NHS Nightingale Harrogate closes

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Nightingale Harrogate, which was opened by Captain Tom Moore just last week, has now been closed due to a lack of patients. Staff that had been seconded to work there have been sent back to their usual workplaces and told that they will not be needed for at least a fortnight, and thereafter will be given at least 4 days notice if the hospital is to re-open. Capacity in the major ICUs in the region is still well over demand with around 20-25% of critical care beds empty, following the expansion of beds last month.

In England & Wales there are three main hotspots, which are London, Manchester/Liverpool, and Birmingham Urban area. There are also warm spots in the Lake District, Middlesbrough, Cardiff, Gosport and others.

I don't think city of Manchester is anymore of a hotspot than Leeds and possibly lower in the numbers than Leeds. Probably because it's a smaller city by population.

Greater Manchester is a county similar to West Yorkshire and they both have similar populations and similar numbers of virus cases.

The Nightingale hospitals were built to deliver services to densely populated urban areas. Nightingale Harrogate is in N Yorks but is catering to Leeds.

I'm not sure this is true. I think it was likely to be for the North East region in general.

West Yorkshire/Leeds is very close to Greater Manchester, WY and GM share a border, and so many from WY could have easily accessed the Nightingale in Manchester. It's only just down the M62 and some large populations in West Yorks will be closer to Manchester than to Harrogate.

Maybe the Harrogate one would have been a kind of over spill for the whole north east?

The others are Manchester, Glasgow, Birmingham and London.

Sheffield was the city just behind Birmingham as a hotspot. Infact both Birmingham and Sheffield were often ahead of London in virus cases by capita of population

Each the largest urban areas in Britain

Did you mean the county of Greater Manchester or the city?

So the pandemic never reaches severe levels in Yorkshire.

West Yorks and South Yorks, by far the most populated parts of Yorkshire, are at about the same levels as Greater Manchester & the West Midlands.

All metropolitan counties of similar populations. Especially Greater Manc and West Yorks (a kind of 'Greater Leeds' I suppose).

Brilliant news.

Infact both Birmingham and Sheffield were often ahead of London in virus cases by capita of population

What are you basing this on?

I mean you do realise that infection data is virtually useless and unlikely to be comparable across regions due to different testing and that it's completely implausible that Sheffield had anything like the coronavirus cases of London per capita, with the two large Sheffield hospitals with total 2000 beds having a similar number of deaths to Kingston hospital which is in the least hit district of London and has only 500 beds.

It is just not possible to be true.

Sheffield has a specialist ID unit that started testing its NHS workforce pre lockdown. The local ICU, with standard up scaling that happened in all trusts, has met the demands in the city.

West Yorkshire/Leeds is very close to Greater Manchester, WY and GM share a border, and so many from WY could have easily accessed the Nightingale in Manchester. It's only just down the M62 and some large populations in West Yorks will be closer to Manchester than to Harrogate.
Maybe the Harrogate one would have been a kind of over spill for the whole north east?

Why I agree Harrogate isn't near for lots of Leeds areas.

The Manchester Nightingale is not a short distance, or easily accessible.

I live in Leeds, boarding Wakefield, Right next to the M62. If I wanted to drive the GMEX right now it was take at least an hour.

How many people could drive there with someone very ill, struggling to breathe, in their car. If an ambulance is used that's another ambulance taken up for 2 hours, probably more.

I am very surprised Leeds Centre doesn't have one. But the Manchester one at the GMEX is not as easy to get to, just because our counties boarder each other.

My dad work for the NHS is Wakefield. They have no idea which they would use. If it came to it. Because bother are far away and will use resources to transport

What are you basing this on?

The timelines, but this is by capita, but at one point Birmingham was even ahead not by capita. Though that was early on if I remember correctly

But yes London has been very badly hit as well.

London, West Midlands, West and South Yorks, Greater Manchster and Merseyside I think are the hot spots

Though London, with a population of 8 million, is different to everywhere else. But it would be interesting to compare an urban number with a similar population. So you could put the West Midlands, Greater Manchester and West Yorkshire all in one group. Which would be total about the same pop as London?. Then compare the 2 groups

The Manchester Nightingale is not a short distance, or easily accessible

It is for places like Bradford (similar by pop to Man city), Huddersfield, Halifax.

Especially when the roads are quiet. Manchester city centre could easily be reached in half an hour

How many people could drive there with someone very ill, struggling to breathe, in their car

But is this how it would have worked anyway. I would have thought most of the ones going into the Nightingales would have been sent on from other hospitals?

