yet. And it seems 'mild' is defined as just not needing hospital. I know quite a few people who have been unpleasantly ill with it.
I'm still not keen on catching it...
NPIs might be the answer if we're not going to keep up with vaccinations. In particular ventilation/filtration in more public spaces
I don't think it's unrealisitic to have an annual vax in the same way that the flu vaccination is available annually. Hearing reports too that research is happening for a vaccine that will work on any variant (currently existing or new).
I agree with the comments that the rest of the world needs vaccinating also.

Madhairday · 09/01/2022 18:40

I'm happy as a CEV person to take any vaccines when needed but I do worry about long covid for people across the population with ONS showing over a million having that, as someone who suffers with chronic illness I know how people minimise long term illness and long covid just falls into one of those. I worry that if we just forget about covid there will be more disability across the population. And with the Tory record of completely decimating the support and benefits for those with disabilities it's a real worry. They were doing this before, they'll be doing it even more, slashing at every support budget. Same for those whose MH has worsened due to working in the NHS or bereavement etc, 9,000 children lost a parent to covid. MH support is in the gutter.

So I just think it's much more nuanced than thinking it can be solved by simply offering vaccines to the elderly and vulnerable.

Original poster

Waynemanor · 09/01/2022 19:37

I can’t believe they are also saying lft will no longer be widely available for free. It seems a bit early to be just throwing caution to the wind and doing away with them

OP posts:

SilverGlitterBaubles · 09/01/2022 19:37

I would prefer that vaccines went to those countries that have none rather than us having 3 or more vaccines and also when we have access to better treatments now.

Buzzinwithbez · 09/01/2022 20:20

I'd prefer that they went to people that felt they needed them.
Drop the mandates. Drop the pressure on people who only got vaccinated so that they had their covid passports and there might not actually be a massive population left who still want them.

NightmareSlashDelightful · 09/01/2022 22:40

I think Omicron is about 50% more severe than wild type

Whutnow?

50 mutations, yes. 50% more severe, don’t think so.

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