Ideas for testing little people

[ndo4000]

Waiting for a PCR test for my DD3. Anyone got ideas about how to actually swab a 3 year old?!? I tried to do a LFT and she wasn't having any of it!!

Any suggestions welcome!

I was prepared to do tickle stick, singing or whatever and DD has slept through the entire process twice. To be fair we've only needed to do them when she's been poorly and miserable enough to sleep through anything at naptime, having spent the nights awake and feverish.
I also did one myself at the same time, as I thought if she'd been breathing all over me and I couldn't swab her, then I might pick something up in my own. I just had cold symptoms without cough or fever, but the system let me book and I thought there was a high probability it would be a different response to the same germs.

www.gov.uk/government/publications/covid-19-stay-at-home-guidance/stay-at-home-guidance-for-households-with-possible-coronavirus-covid-19-infection

Just saw messages asking why we are doing this to our kids if they are so distressed. I have actually stopped now, but previously I've done it as I had to go to work and nursery would not accept him without a negative test result, or because he got a temperature the day before he was going on a flight.

No they can’t force you to test but if you don’t have a negative PCR result you have to self isolate for 10 days. So not feasible for most people with a young child who say develops a cough every month, who have to work?

@shreddednips so I know you've said his coughs linger, so probably a bit different to our situation. But for example, mine might have a temperature spike that will last 6-10 hours say, and then will be gone. If I mention PCR, that's them out of school until the negative result is back. Whereas if I watch and wait, they're back to normal within a day and we've all missed next to no work/school.

Shredded nips where did you hear that about pacey? I’m interested in a similar point and want to know the legal position.

@mswales

People just don't understand what the terror is like for some children. I can only test my four year old if there are two people to help me - one to hold down his arms and one to hold his head in a lock while I get the swab. All the while he is screaming and thrashing with the most visceral distress and fear I've ever seen in real life. When I try to do it in his sleep he immediately wakes up and pushes me away so I can't get a proper sample. It's absolutely horrendous. Can't believe people are judging - imagine what this experience is like for the parents who have to pin their kids down!

Exactly. It's miserable. But what can we do if it's the only way to get to work and provide? I'm in a constant state of stress wondering how on Earth we will manage when/if we catch Covid and have to isolate. We've already done several short isolations waiting for test results. We nearly got to the point of losing our home during the lockdowns, both of us were self employed and I was on maternity leave during most of my SEISS qualifying period so got very little. I really have no choice but to test him.

@Notoironing

Shredded nips where did you hear that about pacey? I’m interested in a similar point and want to know the legal position.

It's on the pacey website under FAQs. I think it depends what the childmjnder's coronavirus policy is, it recommends updating policies if childmjnders are uncomfortable accepting close contacts, for example.

www.pacey.org.uk/working-in-childcare/spotlight-on/coronavirus/faqs-coronavirus/#Omicron%20Variant

We used to have to do the car seat thing as well. DS was only just 2 when this all started and there was no other way. Couldn't really take a teacher and NHS worker out of action for 14 days every time either of the asthmatic children coughed! A combination of time and lateral flows changed everything though. We practiced at home with LFT swabs and now the children can do them effectively themselves. DD(6) loves being a scientist like mummy and can do the whole process herself (either LFT or PCR) and DS(3) goes on a bogey hunt (instead of bear hunt) but also swabs himself. Looks odd in the test centre examining the state of the bogeys on the end of a swab when he hands it over to me (and we make a big fuss of whatever he finds) but needs must!

Thank you.
I think my issue isn’t really covered by this as we are asked to do asymptomatic testing to be able to attend without any known close contact cases.

@Notoironing

Thank you. I think my issue isn’t really covered by this as we are asked to do asymptomatic testing to be able to attend without any known close contact cases.

Our childminder doesn't ask for that, I don't know whether they're legally allowed to or not 😬

Mswales —
My toddler would immediately cover her entire face with her arms in a serious headlock if a swab so much as touched her nose while she was asleep! Sleep testing did not work for us!

@humdingle

People who have pinned their child down to do test: why? Why did you HAVE to do the test?

I've taken my children for tests in the past. Younger children don't have to do the throat, only the nostrils, so that's a non-issue. But if your child would be traumatised by the test, why do it?

My youngest was terrified at the prospect of having to test. She hid when we were due to leave the house and was bawling when I found her. I told her she didn't have to do it and we left it at that.

We're in the UK in 2021 - you do not have to undergo any medical procedure without consent.

You're teaching a TERRIBLE message about body autonomy by pinning your child down to test them.

I take it you don't have a job or..?

