Coronavirus, gardens, 'sunbathing' etc.

[ShootsFruitAndLeaves]

You can legally sunbathe in your private garden all day long. But some people don't have gardens.

There are people complaining on social media to the police about people sunbathing on municipal land. Not large numbers of people, literally two people enjoying the sunshine and minding their own business. There are people replying that they will go out and assault them, etc.

There is in fact no law against sunbathing. It just seems to be bringing out the neighbourhood arseholes to try to enforce non-existent rules. Nobody is going to die because someone went out to the shop and decided to stop to sunbathe on a 16 acre meadow on the way home. Nobody. The 'but 1000 people died today' stuff is not related to that. Keep to your own household, don't mix with other people, don't leave home without a reasonable excuse.

[Frankiecandle]

How many on here don't have a garden?

[Frankiecandle]

Do you have a garden @Bearbehind?

[Bearbehind]

How many on here don't have a garden?

It doesn’t matter if you have a garden or not.

Those without gardens live in the most built up areas which are at highest risk

This really isn’t rocket science

[HainaultViaNewburyPark]

The word “essential” is not used in Regulation 6(1) at all. Parliament could have chosen to include it (it appears in Regulation 7 on gatherings), but they didn’t.

As I am neither a relevant person or a judge, it is irrelevant whether or not I think sunbathing is permitted under Regulation 6(1). The converse is also true - it is irrelevant whether or not you think sunbathing is prohibited (unless you happen to be a relevant person or a judge).

Incidentally, there is a further check on the power of the relevant person included in the law:

(8) A relevant person may only exercise the power in paragraph (3), (5) or (6) if the relevant person considers that it is a necessary and proportionate means of ensuring compliance with the requirement.

It would be very interesting to know where a judge would draw the line on “necessary and proportionate”

[Bearbehind]

hainault were you the woman on that bench in London, wasting police time and quoting the law?

Do you really think arguing the toss about the rules is the best use of resource right now?

[Frankiecandle]

Oh but it does matter if you have a garden.

[Frankiecandle]

You sit there in your bloody garden judging people who want a bit of sun. The people who live in built up areas should not have to bear the brunt of this.

[Bearbehind]

frankie how does it matter?

What is the alternative?

If you live in a built up area with no garden, how is letting everyone go and sunbathe in built up areas going to prevent deaths from this shitty virus?

[notchickenagain]

Why the fuck do people keep trying to find 'loopholes' all the time! Stay at home!! Yes, you might sunbathe in the park and there will be nobody there but if someone sees you doing it they think well if THEY'RE doing it then I'M doing it, that's the mentality of a lot of ignorant folk. Before you know it the whole town is in the park sitting around, playing footie, on the swings etc.
It's like the first week was ok, but now it's boring and people are not obeying rules! It will get worse! So fucking what if there are cars on the road, don't think well I'M not fucking sitting in my flat if THEY'RE out in their car! Aargh! Don't people WANT to keep themselves safe??
The shops are a joke. Lovely distancing outside with staff managing and as soon as there's no one telling the idiots what to do inside they are shoving and getting in your face because you are standing in the aisle where THEY want to be and can't wait 2 seconds for you to move.
I could go on but I think I'm about to explode....

[Bearbehind]

The people who live in built up areas should not have to bear the brunt of this.

But, by definition, they have to because there’s less space for all

[ShootsFruitAndLeaves]

"The ‘excuses’ are essential"

Are you on a loop?

There is a long list of excuses many non essential.

"including from any business listed in Part 3 of Schedule 2;"

PART 3
25. Off licenses and licensed shops selling alcohol (including breweries).
27. Newsagents.

These places do not sell anything that is 'essential'.

The definition of 'reasonable excuse' needs to.be interpreted within the context that this is not a total lockdown, and you can still go to your non-essential job, you can still go to the brewery, you can still do exercise, etc.

It is in no way clear to me that it is less reasonable for John to take his bicycle out of his garage and go ride it, than it is for Fred to go out of his flat and sunbathe on a local field. Neither activity is 'essential', but both are sensible and likely to be beneficial to both parties well-being. If Fred has no access to a private garden, it would seem that he has in fact a very good argument that he has a 'reasonable excuse' to do this.

It seems that there is some sort of masochistic element running through society.

[Bearbehind]

It seems that there is some sort of masochistic element running through society.

Indeed - it’s the fuckers who can’t actually stay at home when they’re told to

[Frankiecandle]

The people who live in built up areas are probably the very people who are going to work in low paid jobs , so you can sit on your patio and drink fucking pimms in the sun.

[Bearbehind]

frankie, how is that helping?

If you live in a built up area you are at higher risk so need to stay in more

For what it’s worth I have a tiny garden that I don’t use so it’s not about ‘I’m alright a Jack’, it’s about common fucking sense

[HainaultViaNewburyPark]

I am arguing that the law should be upheld. The current law represents a very significant curtailment of the liberties normally enjoyed in the UK. Therefore it is essential that we respect what the says - but it is equally important that we don’t go beyond what it says. If you make life intolerable under lockdown, then people will rebel and stop even trying to follow the rules.

The police already have the right under the existing law to question any sunbathers they might come across and send them home if they deem that to be an appropriate action. This is right and proper and in accordance with the law. I have no problem with that at all. But I will not take it upon myself to judge or police anyone who is sunbathing well away from other people.

[Frankiecandle]

No, it's about 'I'm alright Jack'

No one on this thread has admitted to not having a garden.

[7Days]

Do you think the virus cares whether you drink pimms or white lightning Frankie?
If you are out and about you increase the chances of spread.
That is it, no ifs or buts. Just the scientific fact of the matter

[Hopefulmidwife]

@Frankiecandle I admitted to not having a garden and living in a flat

[Bearbehind]

No one on this thread has admitted to not having a garden

Again, I’ll ask - what is the alternative?

No one can magic you a garden

Do you think everyone without a garden should just crack on as usual and spread this virus to all they meet?

[Bearbehind]

The current law represents a very significant curtailment of the liberties normally enjoyed in the UK.

You have far less liberties if this bastard virus kills you - get a fucking grip

[Frankiecandle]

It's the poors fault as per.

The rich get to sit on the patio. The poor get to stare at 4 walls, unless they are working in the supermarkets to keep the rich in online shopping.

[HainaultViaNewburyPark]

I’m happy to admit that I do have a garden. But I would also like to state for the record that I have not been sunbathing in the park. In fact I’m doing my best to avoid the park. There are many people in my area who live in the high rise flats I can see from my window. They need that space more than I do, so it seems prudent not to go there.

[Littleposh]

I think the biggest dickhead in this whole scenario is clear for all to see . . .

[Bearbehind]

It's the poors fault as per.

It’s not about the poor - there’s plenty of very rich people in apartments without gardens

WTF is the alternative frankie?

What do you actually think could be done differently?

[Bearbehind]

I think the biggest dickhead in this whole scenario is clear for all to see

If that’s aimed at me, could you answer my question about what could be done differently then?