Can my kids go to the park or not?

[NeedANewJob19]

I have name changed for this and prepared to be flamed.

My teenage DSs (13 and 16) have been going to the park near our house for one hour each day this week. They go together, they don’t meet up with anyone and they avoid other people using the park. They don’t go to the playground part, they just take a football and have a kick around together just the two of them. I was under the impression that this was ok.
Someone on my Facebook posted a picture yesterday if a group of kids at the same park and I could see my two in the background of the photo. No where near the kids featured just way in the background. This person wouldn’t know my kids. Everyone was commenting about how irresponsible this was and berating the parents, I daren’t comment on it but wanted to check opinions on here. I was assuming they were so angry because it was group of kids presumably not from the same household but now I’m not sure I should be letting my kids do what they’ve been doing

Larrygrylls

I agree...but if you want to stop some kids playing football on the basis that other kids might join in and it might become crowded

I said unthread I don't think OPs kids should be stopped from playing football between themselves. If they're not flouting SD law, they're fine. Same goes for runners.

It's the flouting of SD law that's the problem. Not the running. Not the football. The blatant flouting of law.

What about the people who go for a walk in the park but can't because their is a group of kids playing football? A 'kick about' takes up quite a lot of space.

What about when other kids see them playing and decide its also ok to have a game of football at the park because others are doing it.

The reason we now have these rules is because lots of people all went to large open spaces just for family 'exercise'. If you can play football, then why cant you sunbath on the beech, go for a walk up a mountain, visit a national heritage site or have family BBQs at the park. And then the lockdown breaks down.

Stop being a Covidiot and stop letting your children out unsupervised to play games at the park.

He said that people should be defining exercise as “one walk, one run or one cycle per day”.”

He also said families couldn't transport children for contact with the other parent.

He also said people should vote for Brexit.

He also said people had had enough of experts

Fortunately we are governed by the rule of the actual Law and not the braindead witterings of the Minister for Backstabbing.

I'm curious - how many of the posters so terribly keen on restricting the definition of the daily exercise for other people and their DC are themselves living in overcrowded housing with no garden?

Agree with PP - around here its runners who are the problem in terms of social distancing.

I ran for 40 minutes this am and due to the increase in others now running I had to (safely) step on the road, cross the road, step onto drives, jump in bushes several times to avoid other runners/dog walkers/walkers. So pavements are getting quite congested these days which is inevitable so if people can be creative with their exercise whilst observing rules it seems sensible to me?

Side note to other pavement users, if someone stops and clearly moves out of the way to allow you to pass safely with distance it wouldn't kill you to at least acknowledge it, especially as you evidently had no intention of moving out of their way . Rude twat

I agree @ZombieFan. We need to be considerate of the space we use up when we do leave our homes.

I can’t really see the problem so long as you can trust them 100% to stay away from friends etc. We have a local park that sounds similar to yours and when I walked past earlier today there was a boy having a kick about with his dad. They were well away from other people and not causing any trouble. I don’t think anyone would object to this. I imagine people don’t like your boys doing similar because they don’t trust teenagers to make sensible decisions.

It is their once a day exercise so I would say yes it's OK as long as they only do it with each other. Make sure they wash their hands carefully when they get back in.

"The rules are quite simple to understand,walk run or cycle as close to home as possible,no ball games or playing out."

If you could point out exactly where ball games or playing out are prohibited, that would be grand.

Thanks in advance.

'Define a group though. Individuals all staying 2 metres apart - are they a group? In which case individuals walking, two metres apart are a group then.'

I think the definition of group goes to organisation and prior knowledge of those people.

So, a yoga instructor and her class in the park...that's a group.

Five people who don't know each other who just happen to be in the park at the same time...not a group.

The difference is that in an organised group or with friends you are much more likely to break the social distancing rules. The temptation to drift nearer is too high.

Also, remember that 2 metres is a minimum not a target.

If you go to the park and see a stranger doing yoga, you're not going to go 2 metres away and start doing yoga. You're going to move away further and find an area with more space.

In a class scenario, you're leaving 2 metres as a maximum so you can all chat/see and hear the teacher.

I hope that helps.

This is the sort of thing where common sense comes into play. The fact that you can't see the difference means your common sense may be being affected at the moment, probably by the stress of the current situation.

As you say, you're staying in anyway, so it doesn't really matter that you don't understand groups vs individuals. Just hope that the people who are outside have a better understanding!

playing football is not a necessity. It's exercise. Does it sound like it's too much fun for your liking and fun must be stopped?

Yep. You’ve all gone nuts.

The virus does not have little wings.

Nor can it attack you alone. It needs a lot of its friends around.

In the open air keep a few metres away.

From the way you describe what your children do in the park, it sounds fine - they shouldn't sit on benches but they probably know that. You're lucky to have a park still open. I've no idea if any parks near me are open, I'm staying indoors but we have woods and ponds down the road which I imagine would get a bit crowded (near to shops), except for first thing and late.

My cousin has a nice, not very big park at the top of her road and it's closed so you are fortunate, make the most of it, sensibly.

@lamamoleinthegarden please could you post that on every thread..?

Ffs people need to educate them selves about vital transmission and stop being ridiculous.