@SmellyOldPartridgeinaPearTree you obviously haven't read all my posts, you would see that I do actually work full time 🙄

Shredded I think the answer is that they are not - not even staff or secondary age children are required to do asymptomatic testing! Certainly not primary or below but I’ve grudgingly gone along with it just for this week and next

@Notoironing that's the thing, so many people are going along with things because they think they have to. Your childminder shouldn't be forcing asymptomatic testing on young children, especially when it's so traumatic! All the best to you

Please sign this petition. There are other options for testing kids, it's just that our government have chosen not to support those.

petition.parliament.uk/petitions/598824?fbclid=IwAR1RVQgLwMn0fajsolp2T0qiARzoeO9mWDdNrJaF7hJkbUcXt5ilAPHMZVc

DS is 7 and you'd swear I was skinning a cat when I do his PCR tests. The screaming is horrific. Last time I had to basically swaddle him in a blanket and restrain him and perform the nose only PCR test.

After that I swore never again.

2 weeks later school phoned and said "he's saying he feels unwell can you collect him and return to school with a negative test." I cried.

I picked him up, kid was fine I watched him all night, run around the house, eat, no fever no cough, not unwell in the slightest. He had lied to leave school early, because he'd seen another kid do it, he confessed this as I opened the lateral flow test.

So....I ordered a home test, did it on myself and posted it back in his name to get the negative result so he could return to school 😳

If he does become genuinely unwell again with symptoms I'm just going to have bite the bullet and isolate him for 10 days. 🤦🏻‍♀️ God knows how I'll financially afford it though.

Thanks Humdingle
I have really pushed back. I have no idea if any parents did. I questioned and addressed it in person but the issue is essentially there are no other childcare options so we kind of have to suck it up
This entire thing is hideous and I can’t understand why other people don’t question things. Settings seem to make up their own rules - there is a thread about a toddler group demanding covid passports from adults - I can’t bear it all. I just want to hide under a rock until 2024.

[quote humdingle]@Notoironing that's the thing, so many people are going along with things because they think they have to. Your childminder shouldn't be forcing asymptomatic testing on young children, especially when it's so traumatic! All the best to you [/quote]
I agree that asymptomatic testing for small children is going too far. I can't criticise my childminder for expecting testing for close contact/symptoms though, she is a one-woman show and has her own children to support.

@humdingle

People who have pinned their child down to do test: why? Why did you HAVE to do the test?

I've taken my children for tests in the past. Younger children don't have to do the throat, only the nostrils, so that's a non-issue. But if your child would be traumatised by the test, why do it?

My youngest was terrified at the prospect of having to test. She hid when we were due to leave the house and was bawling when I found her. I told her she didn't have to do it and we left it at that.

We're in the UK in 2021 - you do not have to undergo any medical procedure without consent.

You're teaching a TERRIBLE message about body autonomy by pinning your child down to test them.

This^^

I tested my child once. Never again, unless it is medically necessary FOR THEM. The idea of bribing, forcing and cajoling small children to take tests teaches appalling lessons about bodily autonomy. The only time it’s acceptable to restrain a child in this way is for a medical procedure that is necessary for their own health.

@Megan2018

Strapped in pushchair or car seat, hold their arms down with one arm. Wedge head against the side with your elbow. Swab as fast as you can with the other. Ignore the screaming. Reward with favourite chocolate. DD2 has had about 13 I think now. It’s shit!

Sounds nice. Maybe someone could try it on you.

The idea of bribing, forcing and cajoling small children to take tests teaches appalling lessons about bodily autonomy. The only time it’s acceptable to restrain a child in this way is for a medical procedure that is necessary for their own health.

Young children don't know what is or isn't necessary for their own health, so actually to them it makes no difference in terms of what you're teaching them about bodily autonomy. If you're bribing, forcing or cajoling them to take medicine or have any vaccines or see a doctor or go to the dentist, it's exactly the same (in their understanding) as getting them to take an LFT.

I don't agree with doing regular tests on kids btw, but the point about bodily autonomy is not valid. A covid test is no different to all the other things you do that a child objects to.

@NuffSaidSam the point about bodily autonomy IS valid.

Undergoing a covid test is of no benefit to the child whatsoever - unless it means they can access critical care at hospital. After all, you'd let a sick child rest at home regardless of whether it was covid or not, so a diagnosis is not going to change your care for them.

Getting immunisations or dental care or some other medical care is of benefit - and the way to do it is to talk to the child about why it's important to look after the health of our bodies and to demonstrate that too by bringing them to our own dentist appointments (or getting family appointments) from a young age. It's utterly wrong to pin a child down to do anything other than immediate emergency life saving treatment.

Undergoing a covid test is of no benefit to the child whatsoever - unless it means they can access critical care at hospital.

But the child doesn't know that do they? So it actually has no different impact on their understanding of bodily autonomy than something which is to their direct benefit. That's why the bodily autonomy point isn't valid.

The psychological harm of a covid test is no greater than any other medical procedure you force a child into because they don't understand the issue of personal benefit Vs benefit to wider society. It's just a medical procedure they don't want.

It's only valid if your child has 100% body autonomy normally, and if you're a responsible parent they won't because at some point you'll have done something for them they didn't want (changed a nappy, used a car seat, put suncream on, given medicine, taken them for a vaccine etc).