Email from DfE to Headteachers. Schools prepped to shut again?

[AntiMaskersAreTwats]

Do you think this means it likely schools will shut again?

I have read it.

And thought it a step in the right direction. Both the extra steps and the re definition.

[quote toomuchlaundry]@MarshaBradyo so if schools never close will you stop worrying about vulnerable children, will you think that we will then have an acceptable level of vulnerable children. Because, let's face it that is what most people must have thought because they weren't up in arms, worrying about them before, questioning the level of funding in schools etc which impacted the lives of many children before COVID. Yes it has got worse during lockdown, but it wasn't starting from a level of zero, it was still starting from an unacceptable high level, but where were the posters on MN then? The only posters commenting were probably people in education and parents directly impacted, no-one else.

People start frothing at the mouth again, whenever there seems to be a threat about school closures, but they only talk about school closing, not the every day awfulness for children when schools are open[/quote]
‘Frothing at the mouth’?

Honestly it’s hard to have a conversation when people trot out this tired old stuff.

Yes I think as a society we need to adjust our response in favour of children. I’ve thought this for a while so I’m glad to see others think the same and I’m glad they are pushing through change.

@mrshoho

I haven't read on here that anyone is fighting it. The way you're bragging about it you seem to think this will solve the issue of schools having to close should cases get out of control. It won't!

Bragging?

You really love the ridicule on here don’t you. It’s why it’s an echo chamber re education.

I didn’t write it. I’m glad others are putting it forward though.

@noblegiraffe

There does seem to be very little concern about quality of education going on in schools.

Especially compared to the the outrage about poor quality of education delivered during closures. Was that simply because it made lives more difficult for parents?

You are so right.

If parents were really concerned about the quality of education, they would be protesting now.
Most are quiet because their child is in 'school' as in, in the building.

I oversee a number of schools. Staff illness and shortage means it is carnage as far as learning and a quality of education.
Teachers teaching remotely from the corridor across three classrooms, TA's taking classes, inconsistent supply cover, lots of time outside as one adult can supervise, classes doubled up learning unplanned.
In calls regarding the attendance and outbreak returns, DfE (let's remind ourselves- Dep for EDUCATION ) are insistent that schools are open, yet they don't even ask about the quality of EDUCATION provided.

What would be a step in the right direction would be money for all the services mentioned upthread which support our most vulnerable children.

What would be a step in the right direction would be mitigations to stop to spread of infectious illnesses in schools so that children aren't sent home because of no teachers as i know is happening in secondary schools or alternatively have the midday and caretaking staff babysitting them as I know is happening in local primaries.

Banning schools from closing is not any kind of step in the right direction. It's meaningless legislation.

We had the same through. Really it’s to make sure all policies are up to date, there’s enough planning “just in case” etc.
I really really don’t want us to close again - taking my own classes online as well as ensuring my own children are attending theirs in the other room is really tiresome.

@MarshaBradyo

I don’t get why anyone would fight it tbh.

It has growing support from children commissioners etc which is good to hear.

The children's commissioner who off rolled children when Ofsted came to call when she was a head? That one?

I know you are keen, marsha but there are other ways to keep schools open. Safely. This bill would prevent them having to bother about the safety of the children and of a workplace.

How and in what ways is a school like a nuclear power plant?

How and in what ways is a school like a nuclear power plant?

Well they might be under the same umbrella definition soon so there’s that.

I don’t think they have to be exactly the same - essential retail / hospital etc are different to each other.

I get you are not keen but tbh I don’t understand when looking back at last couple of years and impact it’s had on children.

It was on R4 as more people added support - not just the CC

@MarshaBradyo how many posts did you make about vulnerable children in schools and lack of funding in education in 2019? Do they compare to the number of posts you have made about schools closing in 2020 and 2021. Keeping schools open is not going to magically cure the issue of vulnerable children. If schools are not given extra funding for mitigation measures, supply etc to try and have enough staff (of whatever type) to keep schools open , then the services, staff etc they have to help vulnerable children will be cut, just to make sure the doors will be open. Having the doors open may help some children , but losing the specialist staff etc schools normally employ will impact many, many more children.

So don't just argue that schools need to be open, there is a lot more that needs to be done. So don't stop arguing if schools do remain open, so much more needs to be done and the Government need to hear from parents because they damn well don't listen to those in education.

*If parents were really concerned about the quality of education, they would be protesting now.
Most are quiet because their child is in 'school' as in, in the building. *

FFS how much of this superior shit gets spouted.

I don't know your personal circumstances, I won't presume that you have relatively straightforward circumstances, because how am I to know. But let me tell you mine.

I'm a single parent who's ex lives 3 hours away. He has our primary aged DC every other weekend. Never once had to worry about homeschooling. I work full time, I've recently had a promotion at work to try and do the best I can for myself and my children. I've worked for my employers for 18 months and in that time I've spent about 5 days in the office. I absolutely hate working from home, and trying to actually learn and be trained in an entirely new job from home, for the second time in 18 months, is bloody horrible. I've barely had any time to socialise with my colleagues in person, something that is really important to me. I'm exhausted after the past three years- escaping an abusive marriage, going back to work, moving, and then the pandemic on top of it all.

