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Covid

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Are secondary schools currently closing due to covid or just ours?

58 replies

altmember · 04/11/2021 01:53

My daughter's secondary school (she's in yr 8) has been closing to year groups on a rotational basis since the beginning of October. They said it was because of staff shortages due to covid and other illnesses. Apparently staff numbers are 1/3rd down, so they can't accommodate all the kids in at once.
So two out of 5 year groups has been 'working from home', on average about 2 days per week for the last month.

A month ago cases in the community were particularly high (peaked about 1100 per 100k), so the school being on it's knees wasn't surprising then. But cases have been progressively dropping since, and we're now down to about 300 per 100k locally. The school was struggling more and more getting towards half term, but they were confident the fire break effect of the half term week off would get things back to normal. Well, they've been back for 3 days and now the school has announced year group closures starting again today (Thursday).

Obviously, I can understand the school's predicament, but if it carries on like this it's going to be pretty detrimental to their education. Yet I've not heard of any other schools in the area suffering like this, and covid cases are broadly similar. So why is our school getting absolutely hammered?

There's been little in the local or national media about it. Is this a common thing, happening all over the UK and just being kept quiet?

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Ruffledcardigan · 04/11/2021 15:58

The teachers are probably off with covid. Some genuine, some not. The school has probably spent their supply budget or not will to spend further cash on supply.

Ruffledcardigan · 04/11/2021 15:59

Willing

SirensofTitan · 04/11/2021 16:04

@Ruffledcardigan

The teachers are probably off with covid. Some genuine, some not. The school has probably spent their supply budget or not will to spend further cash on supply.
What does not genuine covid mean? A wrong test result or faking the documentation of the result?

Like everything with covid there's no overall experience. My DCs secondary hasn't closed and I know that it hasn't happened in any of my teachers friends schools but that's what I'd expect tbh

Ruffledcardigan · 04/11/2021 16:51

...

SirensofTitan · 04/11/2021 17:19

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flumposie · 04/11/2021 17:41

We are open, but as teachers we are having to do a lot of emergency cover for staff off ill. I was given cover today as the supply agency somehow let the school down ( that's the message I got). There is currently a bill being pushed through to ensure schools don't close again. What MPs seem to forget is teachers are still getting ill and schools might have to close partly if there isn't enough staff. They don't really seem to get the concept of 1 teacher to 30 pupils.

PrincessNutNuts · 04/11/2021 17:41

We're in an area of comparatively lower cases but a large proportion of those cases are in the unvaccinated population I.e: school age children.

Children are sent in to school even when there is covid at home.

Home aren't notified that there is covid at school.

So inevitably vaccinated teachers catch a huge viral load and are off sick for weeks, and the school can't always get a supply in.

Welcome to "Living with covid" and take it up with your government.

This is all a result of their policies.

And it's probably coming to a school near the rest of us soon.

Ruffledcardigan · 04/11/2021 17:42

@SirensofTitan

It depends if their SLT treat them like babies or not. I work for a MH charity and we absolutely don’t need to send in the test result to management. I guess we are treated like adults.

PrincessNutNuts · 04/11/2021 17:43

Where does test and trace fit in to all this pretending you've got covid?

flumposie · 04/11/2021 17:43

I'll also add we have some staff signed off due to stress. A mixture of the shit show that has been the handling of schools and covid, plus micro management from slt.

CallmeHendricks · 04/11/2021 17:44

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Ruffledcardigan · 04/11/2021 17:46

@PrincessNutNuts

Well it doesn’t obviously. @flumposie yes sounds about right. Teachers off with stress. Schools absolutely are heading for a catastrophe but it’s not all covid related. It’s the general culture and micromanagement. Fingers crossed government actually do wake up to what’s actually going on within schools.

Ruffledcardigan · 04/11/2021 17:47

@CallmeHendricks

I will choose to be good friends with her and I applaud her for putting her own MH first. The fact that she felt she had to lie says more about the system she works in but you crack on.

walksen · 04/11/2021 17:47

"The teachers are probably off with covid. Some genuine, some not"

Pretty outrageous comment tbh.

Ruffledcardigan · 04/11/2021 17:48

@walksen

Why?

walksen · 04/11/2021 17:52

Because you are implying that teachers are taking having covid for time off. Not an accusation I've ever seen made for healthcare workers etc. Most teachers I've ever known routinely work when Ill.

Right now teachers are one of the highest risk occupations for infection.

Secondly I don't see how you can fake a 10 day covid absence when you can only self certify for 5 days.

CallmeHendricks · 04/11/2021 17:53

That your friend is a liar reflects badly only on her (and you, actually), not the rest of the teaching profession who are renowned for crawling in on their hands and knees when ill. Covid has meant that we can't do that, as it's a notifiable illness.
But, it's always good to see the teacher bashers back.

Piggywaspushed · 04/11/2021 18:02

The only person I know who lied about Covid was a 17 year old girl. Then a few weeks later she actually did get it. Any adult would know that could happen and that you would a)look stupid and b)be in serious trouble.

FYI ruffled teachers are amongst the best attenders of any workers. To the extent that many are currently coming into school , ill with covid symptoms.

Jenster03 · 04/11/2021 18:08

I am a teacher in a primary school and it's rough at the moment. At one point we had a good third of the staff off sick with covid. One was off for weeks.
Yes it's happening all over. Not everywhere, but it will happen everywhere at some point.

Sprostongreen21 · 04/11/2021 18:22

They won’t be closing for no reason. It must not be feasible to operate normally.