Flaxmeadow

For most of West Yorkshire/Leeds (which is what you stated) the GMEX isn't half an hour away. Sorry, but that's wrong.

More and more people are going back to work now, so quiet roads can be bet. Driving from here to Manchester centre can take an hour or it can take 2. No need for accidents, just busy roads.

Manchester isn't not accessible.

I addressed the point about being transfer from another hospital. Ambulances are already struggling by all accounts. Driving up and down the m62 in unpredictable traffic isn't a quick run.

If they are wanting to keep covid patient's of main hospitals, the people may be sent straight there. Depends on how it pans out.

But the point is, I can promise you, betting you can get to Manchester in half an hour, from anywhere in WY isn't realistic.

If only they could use the Nightingale hospitals for COVID only unfortunately you don't know immediately if someone has Covid - it's such a shame.

Sheffield has a specialist ID unit that started testing its NHS workforce pre lockdown. The local ICU, with standard up scaling that happened in all trusts, has met the demands in the city

The ICUs and hospitals won't save care home residents any more than they save flu patients over winter. Sheffield care home deaths are elevated by less than London care home deaths.

Positive case results don't mean much without knowing:

• Proportion testing negative
• Who is being tested - random or sick people/NHS test staff only

Death results are more useful but are delayed.

I think (hope) that they have been built to absorb the rise in numbers that will occur later in the year into the winter when the NHS is usually pressed to full capacity and will need extra with any winter resurgance of Covid.
At least I hope they are. Our local leisure centre has pulled up the ice rink, indoor skate part and a sports hall and converted them into hospital wards. As yet, no news about them taking any patients and all the news in the briefings was that we are below 70% capacity so won't need it.

That's a lot of expense and upheaval if it's not to be used.

Why on earth are you complaining? I am very pleased that patients aren't being left to die in hospital corridors.

For most of West Yorkshire/Leeds (which is what you stated)

I didn't state that.

I actually said

" ..and so many from WY could have easily accessed the Nightingale in Manchester "

But the point is, I can promise you, betting you can get to Manchester in half an hour, from anywhere in WY isn't realistic

I used to travel from Manchester into west Yorkshire everyday and it absolutely is possible. Even before the lockdown

Are you from the north of England?

...and if people think Manchester is hard to drive through, they have never driven through Leeds

We have reached a peak, but it's a false peak created because the public and many businesses have complied with, and gone beyond the government's instructions.

I do not believe they expected the public to comply in the way they have. They clearly didn't expect so many businesses to close, hence why the Furlough scheme has is being used to support about three times the number of workers they expected to use it.

These Nightingale hospitals were there in case things didn't work out as they have. In the early days we heard about there possibly being a need for doctors to decide who got the ventilators when ICU was over flowing. Thank goodness that hasn't happened (yet).

Wonder if I'll get my colposcopy now, my dad is almost blind, fairly suddenly and needs seeing urgently and my daughter should've seen a consultant this week but I've been told probably August! I've lost my grandad to this virus, it's no joke but is everyone else being left to rot???

Worriedmama the health service now has to work out how to safely manage, assess and treat COVID patients alongside non COVID patients.
This virus isn’t going to go away but contrary to what you read on MN with it’s cacophony of anti NHS sentiment, the NHS has already started this process. Clinics, assessments, red flag referrals and multi disciplinary meetings are up and running. And hopefully you will be seen soon.

Seriously? Well there's no talk of it locally (I live in Harrogate)

Why I agree Harrogate isn't near for lots of Leeds areas.

On a typical Saturday morning (low traffic but not as low as now) I can get from Harrogate Town Centre to Leeds City Centre in under 30 minutes. It is about 17 miles.

I can get to Doncaster town centre in an hour.

The Harrogate conference centre is owned by the council (unlike many centres). It has been under used since the economic downturn 10 years ago. Unless it has changed recently parts of it are mothballed/rarely used. There used to be enormous conferences every week but the really big events are rare now and it is an enormous building, the 2nd largest venue outside London (I seem to recall). They submitted plans for a revamp last year but I don't think that has gone ahead yet.

I understood that Nightingale patients would be transferring in from other hospitals. So people would go to their local hospital (or the nearest with a bed) first.

Lemon blast, I've nothing but admiration for the nhs. The service I've received in the past has been absolutely outstanding, I'm worried about where we are going forward. Scary times.

Clinics, assessments, red flag referrals and multi disciplinary meetings are up and running.

Not in Leeds they're not. Only red flag/fast track. No routine clinics or MDT meetings