Public health rules are made for the majority. The density of towns and cities are breeding grounds for viral transmission. The incidents of someone coughing or sneezing droplets on you to transmit a virus are pretty low compared with someone TOUCHING the virus on a surface. Think about it logically. ! How many times do you get sneezed or coughed on compared with how many times you TOUCH something?

This is why the hand washing message is SO important.

In densely populated areas touching things once you leave the house is a way you spread. Then there are more people to touch shop doors, lampposts , zebra crossing controls ets..

This is why the play equipment is out of bounds..

This is why football with people outside your household is out of bounds.. someone could pick up the ball and transmit the virus. .

BUT if you go to the park with your OWN football with members of your OWN household it is absolutely fine. And NO different to having a run or a walk.

In rural areas it's even easier. 'Can I drive 5 miles to walk in the forest ?' OF COURSE YOU CAN if it's your car, with only members of your household. and you don't touch anything there or back.

Best of all wear gloves if you can get hold of plastic ones and chuck them in your dustbin before entering the house.

Just be sensible and remember TOUCH above all is the contamination mechanism.

You might trust your children - but do you trust everyone else's ? I'd go with them tbh.

No, the can go for a walk but not 'play' in the park.

Our parks are closed anyway.

Fucks sake. Why are idiots still talking about groups of children playing football?

Its 2 siblings kicking a ball to each other.

And heres another. Of course you can play in a park so long as you observe social distancing.

On this thread so far we've had people claiming you can only walk, cycle or run as exercise, not sit down in a park or not use a park at all and now no play?

People need to get a grip and some sense.

I think the definition of group goes to organisation and prior knowledge of those people.

The government has introduced three new measures.

1. Requiring people to stay at home, except for very limited purposes.
2. Closing certain businesses and venues.
3. Stopping all gatherings of more than two people in public.

www.gov.uk/government/publications/full-guidance-on-staying-at-home-and-away-from-others/full-guidance-on-staying-at-home-and-away-from-others

I think people are confusing/confused by 1 and 3.

3 means no gathering of more than 2 people not from the same household. A gathering doesn’t have to be pre-arranged, it can be spontaneous if a bunch of people come to the same place and start interacting (that’s not stated in the guidelines, it’s just what the word means).

Rule 1 has the exception for exercise and the 2m rule. So under rule 1 you can go out for exercise with members of your household but you must keep more than 2m from anyone else.

Key point is that the 2m rule isn’t part of rule 3. It doesn’t say you can gather if there’s more than 2m between you. It’s no gathering of more than 2 people of different households, full stop.

So in the case of the spontaneous yoga group, it’s not allowed because even if they didn’t plan to, once they start interacting together eg synchronising their yoga or following a leader, they have become a gathering which isn’t allowed, regardless of how far apart their mats are.

I think if they were entirely individual yogis who turned up by coincidence and started doing their own thing 2m apart without reference to each other it’s technically ok, but I hope a few would feel the Park was a bit too crowded and look for another place or time. And if it so happened that they coincidentally knew each other they really are best advised to do that, because if they were arrested for gathering it could be hard to prove they weren’t.

It's nonsense to suggest they can't go to the park by themselves and play football. The danger is other kids will join in.

I think the play confusion has come from play equipment use being off limits

Of course they can OP, it'll do them good.
Although, if your park is anything like ours they are much more at risk of contracting something horrible from dogshit than getting or spreading covid19.
I agree with a pp on this too-if you really think your older kids can't be trusted to behave responsibly, not get within 2 metres of others and not touch anything, then it's your parenting you want to be looking at.
I really fucking hope the crazies don't get the parks shut down. Many many children DO NOT HAVE GARDENS and often those are the same children who live in small and overcrowded flats, so punishing them for going outside safely is really nasty.

Exercise is anything that raises your heart rate, I would say football is exercise (allowed). I do not see anything in the guidelines which tells you what exercise you are allowed to do! They are from the same household (allowed). They were keeping with the social distancing rule in the photo (allowed). However they are teenagers and people like to judge and thing all teens are the same, they are not. I would go with them to protect them from being flamed just for being in the park. This way when the judgementals include your children in the same sweeping statements of 'who was flouting the rules' you will be there to know what is fact and what is not. They sound very responsible. You sound very reasonable. Anyway I see people of all ages jogging every single day. Isn't football just jogging but kicking a ball at the same time.

Well, this has been illuminating, it's certainly a treat to see posters straying out of their regular posting boards and proving that they're as obstinate (even in the face of expert and legal references) in the wilds of Mumsnet as in their own enclosure. I now know who never to bother engaging with in reasoned debate in the future. So, silver linings!

This might clarify things:

Deputy Chief Constable Sara Glen, the NPCC lead for charging and out of court disposals, admitted that police are effectively powerless to stop people from exercising more than once a day.

She said: “There is nothing in the legislation that talks about once a day exercise. It talks about exercise only with a household member.”

She added: “The law doesn’t say once a day. The law doesn’t specify what that type of activity might be. Many people need to be out in the fresh air. We can’t specify what that exercise should be.”

She said: “Can anyone get in their car and drive to an area? These are unprecedented times. We don’t want everyone driving to the same area to do their exercise.

“All we are saying is exercise on your own or with other household members, not where there are other people.”

She added: “The messaging that’s gone out is like ‘you can’t go outside or exercise or walk your dog’, which is wrong. You can go outside and exercise, you can walk your dog, you can do it with members of your household.”