My sister works in a school and it’s awful. They’ve had staff off with covid and it’s not always just ten days off some have longer covid symptoms, they have staff off with other illnesses and also mental health issues like stress and anxiety.
They can’t get supply staff easily or there is no money for what they need. It’s really not good.
This is primary.

theemperorhasnoclothes · 04/11/2021 18:28

The thing is it doesn't matter what the local rate is, it matters what the rate in school is. And as schools are indoor environments with no mitigations, they've had higher rates of covid since September than everywhere else (it's the perfect environment for covid to spread).

Prof Christina Pagel said recently we have two epidemics in the UK - the one among school aged kids and their parents, which is rampaging, and the one among everyone else which is declining.

Secondly, viral load matters. We learned this at the start of the epidemic. With no masks, kids mixing, moving classrooms (in secondary) teachers will be exposed to crazy high amounts of virus and this leads to more severe illness. So they're more likely to be off for longer.

CallmeHendricks · 04/11/2021 18:31

[quote Ruffledcardigan]@CallmeHendricks

I will choose to be good friends with her and I applaud her for putting her own MH first. The fact that she felt she had to lie says more about the system she works in but you crack on.[/quote]
But that wasn't the point you were making, applauding her taking action.
You were taking a pop at the teaching profession, accusing many of lying about being ill with Covid because that's what your friend did.

Don't try to take the moral high ground now!

theemperorhasnoclothes · 04/11/2021 18:53

@flumposie

We are open, but as teachers we are having to do a lot of emergency cover for staff off ill. I was given cover today as the supply agency somehow let the school down ( that's the message I got). There is currently a bill being pushed through to ensure schools don't close again. What MPs seem to forget is teachers are still getting ill and schools might have to close partly if there isn't enough staff. They don't really seem to get the concept of 1 teacher to 30 pupils.
The 'you can't close no matter what' is a bit like saying that hospitals 'must reduce wait times of ambulances before handing over to A&E' like just pronouncing this shall be so will make it so without any extra funding or provision of means to make this happen.

This is what you get when you have public school boys in charge. No idea of reality.

The next thing they will do is say 'we have a law that says no schools are closed therefore no schools are closed' but schools will still be closed because there won't be enough staff to operate safely. It's getting more Orwellian by the day.

FindingMeno · 04/11/2021 18:56

Cover teachers for lower years and lessons being cancelled for 6th form, but all still in school.

altmember · 04/11/2021 23:15

@Ruffledcardigan

The teachers are probably off with covid. Some genuine, some not. The school has probably spent their supply budget or not will to spend further cash on supply.
This is kind of what I was getting at. The school said they just can't get supply teachers at the moment (which I can fully understand - they must be in incredibly high demand and low supply - who the hell would want to be a supply teacher right now?)

I sympathise entirely with teachers, they've effectively been dumped in the frontline trenches with no weapons to defend themselves with. Any moron (except the goverment ones, apparently) could see months ago exactly how this was going to unravel in schools. It does seem to be a deliberate policy to go for herd immunity by transmission through school kids. I can't believe even Boris is this incompetent.

We had systems in place (bubbles, household contacts isolating etc) that seemed to be holding back the spread last year. I can't understand why they were dumped at the start of this school year. Particularly where I am - in a county that was put into 'special measures' in August because of soaring covid cases. All that did was request masks be worn in communal areas, but the school openly admitted that they can't even enforce that, just ask nicely.

But I do wonder how 1/3rd of the teachers are off sick. Statistically at least some of them (hopefully the vast majority/all) have been vaccinated, so that should give them a bit more protection than the pupils, none of whom have been vaccinated (until last week). So you'd think there would be at least 1/3rd of the pupils off sick as well. Except there aren't. Yes there is quite high sickness rate, but probably only 1/6th from what I'm hearing.

So I do wonder how many teachers are off with stress (again, not that surprising really), or if there's even a varying attitude between teachers school to school - and some schools just have a far higher staff sickness rate? Is it a case of a few teachers go off sick/into isolation and then a bunch of others think, "fuck this, I'm calling in sick for a few days too."

By complete coincidence, I was talking to a friend who's a head of a small primary school this evening. He said they've hardly had any cases of covid in school, but worryingly high numbers in the wider community. So today he's decided to reintroduce bubbles in the school. He also said he's had two staff members off with covid back in Sept/Oct, but he strongly suspects they didn't actually have it and were just skiving off. I don't know exactly why he thinks that, but clearly has his reasons. He said he's not allowed to request proof of infection from the school staff.

The thing is it doesn't matter what the local rate is, it matters what the rate in school is.
Obviously it does matter what the local rate is, because the pupils at the local schools who are going down with covid are going to counted in the local case numbers. And we know (in the most recent data I've seen anyway), that about 50% of current cases are in secondary school age kids.

Oh, and the take up rate for vaccinations in school kids seems disappointingly low - my daughter is the only kid in her class who's been vaccinated. Sounds like a lot of them aren't intending to be either. They also had the HPV vaccinations last month, my daughter just told me only 5 kids in her class took that one up. What the fuck is wrong with people? Covid vaccine suspicion/antivaxers I can somewhat understand, but to not have the HPV vaccine seems like stupidity. I wonder if a lot of it is down to the kids being given a choice? "Would you like us to stick one of these needles in your arm, or would you like to skip this one?" I can imagine most 12 year olds declining the offer. I remember when we were kids and they did TB vaccinations at school. You didn't get a choice, line up and get a bloody shot. I reckon if a kid had refused they'd probably have just pinned them down and jabbed them anyway! Grin

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