I care hugely about my DC and their education, but if you think I, and many others, have the time and energy on top of everything else going on in our lives, especially during the pandemic, to complain about the quality of education in schools (and as it goes I think my DC's school have done a bloody good job throughout the pandemic) I can only imagine that perhaps you don't have quite so much to be dealing with yourself. My DC are healthy and happy and they're doing alright. Sometimes, good enough is all that matters and I'm sick of judgement when some people have no idea what is going on on other people's lives.

Marsha,

You and I - in fact you and every teacher on this thread - have the same agenda - we want schools to be open for all children, and we want vulnerable children to get all the support they need, both from within schools and from outside agencies.

I assume that you also want the education of every child in school to be the best it can possibly be, because following the last 2 years, every child needs the best possible teacher in front of them consistently every day, the person who knows their subject; who knows the child's exact needs; and who works over the longer term (with a wider team if necessary) to meet them.

As I understand it, the only way in which you are different from other posters is that you think the bill going through Parliament is the best way to achieve this, and is sufficient, whereas teachers posting on this thread are not sure that just making a law to keep schools open is in any way sufficient to achieve what we all want, especially because it does not address the issue of what happens when the lack of covid mitigations in school removes the critical factor in a child's education - their teachers?

As I understand it, the only way in which you are different from other posters is that you think the bill going through Parliament is the best way to achieve this, and is sufficient

I think this is an interpretation.

I have said it’s a good step in the right direction. I am not against further action. Shifting the conversation towards children as a priority is a start and I’m glad to see.

@LumosSolem how long would you be happy for your child to be 'taught' by the caretaker, because that is pretty much what is happening in some schools, they are literally throwing any adult in the school into classrooms, to cover for ill teachers, and there is no supply left or they can't afford to pay supply. How do you think parents of Y11 children are feeling, when yet again they have an adult covering a GCSE class who has absolute no knowledge of the subject?

One headteacher I spoke to the other week joked that if Ofsted came calling the Inspector would have to cover a class whilst they did their inspection, as there were so few members of staff in

Can you explain, then, what you want that is different from what I want? You come across as combative, as if you are on a different 'side' from the teachers posting here, but I don't quite understand why and how?

You want schools to be open, and fully staffed, and focusing on children.

Teachers want schools to be open, and fully staffed, and focused on children?

@cantkeepawayforever

Can you explain, then, what you want that is different from what I want? You come across as combative, as if you are on a different 'side' from the teachers posting here, but I don't quite understand why and how?

You want schools to be open, and fully staffed, and focusing on children.

Teachers want schools to be open, and fully staffed, and focused on children?

Well that’s for the posters who have an issue with what I’m saying to answer.

I’m not combative

I have said I’m pleased about the bill and that’s pretty much it.

A lot of resistance to that - up to them to say why.

I have said why.

I don't think schools would be closed lightly. While the thought doesn't excite me, I want my children to safe and well first, education comes second. And teachers have a right to be so too. I'm sure many of the moaners would not be prepared to take thisr place under the same conditions and pay.

Yes so not sure why I need to explain why there is a difference of opinion.

Anyone reading thread can see the posts.

toomuchlaundry, I don't think that is fair to LumosSolem. As she says, from her current position, for her, 'good enough' is OK. I think that's an entirely reasonable position, and one that I completely understand - we all have periods of our lives where we can't 'man the barricades'. where personal circumstances mean that we may care about something but we are just plodding on putting one foot in front of another for the moment. I completely get that.

I would love it if those who DO have time, and energy, and passion could direct it to protesting about the quality of education, rather than shouting that 'schools must be open'. I feel their energy could be better directed. But I COMPLETLY get not having the energy to protest either way!

Because saying schools have to stay open doesn't help schools stay open one jot. It's quite straightforward.

No different from hospitals:

Legislate that they must stay open. Okay. But you can't make doctors and nurses and all the other staff not be ill or resign.

The building of a school or a hospital must stay open. Great. But there is not enough staff to treat people or to teach children. What now?

I have said I’m pleased about the bill and that’s pretty much it.

But why are you pleased about the bill, specifically? Given what you say you want to achieve, how does the bill do this? How do you think the bill being in place will change what is actually happens in schools - which is what you want to change - if nothing else changes?

Is the bill as useful as the CO2 monitors?

The building of a school or a hospital must stay open. Great. But there is not enough staff to treat people or to teach children. What now?

Yes, I think that's the but I don't get.

Marsha, you say you are pleased about the bill because it will keep the building open - but given what you say you care about (which is the bit that seems exactly the same as all the teachers care about too), I don't see how keeping the building open helps?

@LumosSolem - my circumstances??

I'm a senior adviser with an LA who is trying to make sure that all children receive a quality of education so they catch up.
I'm supporting schools to find staff, including following safeguarding procedures to make sure all of these different and unknown adults are safe to be in sole charge of your child.

(And a single parent, working 12 hours per day, with minimal leave since March 2020).
In fact, I worked all of my leave in 2020 to make sure that key worker hubs were open and that we staffed them with 'safe' volunteers.